Fascist rise in europe

[Baltenstein]

There are obviously Greeks who share that mindset (or perhaps sympathize with the Golden Dawn's platform in parts) but everyone i've talked to in my family is against them, despite being from the lower/lower-middle class that's been hit especially hard.

That being said, if the more mainstream parties fail to make substantive improvements to governing, the economic infrastructure, etc....well I wouldn't be surprised at all to see them continue to grow.

They are already 3d party in charts...

Right-wing wankers holding the 3rd place in polls in a country's political system is unfortunately not uncommon in Europe. Look no further than France, the Netherlands, Austria, Switzerland, Turkey, Poland and, if I'm not mistaken, Denmark. It's unpleasant but fortunately, far from a seizure of power.

[Zaras]

Source?

http://www.protagon.gr/?i=protagon.el.article&id=17981

You just cited more Nazis again.

[Alaje]

I said this before...the individual has a fundamental human right to discriminate against or associate with any other individual or group as long as he peacefully respects the right of others to do the same.

I say it again.

There. Is. No. Such. Thing. As. A. Right. To. Discriminate.

End of fucking story.

Zar, chill with the bold caps bro.

I agree, there is a difference between simply having an opinion and actually acting out one's bigotry.

[The Nuclear Fist]

I wasn't aware that half a million Greeks constituted the majority of Greeks. It's quite a small minority, all things considered.

They still made it to the goverment and when did I say they are the majority?

Your previous posts seemed to be implying that all Greeks, or at least a majority of them, think the way you do. If you're acknowledging that you and your bigoted horseshit views are in the minority, then I apologise.

[Baltenstein]

http://www.protagon.gr/?i=protagon.el.article&id=17981

You just cited more Nazis again.

Protagon.gr and pontiki are well-known Greek news sites. However if you look at the actual polls, Golden Dawn has 10,5 % of the vote, which really isn't that much.

[Zaras]

Zar, chill with the bold caps bro.

Done. I figured I might as well bold caps the second sentence as well since it was missed the first time around.

I agree, there is a difference between simply having an opinion and actually acting out one's bigotry.

The latter is what a "right to discriminate" would imply.

[Melas]

They still made it to the goverment and when did I say they are the majority?

Your previous posts seemed to be implying that all Greeks, or at least a majority of them, think the way you do. If you're acknowledging that you and your bigoted horseshit views are in the minority, then I apologise.

Ι am not talking about a majority or a minority I am talking about individuals lots of them,I dont claim that everyone loves golden dawn,I have a classmate thats a member of the Communist Youth of greece,my father voted for siriza and my siter is an anarchist who went to vote just for the experience and will never do it again,she even threatened me she will never speak to me again if I join the party,lolz

[Zaras]

You just cited more Nazis again.

Protagon.gr and pontiki are well-known Greek news sites. However if you look at the actual polls, Golden Dawn 10,5 % of the vote, which really isn't that much.

My bad. I don't actually know Greek, and given Melas' record, I just figured he ass-pulled again.

At least SYRIZA is in the lead now, right?

[The Nuclear Fist]

Ι am not talking about a majority or a minority I am talking about individuals lots of them,I dont claim that everyone loves golden dawn,I have a classmate thats a member of the Communist Youth of greece,my father voted for siriza and my siter is an anarchist who went to vote just for the experience and will never do it again,she even threatened me she will never speak to me again if I join the party,lolz

Quantify 'lots of them' for me. How many are we talking, here? Certainly not the majority. A small minority? Perhaps.

[Zaras]

Ι am not talking about a majority or a minority I am talking about individuals lots of them,I dont claim that everyone loves golden dawn,I have a classmate thats a member of the Communist Youth of greece,my father voted for siriza and my siter is an anarchist who went to vote just for the experience and will never do it again,she even threatened me she will never speak to me again if I join the party,lolz

Melas, both your classmate and your family are cooler and have much more integrity, common sense and not bigotry than you.

[Inchon]

say you were a photographer and a group of homophobes wanted to hire you for a "gay bash" party. Do you have the right to refuse to work for them?

Don't try to end run me, you damn well know the answer is yes. You were advocating the right of voters to submit to their worst mob rule instincts and vote in a referendum to bash immigrants. There is no right to that.

Discrimination is something that can never be allowed at a level beyond the individual. There is no right to it.

No, I'm advocating the right of the individual to decide for themselves what is best for themselves irrespective of what anyone else believes. Your ideas may be different from mine and they may not (you might be suprised) but true tolerance is honoring and respecting the peaceful choices of others.

[Of the Free Socialist Territories]

Don't try to end run me, you damn well know the answer is yes. You were advocating the right of voters to submit to their worst mob rule instincts and vote in a referendum to bash immigrants. There is no right to that.

Discrimination is something that can never be allowed at a level beyond the individual. There is no right to it.

No, I'm advocating the right of the individual to decide for themselves what is best for themselves irrespective of what anyone else believes. Your ideas may be different from mine and they may not (you might be supprised) but true tolerance is honoring and respecting the peaceful choices of others.

Ejecting people from a nation en masse because of nationality, skin colour and/or religion is not a peaceful choice.

[Zaras]

Don't try to end run me, you damn well know the answer is yes. You were advocating the right of voters to submit to their worst mob rule instincts and vote in a referendum to bash immigrants. There is no right to that.

Discrimination is something that can never be allowed at a level beyond the individual. There is no right to it.

No, I'm advocating the right of the individual to decide for themselves what is best for themselves irrespective of what anyone else believes. Your ideas may be different from mine and they may not (you might be supprised) but true tolerance is honoring and respecting the peaceful choices of others.

Yes, I agree on that. But giving people a referendum on immigration is not true tolerance, or a peaceful choice.

Tolerance can never be taken so far as to tolerate, excuse and defend intolerance.

[Baltenstein]

Protagon.gr and pontiki are well-known Greek news sites. However if you look at the actual polls, Golden Dawn 10,5 % of the vote, which really isn't that much.

My bad. I don't actually know Greek, and given Melas' record, I just figured he ass-pulled again.

At least SYRIZA is in the lead now, right?

New Democracy leads by one percent.

[Delanshar]

It's perfectly understandable that the present European Crisis would cause a rise in right-wing ideologies. People need an alternative to the bureacratic and conformist EU, which constricts democracy and harms sovereignty and self determination throughout Europe.

[The Nuclear Fist]

true tolerance is honoring and respecting the peaceful choices of others.

True tolerance is acknowledging someone's beliefs and respecting their right to have them.

You don't have to respect or honour someone's beliefs to tolerate them.

[Inchon]

I said this before...the individual has a fundamental human right to discriminate against or associate with any other individual or group as long as he peacefully respects the right of others to do the same.

Said individual, however, does not have the right to enshrine unwarranted discrimination in law.

Agreed nor should the law force said individual to comply.

[The Nuclear Fist]

Agreed nor should the law force said individual to comply.

I would disagree, but this is a matter for a different thread and I'd rather not threadjack.

[Melas]

Ι am not talking about a majority or a minority I am talking about individuals lots of them,I dont claim that everyone loves golden dawn,I have a classmate thats a member of the Communist Youth of greece,my father voted for siriza and my siter is an anarchist who went to vote just for the experience and will never do it again,she even threatened me she will never speak to me again if I join the party,lolz

Quantify 'lots of them' for me. How many are we talking, here? Certainly not the majority. A small minority? Perhaps.

Αgain they are clearly not the majority,however more than 500.000 people voted for them,more will vote + the youth.Somewhere bewteen 1.500.000 and 2.000.000 I guess

[Inchon]

Agreed nor should the law force said individual to comply.

I would disagree, but this is a matter for a different thread and I'd rather not threadjack.

understood

[Zaras]

It's perfectly understandable that the present European Crisis would cause a rise in right-wing ideologies. People need an alternative to the bureacratic and conformist EU, which constricts democracy and harms sovereignty and self determination throughout Europe.

Oh, this "EU is undemocratic" shit again? Take it to the EU thread, please.

[Zaras]

My bad. I don't actually know Greek, and given Melas' record, I just figured he ass-pulled again.

At least SYRIZA is in the lead now, right?

New Democracy leads by one percent.

Damn!

[The Nuclear Fist]

Αgain they are clearly not the majority,however more than 500.000 people voted for them,more will vote + the youth.Somewhere bewteen 1.500.000 and 2.000.000 I guess

I'm going to need sources for those numbers.

[Melas]

Ι am not talking about a majority or a minority I am talking about individuals lots of them,I dont claim that everyone loves golden dawn,I have a classmate thats a member of the Communist Youth of greece,my father voted for siriza and my siter is an anarchist who went to vote just for the experience and will never do it again,she even threatened me she will never speak to me again if I join the party,lolz

Melas, both your classmate and your family are cooler and have much more integrity, common sense and not bigotry than you.

If by cooler you mean threating to call the fellow 'youth' to beat me up cause I said his party is a rotten joke of communism then yeah,he is so cool.

[Melas]

Αgain they are clearly not the majority,however more than 500.000 people voted for them,more will vote + the youth.Somewhere bewteen 1.500.000 and 2.000.000 I guess

I'm going to need sources for those numbers.

Dont have any,but according to the polls somewhere less than 1.100.000 people will vote for them so I guess its somewhere 1.000.000 and 1.500.000 (what i posted before was what I expect to happen)

I am sorry no sources,but its true that more than 500.000 people voted for them and more will on the next elections (according to polls)