NationStates

Hello, NSG after some converstion I had about suicide in the "Thread for former Fascists and Sympathizers", I thought I ought to make a thread for it. I know we've had suicide threads before, but what the hell. What do you all think of people commiting suicide, and when or if it is ok to commit suicide.

As I stated in the former Fascists thread....

You can't master life if you end it, suicide is the highest expression of cowardice.

That pretty much sums up my thoughts on the topic.

If you have had friends/family commit or almost commit suicide please share that exprience, also if you've attempted suicide.

I think this song is a perfect theme for this thread: "Don't Go And Put A Bullet In Your Head" - Lenny Kravitz

I can't condemn people for ending their lives. It's sad, yes, to me, when someone decides to go down that route. But we all have our stories, our sorrows.

Its immoral. It is a repudiation of the image of God.

That being said... I sympathize with those feeling as though there are no other choices available to them. Sometimes life fucking sucks and we get overwhelmed.

The thought hasn't crossed my mind, but...

Seppuku

Not a bad way to end one's life.

It is what it is. I put no stock in it, but if someone sees it as alright, not my place to judge that. Suicide and attempting it is rather common in my family. I've contemplated it, my cousin attempted it not too long ago, among others.

Samuraikoku wrote:The thought hasn't crossed my mind, but...

Seppuku

Not a bad way to end one's life.

Except for the disembowelment by blade. That's gotta fucking suck.

Cowardice is an easy term to throw around for those not in the grips of suicidal ideation. It's a fucking terrifying thought to contemplate ones own death and the unknown beyond.

I believe that if one truly wants to stop living, then they should be free to do so.

I don't think suicide is something I understand enough to judge.

You can't master life if you end it, suicide is the highest expression of cowardice.

You can't master life anyway if you're going to die of old age.
Suicide is the highest expression of being realistic.

There are a few examples of noble suicides. (Casey jones etc, suicide to save others.)
There are a few examples of suicide to avoid deadly illness.
The rest are a symptom of depression, usually. To claim these people killed themselves is slightly misleading, we would not claim someone suffering from a hallucinatory disease who picks up a gun and shot themselves died from killing themselves, we'd say the disease killed them. It's the same for depression.

Distruzio wrote:Its immoral. It is a repudiation of the image of God.

That being said... I sympathize with those feeling as though there are no other choices available to them. Sometimes life fucking sucks and we get overwhelmed.

So for you suicide is almost the equivalent of killing God? That is an interesting take on it, I can respect that.

Ceannairceach wrote:It is what it is. I put no stock in it, but if someone sees it as alright, not my place to judge that. Suicide and attempting it is rather common in my family. I've contemplated it, my cousin attempted it not too long ago, among others.

How close have you gotten to committing it? I've been to the point of almost cutting my wrists, having the thought in your head is an odd one. I had the instrument of my "salvation" in hand, but I couldn't bring myself to do it. I didn't know if it made me smart, or just equally afraid of death as I was of life.

Ceannairceach wrote:

Samuraikoku wrote:The thought hasn't crossed my mind, but...

Seppuku

Not a bad way to end one's life.

Except for the disembowelment by blade. That's gotta fucking suck.

In their view it was something they willingly chose to endure, if it would keep their honor. That outweighed the idea of the disembowelment suffering.

Alaje wrote:How close have you gotten to committing it? I've been to the point of almost cutting my wrists, having the thought in your head is an odd one. I had the instrument of my "salvation" in hand, but I couldn't bring myself to do it. I didn't know if it made me smart, or just equally afraid of death as I was of life.

Not very. Merely around the planning stages, and only as something of a formality. I've committed myself to living forever, and I've considered the possibility at some point in my life that perhaps eternal life does lie in "death", and thus considered ritualistic suicide to reach this eternal life. I stopped considering it, which was really as far as I got anyway, sometime before I totally abandoned my religious faith. I still hold it in reserve if I can't obtain immortality; I'd rather be sovereign over my own death than subject to the will of nature or "fate."

Can't say I haven't contemplated it. The moods come and go, if I was an American and had access to firearms... Who can say?

Ceannairceach wrote:It is what it is. I put no stock in it, but if someone sees it as alright, not my place to judge that. Suicide and attempting it is rather common in my family. I've contemplated it, my cousin attempted it not too long ago, among others.

I've tried twice. Once when I was 13 and again 4 years ago.

One of my mother's cousins or second cousins committed suicide last year. He hung himself in his apartment.

Samuraikoku wrote:

Ceannairceach wrote:Except for the disembowelment by blade. That's gotta fucking suck.

In their view it was something they willingly chose to endure, if it would keep their honor. That outweighed the idea of the disembowelment suffering.

Doesn't make disemboweling yourself suck any less. Hangovers still suck, no matter how good the beer was.

Ceannairceach wrote:

Samuraikoku wrote:
In their view it was something they willingly chose to endure, if it would keep their honor. That outweighed the idea of the disembowelment suffering.

Doesn't make disemboweling yourself suck any less. Hangovers still suck, no matter how good the beer was.

I'm not contending it doesn't suck. I'm stating that they were probably aware of that, but they still chose to endure it.

Samuraikoku wrote:The thought hasn't crossed my mind, but...

Seppuku

Not a bad way to end one's life.

I've always admired the Samurai, suicide for the reasons the Samurai sometimes did it was stupid, but respectable. It was about honor.

Personally, if you want to? None of my business. If it was someone I knew, I'd probably advise against it and maybe try to get them some help, but in the end it's not my decision.

Samuraikoku wrote:

Ceannairceach wrote:Doesn't make disemboweling yourself suck any less. Hangovers still suck, no matter how good the beer was.

I'm not contending it doesn't suck. I'm stating that they were probably aware of that, but they still chose to endure it.

I contend that the reason the Meiji won out over the Tokugawa is because suicide by gun is a whole lot better than suicide by huge bloody knife.

Alaje wrote:

Samuraikoku wrote:The thought hasn't crossed my mind, but...

Seppuku

Not a bad way to end one's life.

I've always admired the Samurai, suicide for the reasons the Samurai sometimes did it was stupid, but respectable. It was about honor.

Stupid according to our own eyes. It probably made sense in their society, even if we may not want to live as if it was back then.

Ceannairceach wrote:

Samuraikoku wrote:
I'm not contending it doesn't suck. I'm stating that they were probably aware of that, but they still chose to endure it.

I contend that the reason the Meiji won out over the Tokugawa is because suicide by gun is a whole lot better than suicide by huge bloody knife.

Samuraikoku wrote:

Ceannairceach wrote:Doesn't make disemboweling yourself suck any less. Hangovers still suck, no matter how good the beer was.

I'm not contending it doesn't suck. I'm stating that they were probably aware of that, but they still chose to endure it.

That and efforts were made to shorten the duration of the pain.
The book Hagakure talks about the concept of (and I apologise if I have hte name wrong...) a Kayashi, who would be an honourable person or great freind/companion to the individual commiting seppuku. Their job was to observe for when the act of seppuku had been commited, and then behead the individual to end their pain once they had gone through with the act of killing themselves.

Ceannairceach wrote:

Samuraikoku wrote:
I'm not contending it doesn't suck. I'm stating that they were probably aware of that, but they still chose to endure it.

I contend that the reason the Meiji won out over the Tokugawa is because suicide by gun is a whole lot better than suicide by huge bloody knife.

But the last Shôgun didn't commit suicide at the Bakumatsu (end of the Shôgunate era). He resigned and went to live in retirement.