Israeli "Operation Cloud Pillar" 2012

[Socialist EU]

He is a statist social democrat from what I can tell.

I know, I was just making a joke on it seeing as he wants to start up a business and is coming here on an entrepreneurial grant

Ok, if that is really the case, then petty bourgeois would be the correct definition of his class.

[Souseiseki]

I doubt that the Gazans have as many airstrikes happen to them then Israelis have rocket and bomb attacks, else there would be a lot more news coming from Gaze

http://i.imgur.com/HGex2.jpg

compare israelis killed vs gazans killed

http://i.imgur.com/J2oYW.jpg

actually, just look at this

seriously

[Saruhan]

http://i.imgur.com/HGex2.jpg

compare israelis killed vs gazans killed

Who's the poodle suppose to represent? NATO?

And is it bad that I thought the israeli coffins were money rolls at first?

[Souseiseki]

http://i.imgur.com/HGex2.jpg

compare israelis killed vs gazans killed

Who's the poodle suppose to represent? NATO?

it's tony blair~!

[Sulamalik]

Who's the poodle suppose to represent? NATO?

And is it bad that I thought the israeli coffins were money rolls at first?

No, I thought the Palestinian ones were breath mints.

[Seperates]

Where else would they have their war zone? The fact of the matter is that there are no rules to warfare, and quite honestly neither side really cares about civilian casualties, no matter what they say.

There are plenty of rules to warfare. Both sides do care about civilian casualties. how and to what degree they care may be different, but they do care.

No, there is only the illusion of rules. The soldiers on both sides care. The generals do not.

[Ethel mermania]

I doubt that the Gazans have as many airstrikes happen to them then Israelis have rocket and bomb attacks, else there would be a lot more news coming from Gaze

http://i.imgur.com/HGex2.jpg

compare israelis killed vs gazans killed

the israelies are more accurate. hamas until these last few days shot way more rockets at israel than took in receiving fire. Body count is not the determining factor on right or wrong. The one in the wrong is who shot first, and that would be hamas. So we will go back to the "karma is a bitch" theory. you dont want to be killed dont try and kill anybody.

[Socialist EU]

I disafuckinggree. Do not presume to tell me I don't care about civilian casualties.

Where else would you have them fight? This isn't the 1800's where soldiers stand out the open battlefield and fire at each other in deathrow lines.
I am talking about the people in charge. Individual soldiers care about civilian casualties, but the higher-ups only care about the PR fallout that may accompany it, not the act itself.

If they cared about civilian casualties, they wouldn't have a war in the first place. On either side. The simple fact of the matter is that through warfare or missile strikes or whatever they choose, they are going to cause civilian casualties. It is inevitable.

^Sad, but true^

[The Emerald Dawn]

I disafuckinggree. Do not presume to tell me I don't care about civilian casualties.

Where else would you have them fight? This isn't the 1800's where soldiers stand out the open battlefield and fire at each other in deathrow lines.
I am talking about the people in charge. Individual soldiers care about civilian casualties, but the higher-ups only care about the PR fallout that may accompany it, not the act itself.

If they cared about civilian casualties, they wouldn't have a war in the first place. On either side. The simple fact of the matter is that through warfare or missile strikes or whatever they choose, they are going to cause civilian casualties. It is inevitable.

The people in charge of every Op I went out on pounded into our heads the LOAC, ROW, GC regarding treatment of POW, and ROE. I've seen four stars cry about the fact that a civilian was killed on an Op gone screwball. You need to readjust your perspective, because while I may have become cynical, I don't make sweeping generalizations about people I've never met and only know about through the media.

[Saruhan]

http://i.imgur.com/HGex2.jpg

compare israelis killed vs gazans killed

http://i.imgur.com/J2oYW.jpg

actually, just look at this

seriously

Well, I would hope guided missiles and aircraft were better at killing then shitty rockets

[Potlimitomaha]

Panetta doesn't want Iraq to be wiped off the face of the earth. That's what Ahmed Said Khalil al-Jabari believed should happen to Israel.

I'm so sick of hearing what people here "want." Oh, "Israel wants peace," "Hamas wants to drive the Jews into the sea." ENOUGH! The only thing that matters is action. And the actions over the last 10 years show that Israel has been doing a hundred-fold better job at wiping Palestinians off the face of the earth than vice versa.

So that means that you want to drive the Jews to the sea. There's no other reasonable excplaination of what you said.

[Souseiseki]

http://i.imgur.com/J2oYW.jpg

actually, just look at this

seriously

Well, I would hope guided missiles and aircraft were better at killing then shitty rockets

they were

rockets that killed 0.3x the people were still the headline though

[Seperates]

Where else would you have them fight? This isn't the 1800's where soldiers stand out the open battlefield and fire at each other in deathrow lines.
I am talking about the people in charge. Individual soldiers care about civilian casualties, but the higher-ups only care about the PR fallout that may accompany it, not the act itself.

If they cared about civilian casualties, they wouldn't have a war in the first place. On either side. The simple fact of the matter is that through warfare or missile strikes or whatever they choose, they are going to cause civilian casualties. It is inevitable.

The people in charge of every Op I went out on pounded into our heads the LOAC, ROW, GC regarding treatment of POW, and ROE. I've seen four stars cry about the fact that a civilian was killed on an Op gone screwball. You need to readjust your perspective, because while I may have become cynical, I don't make sweeping generalizations about people I've never met and only know about through the media.

While that does make your four-star a good man... if he is crying about a single civilian, he may need to get a re-adjustment. People die in war. If you don't want people to die, don't wage war.

[Norsklow]

Specific names of specific persons were mentioned. Athletes, Munich, 1972, Olympics, and all that.

He responded to it, considered it tough luck for them, too bad, felt bad about them on a personal level.

The event in which these people were murdered certainly qualified as terrorism in the Federal Republic of Germany.

So what, exactly, is your COMPLAINT?

This is a land war as far as I can see, unless you want to redefine Israel's action as state terrorism?

As far as the Law of the Federal Republic of Germany can see it's Terrorism. The 'unless' can drop off a cliff.

If you want to talk about a War, then you're dealing with a case of violating a neutral nation, DURING the Olympics no less,in order to perpetrate a war-crime, specifically gunning down a number of carefully picked civilians, hosed down at point-blank-range, the whole incident occurring under the Sacrosanct circumstances of the Olympic Games.
Terrorism is less of a mouth-full, wouldn't you say?

So I call it Terrorism, as opposed to a case of violating a neutral nation, DURING the Olympics no less,in order to perpetrate a war-crime, specifically gunning down a number of carefully picked civilians, hosed down at point-blank-range, the whole incident occurring under the Sacrosanct circumstances of the Olympic Games.

In short, Terrorism.

[Souseiseki]

http://i.imgur.com/HGex2.jpg

compare israelis killed vs gazans killed

the israelies are more accurate. hamas until these last few days shot way more rockets at israel than took in receiving fire. Body count is not the determining factor on right or wrong. The one in the wrong is who shot first, and that would be hamas. So we will go back to the "karma is a bitch" theory. you dont want to be killed dont try and kill anybody.

actually, they're not very accurate at all. which is why they keep killing civilians and bombing schools and ambulances. but that's ok because

in any case, he said he doubts there as many airstrikes or else they'd get reported more. that that post is response to that.

[Socialist EU]

I'm so sick of hearing what people here "want." Oh, "Israel wants peace," "Hamas wants to drive the Jews into the sea." ENOUGH! The only thing that matters is action. And the actions over the last 10 years show that Israel has been doing a hundred-fold better job at wiping Palestinians off the face of the earth than vice versa.

So that means that you want to drive the Jews to the sea. There's no other reasonable excplaination of what you said.

No, it's your 'confimational bias' at work.

[Saruhan]

Well, I would hope guided missiles and aircraft were better at killing then shitty rockets

they were

rockets that killed 0.3x the people were still the headline though

Because Israel is a developed nation and an important Western ally in the middle east, the Hamas controlled Gaza... Isn't

[The Emerald Dawn]

The people in charge of every Op I went out on pounded into our heads the LOAC, ROW, GC regarding treatment of POW, and ROE. I've seen four stars cry about the fact that a civilian was killed on an Op gone screwball. You need to readjust your perspective, because while I may have become cynical, I don't make sweeping generalizations about people I've never met and only know about through the media.

While that does make your four-star a good man... if he is crying about a single civilian, he may need to get a re-adjustment. People die in war. If you don't want people to die, don't wage war.

Eh, the Op shouldn't have put us in the area it did. Intel went wrong, tits became upwardly inclined, and he was responsible ultimately. He kept his perspective, which included the fact that if we do our jobs right no civvies die.

[Souseiseki]

they were

rockets that killed 0.3x the people were still the headline though

Because Israel is a developed nation and an important Western ally in the middle east, the Hamas controlled Gaza... Isn't

sorry bro

they were all humans, and they were all important

actually, remember the image i posted before? you've pretty much just did it.

[Souseiseki]

they were

rockets that killed 0.3x the people were still the headline though

Because Israel is a developed nation and an important Western ally in the middle east, the Hamas controlled Gaza... Isn't

though it's nice you appear to have moved from "if there were more airstrikes, there'd be more news" to "well of course it's not in the news, who cares if they die?"

[Saruhan]

Because Israel is a developed nation and an important Western ally in the middle east, the Hamas controlled Gaza... Isn't

though it's nice you appear to have moved from "if there were more airstrikes, there'd be more news" to "well of course it's not in the news, who cares if they die?"

It's all over the Western News, on Al Jezzera it's more focused on the Palestinians. It's more a bias think. Plus I get most of my news from AJE anyway so I see that news ever time an Israeli soldier farts near Gaza. I just sort of assumed it was a universal thing

[Seperates]

While that does make your four-star a good man... if he is crying about a single civilian, he may need to get a re-adjustment. People die in war. If you don't want people to die, don't wage war.

Eh, the Op shouldn't have put us in the area it did. Intel went wrong, tits became upwardly inclined, and he was responsible ultimately. He kept his perspective, which included the fact that if we do our jobs right no civvies die.

That is an individual assessment. I do not see similar restriant from either the Israelis or the Hamas.

[Souseiseki]

though it's nice you appear to have moved from "if there were more airstrikes, there'd be more news" to "well of course it's not in the news, who cares if they die?"

It's all over the Western News, on Al Jezzera it's more focused on the Palestinians. It's more a bias think. Plus I get most of my news from AJE anyway so I see that news ever time an Israeli soldier farts near Gaza. I just sort of assumed it was a universal thing

it isn't. everyone else is focused on the israelis.

[Saruhan]

It's all over the Western News, on Al Jezzera it's more focused on the Palestinians. It's more a bias think. Plus I get most of my news from AJE anyway so I see that news ever time an Israeli soldier farts near Gaza. I just sort of assumed it was a universal thing

it isn't. everyone else is focused on the israelis.

Well then, I stand corrected

[Gravlen]

And when they don't hide, but just live there - and are blown up while driving down a crowded street?

that's sad, but its Hamas's responsibility not to use civilian neighborhoods as a war zone. So the blame still goes on the guys shooting the rockets in the first place.

So would you say that if, as the example was earlier, Leon Panetta were to be blown up by Taliban forces in the middle of rush hour, the US would be responsible for civilian casualties?

(Or any drone operator in the US controlling drones launching attacks in Afghanistan / Pakistan)