Fascist rise in europe

[Zaras]

The Fascism is EVIL. Kill for like. Disrupt the national unity for fun. Close the doors for inmigrants an tourists. Greece does not deserve this.

Nobody deserves it.

[Zaras]

Simply because I have not explained thoroughly what I meant, does not mean I am uninformed.

And, being a well-rounded human being does is not necessarily being an adult.

I wasn't saying that you held uninformed opinions, but that being bigoted usually springs from being uninformed.

Also, I'd suggest that being a well-rounded human being does usually necessitate being an adult. Less likely to be an ignorant little twerp shooting ones mouth off - not that I'm suggesting that you aren't.

It's scientifically impossible to be bigoted and not sound like an ignorant twerp shooting your mouth off. That's scientific fact. There's no real basis for it, but it's scientific fact.

[Zaras]

Yes, it did. How the fuck is this any different from black people being overrepresented in crime statistics in the USA?

Well of course it isn't. I took your 4/5 comment as though you were saying that immigrants are not over represented in crimes. And as of 2007, around 60% of rapes in Helsinki were committed by those born outside of Finland, so your point is wrong anyway.

In Helsinki.

Which isn't all of Finland.

How come a crime is more worth paying attention to when done by non-native Finns as compared to crimes committed by native Finns?

[Zaras]

The Socialist regime is ending, fast I wish the Europeans went right but this is a bit to extreme.

You don't know shit about socialism, and oh damn I wish I didn't have to constantly run into people who keep needing to be told that.

[Zaras]

Yeah, your beliefs were formed without exposure to reality or humans who were different from you.

"Without exposure to reality?" That is quite infuriating.

Have you ever met somebody who wasn't white?

Have you ever stepped out of the bubble of privilege that you certainly grew up in in order to get these kinds of psychotically stupid, bigoted views?

If you did, you wouldn't be a bigot.

There's frequently a correllation between bigotry and being geographically removed or otherwise not interacting with humans.

Shit, I can't imagine being bigoted in London. I love the diversity of it.

[Zaras]

It's scientifically impossible to be bigoted and not sound like an ignorant twerp shooting your mouth off. That's scientific fact. There's no real basis for it, but it's scientific fact.

You get a shiny medal for the Brass Eye reference.

Awwww, thanks!

I threw it in because I expected that Abatael wouldn't get it, and I could then mock him for it. Mwahahahahaha

[Zaras]

You don't know shit about socialism, and oh damn I wish I didn't have to constantly run into people who keep needing to be told that.

Yes I do! And Socialism has taken over Europe, and stop acting like you know your crap you don't.

I know my shit, you don't. Socialism has not taken over Europe, that is such an incredibly mothercuntfuckingly STUPID thing to say. The problem with the world nowadays is the increasing corporatization of it at all levels, coupled with a rotting and destroying of public services and subordination of everything to markets! If socialism would've taken over Europe, Europe would be a fucking paradise like Scandinavia!

[Zaras]

Have you ever met somebody who wasn't white?

Have you ever stepped out of the bubble of privilege that you certainly grew up in in order to get these kinds of psychotically stupid, bigoted views?

If you did, you wouldn't be a bigot.

There's frequently a correllation between bigotry and being geographically removed or otherwise not interacting with humans.

Shit, I can't imagine being bigoted in London. I love the diversity of it.

I have, in fact, met many people that are not "white."

And yet you still treat them like inhuman cattle or objects instead of acknowledging your shared humanity, without your conscience screaming at you.

I'm not convinced. I think you actually live in the most ridiculously white place on Earth.

[Zaras]

I am not a bigot, if you consider the meaning a person, who treats the members of a group with hatred, or intolerance.

And you advocated that immigrants be rounded up and thrown out of whatever country you live in.

I think you might actually live in Mississippi or somewhere similar.

[Zaras]

And you advocated that immigrants be rounded up and thrown out of whatever fuck-stained shithole pathetic country you live in.

I think you might actually live in Mississippi or somewhere similar.

I do not live in Mississippi.

Then please sound like it, instead of blabbering on about throwing immigrants out and all that dumb shit.

[Zaras]

I know my shit, you don't. Socialism has not taken over Europe, that is such an incredibly mothercuntfuckingly STUPID thing to say. The problem with the world nowadays is the increasing corporatization of it at all levels, coupled with a rotting and destroying of public services and subordination of everything to markets! If socialism would've taken over Europe, Europe would be a fucking paradise like Scandinavia!

You know what? You little piece of crap, YOU DON'T crap! And I'll tell you why, your little Corp. conspiracy is true because of renown Socialist George Soros he is corrupting the governments of Europe and now the US.

George Soros isn't a socialist, he's just a poser.

And just because you're so fucking concerned about me as opposed to making an argument that doesn't rely on name-calling, I actually do crap. I'm not constipated, silly.

[Zaras]

In Helsinki.

Which isn't all of Finland.

How come a crime is more worth paying attention to when done by non-native Finns as compared to crimes committed by native Finns?

Yeah, I can't find any figures for the rest of the country, but my point is still relevant.

Because you need to take it into perspective. Immigrants account for under 10% of Helsinki's population and around 2-4% nationally, though they are overblown when it comes to crime figures.

I'm not saying that the crimes are any worse because they are committed by foreigners, but don't you think that warrants some sort of special attention that such a small population commits a much larger proportion of crimes?

Yes, but it warrants attention intelligently and in the right way. Crime isn't something you solve by waving your dick around, getting "tough on crime", building more prisons and dumping people in them. It's something that needs a correct response - social policy, anti-poverty programs, investigations into what's causing resentments, targeting anything that could be causing crime. I'd usually add "education spending" but Finland already has a farkin' brilliant educational system, so that's clearly not the issue.

[Zaras]

George Soros isn't a socialist, he's just a poser.

And just because you're so fucking concerned about me as opposed to making an argument that doesn't rely on name-calling, I actually do crap. I'm not constipated, silly.

Look I gave my option and you just have to give your smart ass answer.

You did not make a single thing that can be described as a "counterargument" in your post. You just ranted like a homeless person whose soup'd just been spiked with a bad speedball topped with LSD flavouring and ecstasy cake.

Make a post that has some intelligent thoughts behind it and a grounding in reality first. Otherwise, you don't deserve anything but smart ass answers, since you're clearly not interested in debating.

[Zaras]

You did not make a single thing that can be described as a "counterargument" in your post. You just ranted like a homeless person whose soup'd just been spiked with a bad speedball topped with LSD flavouring and ecstasy cake.

I would take you seriously if you had some respect for anyone other than your self. But you don't and I'll just disregard you.

Earn my respect, dude. Write something that has a grounding in reality. Until then, why should I give you anything but sarcastic disdain?

[Zaras]

Yes, but it warrants attention intelligently and in the right way. Crime isn't something you solve by waving your dick around, getting "tough on crime", building more prisons and dumping people in them. It's something that needs a correct response - social policy, anti-poverty programs, investigations into what's causing resentments, targeting anything that could be causing crime.

Exactly my point. We're in agreement then.

At the same time however, increasing social benefits and throwing money at immigrants in the faint hope that they'll have a change of heart and suddenly be good isn't going to help either. If that's what you think.

No, I don't think that. But if we weren't talking about Finland, I'd probably say start by reversing another country's pattern of destroying its welfare state.

I'd usually add "education spending" but Finland already has a farkin' brilliant educational system, so that's clearly not the issue.

So they tell us. Though I'd assume it isn't the children committing most of the crimes.

Yeah, I doubt it too.

http://m.theatlantic.com/national/archi ... ss/250564/ <--- in any case.

[Zaras]

No, I don't think that. But if we weren't talking about Finland, I'd probably say start by reversing another country's pattern of destroying its welfare state.

Right. Now name me a country which has dismantled or attempted to dismantle its welfare state. And don't say the United States because it was never a welfare state to begin with.

The amount of cuts and "reforms" pushed through in the UK, and at least attempted to push through in Germany would result in the dismantling of their welfare states.

[Zaras]

Can we ignore Zaras nonsense? He is adding nothing to this debate other then inane 16 year old socialist spouting trash that is causing others in this thread to lose their tempers.

Sure, but how does that make you look when I haven't bothered to ignore anybody else?

[Zaras]

My view is that anyone on welfare who refuses a job when it's offered to them should have their welfare cut off. I guess some form of welfare is needed if a nation truly wants to be considered as first world. Though too large of a welfare state creates dependency and a weak or non-existent welfare system is just being heartless to the poor. A balance is always right.

man you must love workfare

Workfare is a grotesque joke when the jobs that you're supposed to work in aren't there.

[Zaras]

Anyone else find it ironic that our honorary anti fascist seems to be the most easily disposed to profanity laced intolerance of others opinions?

You can't tell the difference between intolerance and sarcasm? I thought the profanity made it obvious!

But it's hilarious how you accuse me of being intolerant towards your opinions when I've just wasted so many words and cursewords telling you it's a pile of shit. I never said your opinion should be censored, but I did say it can go to hell in a lot of words.

And I'm pretty sure I did reiterate at one point that I strongly believe in averting the liberal paradox whereby tolerance, when taken too far, ends up excusing, justifying and defending intolerance. None o' that crap for me.

[Zaras]

Thats what leftists do.You cant imagine how many times I have heard commies say 'dont let the fasccists speak' and I usually laugh at the irony

Those weren't communists, those were Stalin's cocksuckers. Please learn the difference.

[Zaras]

OK, so you're ignoring Zaras, who has an opposite (socialist) opinion to you, but then saying that fascists are discriminated against for not being heard out?

The irony is delicious.

[Zaras]

Νοt in greece my friend.They even try to ban golden dawn as a party.

Considering Greece's laws against Nazism and Golden Dawn's psycho violence, they could have some solid ground for that.

And we dont ignore zaras cause he is liberal, more likely cause he has no points and calls us 'bigoted' and 'idiots' cause his liberal ideas are superior to ours.

Well, yeah, I do think my ideas are superior to yours, and I distinctly remember making actual points and using facts. You just got distracted by all the insulting sarcasm.

[Zaras]

• Two-thirds of all Moroccan men in the Netherlands, and this is a group numbering more than 100,000 for those who will try to scream bloody murder about the sample size, have been arrested at least once by the time they're 22. Similar figures exist for Afro-Caribbeans (55%) and Turks (45%).

How much of that is inherent discrimination, like how black people are overrepresented in criminal statistics in the USA? You wouldn't suggest that black people are all criminals, would you?

Non-western immigrants in both the Netherlands and Finland, two countries known to have a great welfare system and virtually no real poverty, have crime rates and unemployment rates starting several times higher than those of the native population.

Considering the Netherlands' approach was to treat them like gastarbeiters and not give a fuck since they'd leave, this doesn't surprise me. A country shouldn't just dump immigrants in ghettos, and hope everything works out. It tends to blow up in their face.

Non-western immigrants throughout Europe have higher unemployment rates and crime rates.

Same thing as before - Europe didn't really treat immigration seriously in a lot of ways. Now they're stuck with the consequences.

There is a growing amount of islamic fundamentalists in Europe. There are unofficial and even some official shariah courts. There are also islamic rape gangs in Europe who rape white girls for 'asking for it by dressing like a whore and violating islamic norms'.

Fundamentalism should be resisted, but the way to do it isn't to stoke Islamophobia by telling everybody about Muslamic ray guns and sharia courts. Tabloidisation and fearmongering doesn't help, it only alienates the majority of non-fuckhead Muslims who feel like they're being discriminated against. This is an issue that needs to be approached in a level-headed manner, otherwise you risk sending moderate Muslims in the same team as the extremists due to frustration with institutionalised racism and discrimination.

Most of Europe's population has had it with immigration, but our governments and the European Union keep forcing it upon us.

Fuck most of Europe's population then for being stupid enough to eat sensationalised reports and succumb to xenophobic nationalism. Immigration is a good thing. If you're tired of immigration, you can't exactly be objective about it.

Adding to that, most Europeans have had it with the European Union itself.

I'm angry with the EU too, but unlike you, it's because I want the EU to stop fucking up and actually be a good thing. Unfortunately, it'd be difficult to overcome its design problems.

Multiculturalism is a lie.

No, it isn't. What do you want instead, oppressive monoculturalism?

And before our friendly Romanian - Ciprian Constantinescu, is that you? -

No, and I'm not telling you my name.

I live in an area where a large part of the population consists of non-western immigrants. And I live next to a city where almost half of the population consists of non-western immigrants and their offspring, and where crime rates are astronomical.

Have you tried actually looking at the factors behind it before jumping on the "all non-white immugrants iz crimmenulz" bandwagon?

[Zaras]

Lovely analysis. Yes, I fear the fact that some neighbourhoods in the city next to mine are practically under the control of human traffickers and islamists.

Do you have any actual basis for that fears? Gonna guess no.

[Zaras]

Most of Europe's population has had it with immigration, but our governments and the European Union keep forcing it upon us.
Adding to that, most Europeans have had it with the European Union itself.

Source. The rest I had noticed you posted sometime earlier, though citing arrest rates is bullshit as you well know.

Racism and being arrested for shitty crimes (selling drugs) play a large part.

It's funny how anti-multiculturalisis use bullshit and manipulated data, and somehow they're surprised people ignore it...