Future Rifles for US Military

[Samozaryadnyastan]

No but it is truthful.

When dealing with POWs, you affix a bayonet to prod and poke them, plus to stab that one bastard that tries to attack you.

hmm, hadn't thought about handling POW's I'll think about that.

Bayonets do take away from long range sighting, since the added weight and a few other factors work against the rifle.

which is another reason not to run around with them fixed all the time.

It affects it more at ranges at which the infantry would not be expected to hit targets with anyway. Even though the SVD and PKM both have bayonet lugs, I don't recall having seen either with one in use (I have seen a picture of a PKM with bayonet, but not in action).

Also, accounts from troops in Iraq said that mounting old timey 17" sword bayonets onto their W1200 shotguns (which has identical bayonet lugs to the M1897) made PoWs much more appreciative of their captors.
Again, psychological impact.

[Sociobiology]

sarcasm is one of the emoticons that is not firmly established, hence why I stick to the most widely used.
although :-7 is becoming popular.
I would love to see a sarcasm emote added to our forum options.
hint to moderators

There should be a :v emoticon added.

It's clearly the most superior everyemote.

I don't know that one, what is it?

[Galla-]

There should be a :v emoticon added.

It's clearly the most superior everyemote.

I don't know that one, what is it?

It means "anything and everything depending on who you're talking to".

Or it's a sarcasm emote.

[The Two Jerseys]

did you seriously just try to use a movie as a source?

No but it is truthful.

When dealing with POWs, you affix a bayonet to prod and poke them, plus to stab that one bastard that tries to attack you.

Bayonets do take away from long range sighting, since the added weight and a few other factors work against the rifle.

Plus it was made in 1941, so they couldn't get away with actually showing a bayoneting in gory detail like they can now, so there would really be no reason for them to show the attackers with fixed bayonets unless they really did attack with fixed bayonets.

[San-Silvacian]

Thats why you don't do that. You only affix bayonets when you need to. Defensively, bayonets are great for a counter-attack, especially if you've been giving your opponent what for. It can also be used offensively to boost moral and cause fear in the enemy. It shows your enemy you don't care about yourself, you don't care if you don't wake up tomorrow, it tells your enemy that you want him dead. That you want to watch the life drain from his eyes though his gullet as you thrust your bayonet into him.

Thats the use of bayonets. Fear and moral.

and shooting at me does not convey the desire to kill me?
you could also strip naked and paint yourself blue.

Shooting does, but it instills much more fear when your enemy charges you.

[Samozaryadnyastan]

^

When you're being shot at, it's from some considerable distance away.
Both sides can hold their ground very comfortably.

When your opponents charge you however, you're faced with an issue. They're running at your position, and you know that once they get in, they're in. It forces your fight or flight response. And, unless you've fixed bayonets too, the response is typically flight.

[San-Silvacian]

^

When you're being shot at, it's from some considerable distance away.
Both sides can hold their ground very comfortably.

When your opponents charge you however, you're faced with an issue. They're running at your position, and you know that once they get in, they're in. It forces your fight or flight response. And, unless you've fixed bayonets too, the response is typically flight.

That can depend on the situation.

During WW2, the Japanese would throw Banzai charge after charge at Marine positions. Most of the time, the Marines had to leave because they ran out of ammunition.

[Sociobiology]

It affects it more at ranges at which the infantry would not be expected to hit targets with anyway. Even though the SVD and PKM both have bayonet lugs, I don't recall having seen either with one in use (I have seen a picture of a PKM with bayonet, but not in action).

Also, accounts from troops in Iraq said that mounting old timey 17" sword bayonets onto their W1200 shotguns (which has identical bayonet lugs to the M1897) made PoWs much more appreciative of their captors.
Again, psychological impact.

then the chainsaw might really be mure useful,
or this


or even better this


of if you get right down to it this,

because nothing says crazy like shoving your gun up a cat's ass.

I remember that the Afgan people were terrified of the A10's because they thought the tracers were actually some kind of directed energy weapon.

the single best intimidation might well be a device they don't recognize. Nothing real beats the fear you invent inside your own head.

[Sociobiology]

and shooting at me does not convey the desire to kill me?
you could also strip naked and paint yourself blue.

Shooting does, but it instills much more fear when your enemy charges you.

and bayonets are necessary for this why?

[San-Silvacian]

Shooting does, but it instills much more fear when your enemy charges you.

and bayonets are necessary for this why?

It shows your enemy you don't care about yourself, you don't care if you don't wake up tomorrow, it tells your enemy that you want him dead. That you want to watch the life drain from his eyes though his gullet as you thrust your bayonet into him.

[Yes Im Biop]

then you might prefer this absurdity.
I guarantee the novelty factor will be greater as will the aggression factor.

Actually, that's pretty kickass.

As stupid as this is. Who is gonna charge him

[Samozaryadnyastan]

What San said, again.

After all, Vietnamese troops (in medieval times, ofc) would line PoWs up on their front line and have them behead themselves in front of the enemy to psych them.

[San-Silvacian]

Actually, that's pretty kickass.

As stupid as this is. Who is gonna charge him

Well when he gets his first guy and the thing gets caught in the man he just killed, he'll get shot pretty quickly.

[Sociobiology]

and bayonets are necessary for this why?

It shows your enemy you don't care about yourself, you don't care if you don't wake up tomorrow, it tells your enemy that you want him dead. That you want to watch the life drain from his eyes though his gullet as you thrust your bayonet into him.

again bayonets are nessasary for this how?
charging into oncoming fire tells him that.

[San-Silvacian]

again bayonets are nessasary for this how?
charging into oncoming fire tells him that.

Killing a man at 100+ meters is much different than stabbing a man with a knife.

Its much more...interactive.

[Samozaryadnyastan]

Moving forwards in the standard procedure of moving then covering would not imply that to me.

Charging with a bayonet implies something that doesn't happen often on the modern battlefield. Someone finds you, he kills you, and he's close enough doing it to feel your dying breath on his face.

[Sociobiology]

again bayonets are nessasary for this how?
charging into oncoming fire tells him that.

Killing a man at 100+ meters is much different than stabbing a man with a knife.

Its much more...interactive.

so?
charging into oncoming fire already tells them you want to kill them more than you want to live.

[Immoren]

again bayonets are nessasary for this how?
charging into oncoming fire tells him that.

Killing a man at 100+ meters is much different than stabbing a man with a knife.

Its much more...interactive.

You mean intimate?

[Sociobiology]

Killing a man at 100+ meters is much different than stabbing a man with a knife.

Its much more...interactive.

You mean intimate?

there it is!
this is how you REALLY scare them

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dalej/75334706/

[Aqizithiuda]

You mean intimate?

there it is!
this is how you REALLY scare them

[url]http://www.flickr.com/photos/dalej/75334706/url]

That's a tad more frightening than what I was going to suggest (not stopping the covering artillery barrage until you're amongst the enemy) .

[The Two Jerseys]

You mean intimate?

there it is!
this is how you REALLY scare them

http://www.flickr.com/photos/dalej/75334706/

The words a soldier fears most: "ass rape"

But really, I remember hearing that they did a study on the psychological effects of bayonets and bullets on people on the receiving end. Basically, they concluded that people are more terrified by the thought of being stabbed then by the thought of being shot. That's mostly why back in the day two armies could stand 10m apart and trade volleys all day long, but the defenders would usually break when facing a bayonet charge.
I'll try seeing if I can find a link to that.

[Herlosk]

I honestly think the Magpul Masada is the best way to go (not the horrid ripoffs Remington and Bushmaster make, the original). They would more likely pick the M6 though. American politics hates advancements on the troop level.

[Samozaryadnyastan]

I honestly think the Magpul Masada is the best way to go (not the horrid ripoffs Remington and Bushmaster make, the original).

It's not even that great a rifle.
It's got multi-calibre capability and short-stroke reliability, that's about it.

[Herlosk]

It's not even that great a rifle.
It's got multi-calibre capability and short-stroke reliability, that's about it.

That's why I specified the Magpul Masada as opposed to the ACR. I would also like to specify that they should adopt 6.8 Rem-SPC as well.

[PapaJacky]

It's not even that great a rifle.
It's got multi-calibre capability and short-stroke reliability, that's about it.

That's why I specified the Magpul Masada as opposed to the ACR. I would also like to specify that they should adopt 6.8 Rem-SPC as well.

6.8 won't cut it. We need to move out of the 5.56's but at the same time we need to make more emphasis on "long range" engagements, which is the most common scenario in A-stan today, and, more than likely, in an Iranian or North Korean battle field as well.