Should Canada merge with the USA?

[Saruhan]

Nobody appeals to everyone on the first day.
But give it time. Genius is an acquired taste. Just like freedom.

Okay, you've sold me on your plan if you tell me this,

Why would Southern Ontario be renamed Toronto?

Because he doesn't know anything about us

[Lambrinisia]

And better credit rating, secular government and better education standards.

So do you have answers?

Secular government?! Dude the US is secular too. Or have you never heard of the separation of church and state.
Anyway, I'm not answering any of your questions. You called me a moron, and insulting people isn't going to get them to debate you, at least not in an intelligent manner.

I call bullshit. I have heard of the separation of church and state. It is my belief that the US does not practise this.

I call you a moron because you have not once said, apart from "getting to be American and vote for the President" one reason why this would benefit Canada. If you don't want to be a moron, start coming up with answers and I will gladly retract calling you a moron and apologise.

[Greater Nilfgaard]

Nobody appeals to everyone on the first day.
But give it time. Genius is an acquired taste. Just like freedom.

Okay, you've sold me on your plan if you tell me this,

Why would Southern Ontario be renamed Toronto?

I thought since New York State is named after our largest city. Canada's largest city should also be the name of the state it resides in.
Ergo, Southern Ontario becomes Toronto.

[Saruhan]

Okay, you've sold me on your plan if you tell me this,

Why would Southern Ontario be renamed Toronto?

I thought since New York State is named after our largest city. Canada's largest city should also be the name of the state it resides in.
Ergo, Southern Ontario becomes Toronto.

Do we really want Toronto's ego to become even larger?

[Sulamalik]

Speaking as a person who believe the Golden Horseshoe should secede from the nation as an independent city-state, even I think that's just too egotistical.

[Soviet Canuckistan]

I thought since New York State is named after our largest city. Canada's largest city should also be the name of the state it resides in.
Ergo, Southern Ontario becomes Toronto.

Do we really want Toronto's ego to become even larger?

Toronto's ego is bigger than an obese American.

[Oneracon]

Speaking as a person who believe the Golden Horseshoe should secede from the nation as an independent city-state, even I think that's just too egotistical.

Ever read that book King John of Canada?

You'd like the Mayor of Toronto in that book.

[Greater Nilfgaard]

I thought since New York State is named after our largest city. Canada's largest city should also be the name of the state it resides in.
Ergo, Southern Ontario becomes Toronto.

Do we really want Toronto's ego to become even larger?

Being the only city in Canada that I've visited, Toronto deserves special praise for it's ability to attract geniuses.

[Lancaster of Wessex]

I thought since New York State is named after our largest city. Canada's largest city should also be the name of the state it resides in.
Ergo, Southern Ontario becomes Toronto.

Do we really want Toronto's ego to become even larger?

*takes exception*

[Sulamalik]

Okay, you've sold me on your plan if you tell me this,

Why would Southern Ontario be renamed Toronto?

I thought since New York State is named after our largest city. Canada's largest city should also be the name of the state it resides in.
Ergo, Southern Ontario becomes Toronto.

I'm pretty sure New York State was named after York, not New Amsterdam.

[Lancaster of Wessex]

Do we really want Toronto's ego to become even larger?

Toronto's ego is bigger than an obese American.

Untrue. The obese American cannot be compared to on any scale.

*takes exception again...my poor city!*

[Sulfar]

I dearly hope that an American annexation of Canada never happens.
A military invasion won't work either since we can unleash our magical shamanic eskimos, killer beavers and flying bears (who can shoot laser beams, by the way) upon the American forces. Heck, even as a QC sovereigntist, I'd enlist any Canada-wide resistance movement if my house isn't bombed before I can leave.

I love universal healthcare

[Oneracon]

Toronto's ego is bigger than an obese American.

Ok to be fair (and bias note: I'm from the GTA)... Toronto is the financial centre of the country (Bay St., the Big Five Banks), and one of the major cultural capitals (CBC headquarters, Toronto International Film Festival, etc.)

[Soviet Canuckistan]

Toronto's ego is bigger than an obese American.

Untrue. The obese American cannot be compared to on any scale.

*takes exception again...my poor city!*

Imagine if obese Americans found TImbits...

*gasps*

[Saruhan]

Do we really want Toronto's ego to become even larger?

Being the only city in Canada that I've visited, Toronto deserves special praise for it's ability to attract geniuses.

As well as foreigners who don't know anything about the country

[Socialdemokraterne]

But I think what the OP is trying to get at isn't just his specific plan for a Northern American union, but rather of the idea and concept that America and Canada are destined for each other. America needs Canada's injected liberalism(besides the tories eh? haha) and rich natural resources. And the Canadians would be well served by belonging to a broader northern american community, even larger and more open trade ties, and an army second to none in the world's history.

Canadians have soundly rejected the proposal to become part of the United States. That should end the discussion. The US has no claim to sovereignty over lands controlled by Canada, so it has no right to dictate the fate of these lands, their resources, their people, or their politics. Canada has rejected the proposal to become part of the United States before (both in part and in whole), and the movement to do so now has absolutely no political clout in either country. The OP is arguing for something that no one wants. Hock the "broader North American community" spiel all you want, no one's buying it.

No matter what you believe we all must realize the world is changing. Food supplies become ever more strained, America;'s unemployment rate continues to swerve out of control( and please Canadians stop the smugness, the next time we go under, you guys will certainly go down too, your real estate bubble isn't exactly a beacon of regulation).

First things first, a recent historical look at the US unemployment rate:

http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

When you say "America's unemployment rate continues to swerve out of control...", that calls to my mind a graph with an unemployment spike which is continuing to climb, has reached historic highs, and shows no signs of tapering off its rate of growth. The unemployment rate has been declining since the start of its severe upward spike in May of 2008 and its peak of 10% in October of 2009 (not the historic record high). Compare October of 2009, 2010, 2011, and 2012 in the data beneath the graph, and you'll see the following figures: 10.0% (2009), 9.5% (2010), 8.9% (2011), and 7.9% (2012). The US unemployment rate is not "swerving out of control". It is declining. It's not declining as quickly as everyone would like it to, and it's not nearly as low at present as people would like. But it is declining steadily from year to year, so there is nothing in that trend to suggest that a union with Canada is necessary. And even if there were, why should the US (the one with the weaker economic figures in this hypothetical) be the one to call the shots? That would be like a failing bank and a succeeding bank merging, and then the failing bank's old management taking the helm simply because the failing bank had a bigger market stake. It's nonsense!

As for food supplies becoming ever more strained, part of the reason that happened is because global food prices have skyrocketed and US domestic farm subsidies have been changed to direct agriculture toward markets. Furthermore, because the food surpluses of the past were costly and perceived as wasteful, existing stockpiles were used without adequate replenishment of their stocks. Another factor is the shift toward production of ethanol fuel, growing crops for the sake of processing and burning them instead of eating them.

It seems infinitely more sensible to have the US government purchase a portion of the national agricultural GDP to keep as an emergency reserve for both domestic and foreign aid than to unite with Canada so that the national agricultural GDP increases artificially without seriously resolving any of the above problems. The OP's suggestion does precisely nothing to resolve food supply management issues. Not a thing.

Canada would also be better served by finally also belonging to a nation whose primary identity was one actually based on the virtues of the nation and not on "We're not them!".

Spare me.

The idea of a nation-state that bounds from Montreal to Houston shall become a reality, weather you want it or not. It's already in the cards.

Based on what? I just demolished literally every reason you just gave to create that union.

[Farnhamia]

I thought since New York State is named after our largest city. Canada's largest city should also be the name of the state it resides in.
Ergo, Southern Ontario becomes Toronto.

I'm pretty sure New York State was named after York, not New Amsterdam.

New York, the city, was originally New Amsterdam, named after ... Amsterdam. After the British took it over in the 1660s, it was renamed in honor of the Duke of York (later James II). The name of the city was applied to the rest of the colony.

[Greater Nilfgaard]

Being the only city in Canada that I've visited, Toronto deserves special praise for it's ability to attract geniuses.

As well as foreigners who don't know anything about the country

Perhaps. But any major city will have a couple dumb tourists. Believe me, during the summer in New York we get our fair share as well.

[Sulfar]

Do we really want Toronto's ego to become even larger?

Being the only city in Canada that I've visited, Toronto deserves special praise for it's ability to attract geniuses.

I see what you did there. That's quite a self-esteem.

[Dread Lady Nathicana]

Secular government?! Dude the US is secular too. Or have you never heard of the separation of church and state.
Anyway, I'm not answering any of your questions. You called me a moron, and insulting people isn't going to get them to debate you, at least not in an intelligent manner.

I call bullshit. I have heard of the separation of church and state. It is my belief that the US does not practise this.

I call you a moron because you have not once said, apart from "getting to be American and vote for the President" one reason why this would benefit Canada. If you don't want to be a moron, start coming up with answers and I will gladly retract calling you a moron and apologise.

I would suggest retraction and apology post haste, considering such behavior is flaming, and frowned on mightily by the moderation staff here. Of which I'm part. Consider this your unofficial warning to knock it off, and present your arguments without stooping to the name-calling. Thanks.

[Greater Nilfgaard]

Being the only city in Canada that I've visited, Toronto deserves special praise for it's ability to attract geniuses.

I see what you did there. That's quite a self-esteem.

As dictated by classic thinkers like Aristotle. The great mind is only truly great if it recognizes it's own greatness.

[Soviet Canuckistan]

I'm pretty sure New York State was named after York, not New Amsterdam.

New York, the city, was originally New Amsterdam, named after ... Amsterdam. After the British took it over in the 1660s, it was renamed in honor of the Duke of York (later James II). The name of the city was applied to the rest of the colony.

They sold it for nutmeg!

[Camwood]

I'd like to know why the OP thinks there is a problem with the current setup.

[Farnhamia]

New York, the city, was originally New Amsterdam, named after ... Amsterdam. After the British took it over in the 1660s, it was renamed in honor of the Duke of York (later James II). The name of the city was applied to the rest of the colony.

They sold it for nutmeg!

Who did?

[Sulamalik]

I see what you did there. That's quite a self-esteem.

As dictated by classic thinkers like Aristotle. The great mind is only truly great if it recognizes it's own greatness.

Ever read Antigone? Do you know what vice causes Cleon to fall from grace?

Hubris.