Resolved: the US is too large and ought to be divided...

[Galla-]

If you want to talk about a nation thats to large

Population wise:
China & India

Land Area wise:
Russia

this United States is not too large no matter what people think. so my answer is a big NO it should not be divided

Yeah, being only third largest by both population and land area, nbd.

It's not like that's impressive or anything.

[Seleucas]

So was I.

So some of these poster specifically want the U.S. to fall so some other country can take our place?

That's not good at all, if its true.

I'd rather have a multi-polar world than one dominated by a superpower.

[Seperates]

Ah-ha...

No.

[Galla-]

So some of these poster specifically want the U.S. to fall so some other country can take our place?

That's not good at all, if its true.

I'd rather have a multi-polar world than one dominated by a superpower.

We have a multi-polar world.

BRIC, EU, USA.

[Forsher]

But that was a shadow of it former self. I would not wish that fate upon America.

He is correct. China's the longest surviving civilization (there were some periods of dramatic decline, but the culture and history was pretty much still retained) mostly because of their history strong centralized rule, a necessity in a region where factional splinters were common.

China isn't, not really.

They're quite different the various dynasties.

[Seperates]

He is correct. China's the longest surviving civilization (there were some periods of dramatic decline, but the culture and history was pretty much still retained) mostly because of their history strong centralized rule, a necessity in a region where factional splinters were common.

China isn't, not really.

They're quite different the various dynasties.

For fuck's sake, even the regional cultures are so much more varied than those in America. Trying to compare Imperial China to today's China is like trying to compare apples and Rocky Mountain Oysters.

[PapaJacky]

China isn't, not really.

They're quite different the various dynasties.

For fuck's sake, even the regional cultures are so much more varied than those in America. Trying to compare Imperial China to today's China is like trying to compare apples and Rocky Mountain Oysters.

Not trying to compare the two, I'm saying that as a culture, they still retain much of what they had back in yee yonder days. For example, Guan Yu, a Three Kingdoms Period General, is still much revered today. Tenets of Confucianism for the most part has stuck around as well. AFAIK, most Chinese haven't worshipped deities for centuries as well. Quoting a movie, "Tianxia".

[Forsher]

China isn't, not really.

They're quite different the various dynasties.

For fuck's sake, even the regional cultures are so much more varied than those in America. Trying to compare Imperial China to today's China is like trying to compare apples and Rocky Mountain Oysters.

Your language is based on our dialect!
You speak funny!

That was an English lesson, pretty much verbatim. The first speaker's family is from Beijing. The second's is Southern.

[Seperates]

For fuck's sake, even the regional cultures are so much more varied than those in America. Trying to compare Imperial China to today's China is like trying to compare apples and Rocky Mountain Oysters.

Your language is based on our dialect!
You speak funny!

That was an English lesson, pretty much verbatim. The first speaker's family is from Beijing. The second's is Southern.

Meh, I'm still trying to get used to the use of "hella" here in Northern California.

It's alot like the British and American accents... though we apparently think each other's accents are sexy rather than wierd.

[PapaJacky]

Your language is based on our dialect!
You speak funny!

That was an English lesson, pretty much verbatim. The first speaker's family is from Beijing. The second's is Southern.

Meh, I'm still trying to get used to the use of "hella" here in Northern California.

It's alot like the British and American accents... though we apparently think each other's accents are sexy rather than wierd.

The Pacific coast of the U.S. is where the hipster accent grew up. Or so I think.

[Seperates]

For fuck's sake, even the regional cultures are so much more varied than those in America. Trying to compare Imperial China to today's China is like trying to compare apples and Rocky Mountain Oysters.

Not trying to compare the two, I'm saying that as a culture, they still retain much of what they had back in yee yonder days. For example, Guan Yu, a Three Kingdoms Period General, is still much revered today. Tenets of Confucianism for the most part has stuck around as well. AFAIK, most Chinese haven't worshipped deities for centuries as well. Quoting a movie, "Tianxia".

Calling it all one culture is telling of your own ignorance on the subject. It is one country, but it has not and never has been, one culture. Southern China is different than Northern China is different than Western China in different than Central China is different than Eastern China.

Calling it all one culture doesn't make any sense what-so-ever.

[Galla-]

If it ain't white, it ain't right.

[Forsher]

Not trying to compare the two, I'm saying that as a culture, they still retain much of what they had back in yee yonder days. For example, Guan Yu, a Three Kingdoms Period General, is still much revered today. Tenets of Confucianism for the most part has stuck around as well. AFAIK, most Chinese haven't worshipped deities for centuries as well. Quoting a movie, "Tianxia".

Calling it all one culture is telling of your own ignorance on the subject. It is one country, but it has not and never has been, one culture. Southern China is different than Northern China is different than Western China in different than Central China is different than Eastern China.

Calling it all one culture doesn't make any sense what-so-ever.

That's ignoring the whole Han, not Han thing. Like Xue I think it is.

I only know one non-Han.

[Seperates]

Meh, I'm still trying to get used to the use of "hella" here in Northern California.

It's alot like the British and American accents... though we apparently think each other's accents are sexy rather than wierd.

The Pacific coast of the U.S. is where the hipster accent grew up. Or so I think.

Not really. "Hella" is a term in Oakland. It's quite like "finna".

"Hipster accent" doesn't really exist. It differs from region to region. Hipster culture, however, is one of the most ironic things ever created, because everybody tries to be an individual and through that pursuit of individuality... end up being the same.

[Ramenasia]

Not trying to compare the two, I'm saying that as a culture, they still retain much of what they had back in yee yonder days. For example, Guan Yu, a Three Kingdoms Period General, is still much revered today. Tenets of Confucianism for the most part has stuck around as well. AFAIK, most Chinese haven't worshipped deities for centuries as well. Quoting a movie, "Tianxia".

Calling it all one culture is telling of your own ignorance on the subject. It is one country, but it has not and never has been, one culture. Southern China is different than Northern China is different than Western China in different than Central China is different than Eastern China.

Calling it all one culture doesn't make any sense what-so-ever.

The culture is primarily Han culture, since they make up about 90% of the population. With the exception of Tibet and Inner Mongolia, China is fairly culturally homogeneous. China is divided by economics, not culture or ethnicity.

[Forsher]

Calling it all one culture is telling of your own ignorance on the subject. It is one country, but it has not and never has been, one culture. Southern China is different than Northern China is different than Western China in different than Central China is different than Eastern China.

Calling it all one culture doesn't make any sense what-so-ever.

The culture is primarily Han culture, since they make up about 90% of the population. With the exception of Tibet and Inner Mongolia, China is fairly culturally homogeneous. China is divided by economics, not culture or ethnicity.

North eats noodles.

South eats rice.

Hong Kong is different again.

Then there is the larger rural/urban thing that applies everywhere.

[Seperates]

Calling it all one culture is telling of your own ignorance on the subject. It is one country, but it has not and never has been, one culture. Southern China is different than Northern China is different than Western China in different than Central China is different than Eastern China.

Calling it all one culture doesn't make any sense what-so-ever.

The culture is primarily Han culture, since they make up about 90% of the population. With the exception of Tibet and Inner Mongolia, China is fairly culturally homogeneous. China is divided by economics, not culture or ethnicity.

Which ignores the variations that exist within that culture as well, especially since Han culture makes cultural differences based on economics (and prior to the rise of Mao, patrilineal corporations.).

I suppose you could be correct though, seeing as you defined it as economic disparities, not cultural disparities. But one of my anthro professors argued (not sure if this has been published, though I will look into it) that since Mao destroyed the patrilineal corporation structures, the only way of them to make distinctions has been to create distinctions between economic classes, so that the cultural difference is based on their economic difference, much like in parts of the United States.

[Purpelia]

Pretty much what it says on the tin:

This topic is for a discussion of the idea that the US is too large and should be divided.

Yea or nay?
Why or why not?
If yes, how?

I lean towards yes. Roughly speaking, each of us can know 100-300 people. 3 levels of governance seem to be most workable. 3 to 30 million seems to work out to the best population level.

What should be done with it is integrate it. Scrap all the silly small states and stuff and rework the whole thing under one strong non federal central government. Than make it more like Canada.

[Daistallia 2104]

Pretty much what it says on the tin:

This topic is for a discussion of the idea that the US is too large and should be divided.

Yea or nay?
Why or why not?
If yes, how?

I lean towards yes. Roughly speaking, each of us can know 100-300 people. 3 levels of governance seem to be most workable. 3 to 30 million seems to work out to the best population level.

What should be done with it is integrate it. Scrap all the silly small states and stuff and rework the whole thing under one strong non federal central government. Than make it more like Canada.

It would also be less representative and responsible to the soverign (the people).

As for those saying another actor would step in and take our place, any country over 30 million population is also too large.

As for three layers, once you start adding on above that, the government becomes too far removed from the ground action and is unable to respond nimbly or appropriately.

[Sociobiology]

it is actually essential you have urban and rural areas under the same government at some level. They exist as a mutualistic pair each requiring the other to exist.
So having a government to smooth out the differences that arise from very different lifestyles is necessary.
Most of the states were set up specifically to have balance of both so they could be somewhat self sufficient.

[Ashmoria]

Pretty much what it says on the tin:

This topic is for a discussion of the idea that the US is too large and should be divided.

Yea or nay?
Why or why not?
If yes, how?

I lean towards yes. Roughly speaking, each of us can know 100-300 people. 3 levels of governance seem to be most workable. 3 to 30 million seems to work out to the best population level.

i think the international economies of scale are such that it would be financially difficult to divide us up.

plus we are so paranoid that we would immediately start worrying that usa1 was going to attack usa2 so we'd need a big military buildup

[Ramenasia]

North eats noodles.

South eats rice.

Hong Kong is different again.

Then there is the larger rural/urban thing that applies everywhere.

Yes, they do like different food. North likes salty food, South likes sweet, and Szechuan likes spicy. So there is some variation in gastronomics too. But as a general rule, Chinese people are united under 5000-year old culture, perpetuated in part by their common written language, ancestry, and all the more significant aspects that make up culture.

I suppose you could be correct though, seeing as you defined it as economic disparities, not cultural disparities. But one of my anthro professors argued (not sure if this has been published, though I will look into it) that since Mao destroyed the patrilineal corporation structures, the only way of them to make distinctions has been to create distinctions between economic classes, so that the cultural difference is based on their economic difference, much like in parts of the United States.

Sounds accurate to me.

[Risottia]

Yea.
I don't like large states in general; I prefer ones that are smaller. Having a whole bunch of Liechtensteins and Singapores would be preferable to me than a US which meddles in everybody's affairs.

Singapore not meddling in its citizens' affairs now?
Or, talking about small countries, Belarus?

[PapaJacky]

Not trying to compare the two, I'm saying that as a culture, they still retain much of what they had back in yee yonder days. For example, Guan Yu, a Three Kingdoms Period General, is still much revered today. Tenets of Confucianism for the most part has stuck around as well. AFAIK, most Chinese haven't worshipped deities for centuries as well. Quoting a movie, "Tianxia".

Calling it all one culture is telling of your own ignorance on the subject. It is one country, but it has not and never has been, one culture. Southern China is different than Northern China is different than Western China in different than Central China is different than Eastern China.

Calling it all one culture doesn't make any sense what-so-ever.

Yes, because categorically, Chinese culture is Chinese culture. I'm not ignorant that there are still regional differences, but again, to reiterate, for the most part they have still retained much of their ancient culture thanks to their incessant need for a Centralized government.

[PapaJacky]

The Pacific coast of the U.S. is where the hipster accent grew up. Or so I think.

Not really. "Hella" is a term in Oakland. It's quite like "finna".

"Hipster accent" doesn't really exist. It differs from region to region. Hipster culture, however, is one of the most ironic things ever created, because everybody tries to be an individual and through that pursuit of individuality... end up being the same.

Not really. From my divings into hipster culture, their voices have similar accents. It can be analogized as essentially a surfer accent but with extra emphasis on the latter parts of the word.