Socialism vs. Communism

[Winsburg]

I have debated this subject with friends and most say socialism.I would like to know what you think and why. I am neutral on the matter.

[The USOT]

That this thread title is as relevant as debating Wood vs Oak.

You do realise that communism is a form of socialism right? And that socialism does not mean one specific economic style or form of governance, but covers many many different forms right?

[Winsburg]

That this thread title is as relevant as debating Wood vs Oak.

You do realise that communism is a form of socialism right? And that socialism does not mean one specific economic style or form of governance, but covers many many different forms right?

Socialisim[Socialism play /ˈsoʊʃəlɪzəm/ is an economic system characterised by social ownership of the means of production and co-operative management of the economy,[1] and a political philosophy advocating such a system. "Social ownership" may refer to cooperative enterprises, common ownership, direct public ownership or autonomous state enterprises.[2] There are many varieties of socialism and there is no single definition encapsulating all of them.[3] They differ in the type of social ownership they advocate, the degree to which they rely on markets or planning, how management is to be organised within productive institutions, and the role of the state in constructing socialism.[4]

A socialist economic system would consist of an organization of production to directly satisfy economic demands and human needs, so that goods and services would be produced directly for use instead of for private profit driven by the accumulation of capital. Accounting would be based on physical quantities, a common physical magnitude, or a direct measure of labour-time in place of financial calculation.[5][6] Distribution of output would be based on the principle of individual contribution.

As a political movement, socialism includes a diverse array of political philosophies, ranging from reformism to revolutionary socialism. Proponents of state socialism advocate the nationalisation of the means of production, distribution and exchange as a strategy for implementing socialism. In contrast, libertarian socialism proposes the traditional view of direct worker's control of the means of production and opposes the use of state power to achieve such an arrangement, opposing both parliamentary politics and state ownership over the means of production. Democratic socialism seeks to establish socialism through democratic processes and propagate its ideals within the context of a democratic system.

Modern socialism originated from an 18th-century intellectual and working class political movement that criticised the effects of industrialisation and private property on society. In the early 19th-century, "socialism" referred to any concern for the social problems of capitalism irrespective of the solutions to those problems. However, by the late 19th-century, "socialism" had come to signify opposition to capitalism and advocacy for an alternative system based on some form of social ownership.[7] Utopian socialists such as Robert Owen (1771–1858) tried to found self-sustaining communes by secession from a capitalist society. Marxist and Marxist-Leninist socialists seek to develop an economy based on scientific assessment and democratic planning. The Soviet Union and the Eastern bloc states established centrally planned economies, while Yugoslavia instituted a form of self-managed market socialism. The Hungarian and East German communist governments have experimented with varying degrees of markets, combining co-operative and state ownership models with the free market exchange and free price system for consumer goods and services.[8] After the collapse of the Eastern bloc, China and Vietnam moved toward the socialist market economy model, which consists of state-ownership and open-markets in both capital goods and consumer goods.]

[Costa Alegria]

So copy-pasting Wikipedia does what now? I'm surprised the dead horse has got any skin left now that it has been flogged so many times.

We need more Apple vs. world threads.

[Winsburg]

So copy-pasting Wikipedia does what now? I'm surprised the dead horse has got any skin left now that it has been flogged so many times.

We need more Apple vs. world threads.

Apple as in the tech company?

[Winsburg]

That this thread title is as relevant as debating Wood vs Oak.

You do realise that communism is a form of socialism right? And that socialism does not mean one specific economic style or form of governance, but covers many many different forms right?

And do you not know that these two thing are two VERY different forms of government. Was Russia socialist?No.Cuba?No.

[The USOT]

That this thread title is as relevant as debating Wood vs Oak.

You do realise that communism is a form of socialism right? And that socialism does not mean one specific economic style or form of governance, but covers many many different forms right?

Socialisim[Socialism play /ˈsoʊʃəlɪzəm/ is an economic system characterised by social ownership of the means of production and co-operative management of the economy,[1] and a political philosophy advocating such a system. "Social ownership" may refer to cooperative enterprises, common ownership, direct public ownership or autonomous state enterprises.[2] There are many varieties of socialism and there is no single definition encapsulating all of them.[3] They differ in the type of social ownership they advocate, the degree to which they rely on markets or planning, how management is to be organised within productive institutions, and the role of the state in constructing socialism.[4]

A socialist economic system would consist of an organization of production to directly satisfy economic demands and human needs, so that goods and services would be produced directly for use instead of for private profit driven by the accumulation of capital. Accounting would be based on physical quantities, a common physical magnitude, or a direct measure of labour-time in place of financial calculation.[5][6] Distribution of output would be based on the principle of individual contribution.

As a political movement, socialism includes a diverse array of political philosophies, ranging from reformism to revolutionary socialism. Proponents of state socialism advocate the nationalisation of the means of production, distribution and exchange as a strategy for implementing socialism. In contrast, libertarian socialism proposes the traditional view of direct worker's control of the means of production and opposes the use of state power to achieve such an arrangement, opposing both parliamentary politics and state ownership over the means of production. Democratic socialism seeks to establish socialism through democratic processes and propagate its ideals within the context of a democratic system.

Modern socialism originated from an 18th-century intellectual and working class political movement that criticised the effects of industrialisation and private property on society. In the early 19th-century, "socialism" referred to any concern for the social problems of capitalism irrespective of the solutions to those problems. However, by the late 19th-century, "socialism" had come to signify opposition to capitalism and advocacy for an alternative system based on some form of social ownership.[7] Utopian socialists such as Robert Owen (1771–1858) tried to found self-sustaining communes by secession from a capitalist society. Marxist and Marxist-Leninist socialists seek to develop an economy based on scientific assessment and democratic planning. The Soviet Union and the Eastern bloc states established centrally planned economies, while Yugoslavia instituted a form of self-managed market socialism. The Hungarian and East German communist governments have experimented with varying degrees of markets, combining co-operative and state ownership models with the free market exchange and free price system for consumer goods and services.[8] After the collapse of the Eastern bloc, China and Vietnam moved toward the socialist market economy model, which consists of state-ownership and open-markets in both capital goods and consumer goods.]

Funnily enough I am aware of socialism. Even your own wikipedia copy and paste proves my point that communism is a type of socialism.
Debating communism vs socialism is as silly as debating Oak vs trees. Not only is it nonsensical (as you cant critique communism against socialism considering it is a form of socialism) but why would you do it?
IF you further specified and compared specific branches of socialism against eachother within a specific context (e.g. best chance of revolution, greatest enforcer of liberty, internationalism vs nationalism etc) then we could not only have a thread, but perhaps a GREAT thread.
Currently however there is no debate.

[Winsburg]

I made this thread to discus and debate.

[The USOT]

That this thread title is as relevant as debating Wood vs Oak.

You do realise that communism is a form of socialism right? And that socialism does not mean one specific economic style or form of governance, but covers many many different forms right?

And do you not know that these two thing are two VERY different forms of government. Was Russia socialist?No.Cuba?No.

No they are not.
Communism is a type of socialism.
Your own wikipedia quote stated this.
Look up the communist mannifesto and you will hear it talk of communism as a form of socialism.
Hell for much of its history, Communism and Socialism are even interchangable as terms!
What Russia and Cuba called themselves has nothing to do with this. Personally I would consider both of them neither.

[The USOT]

I made this thread to discus and debate.

BUT THERE IS NOTHING TO DEBATE!!!!
I dont know how further I can clarify this.
You are asking us to argue in the style of the following.
Horror vs every genre including horror.
Football vs every sport including football.
Love vs evey emotion including love.

The premise is flawed.

[Seskany]

Communism is a form of socialism.
Socialism, as a spectrum, is about as broad and varied as the ways that Jim Morrison wishes to love you.
There is nothing to discuss/debate here, because there's no place to start comparison. Suggest another form of socialism, and then we can start a "vs. communism" funtalk. But from here, all that can be said is: Communism is to socialism as a mouse is to, uh, the entirety of mammalia.

[The Legion of Kane]

To be honest, I'd rather just pick the good things from both and integrate them into democracy.

[Disserbia]

What is this about? I don't like either and I think a lot of people think of Socialism as a temporary stage in the road to Communism. I think its all BS.

[4years]

Communism is a fom of socialism. You are basically asking every type of book including historical fiction vs. historical fiction.

[Andropoland]

Wow... it's like comparing a part to a whole, except both have varying definitions according to almost everybody you ask!

Flawed question is flawed, and Wikipedia is not the one-stop shop for definitions on delicate subjects...

[Saluterre]

Socialism is an economic system in which the workers control the means of production.

Communism is a social system in which class, money, and the state have been abolished and all private property is shared and utilized for the greater use of mankind.

Communism operates with a socialist economic system.

Apples and oranges...