If Obama Wins, Wither the Republicans?

[Wamitoria]

You've yet to realise the severity of the situation in the United States.

You would destroy the US just because the Democrats win?

The goal of the modern Republican Party's more extreme wing has been to rule over the rubble of a collapsed US for quite some time now. Why would YS be any different?

[Fnordgasm 5]

A-ha, clever, but your analogy does not compare. I'm not defending a faith-based system, and the threats to the American way of living and well-being of Americans are very real. If Obama wins, he's going to spend. Not only is he going to spend, he's going to push for the same European socialist policies, expand Government and disregard America's debt. The outcomes are predictable; famine, mass poverty just to name a few. How do I know this? because many nations have made the same mistakes that the US is making now, and it has always yielded the same results. What Obama is doing is insanity; pure and simple. I've met people who are so convinced that they're right that it's impossible to convince them otherwise even with all of the evidence in the world. Just look at Christians as an example. These people are dangerous in power, and unfortunately there are very few ways to deter them.

What the fuck happened to Europe that I haven't heard of? Last time I checked, there was no war, no mass poverty, no famines. So where the fuck is this coming from?

Ignore all the communist propaganda. That just an autonomous system we've set up. It's a complicated computer system that generates news from the European continent to make it seem that there's actually people living here when in reality we've all starved to death. I'm actually dead right now.

[Galloism]

What the fuck happened to Europe that I haven't heard of? Last time I checked, there was no war, no mass poverty, no famines. So where the fuck is this coming from?

Ignore all the communist propaganda. That just an autonomous system we've set up. It's a complicated computer system that generates news from the European continent to make it seem that there's actually people living here when in reality we've all starved to death. I'm actually dead right now.

Well, this proves one thing.

Socialism in computing is a good thing.

[Yandere Schoolgirls]

I'm sorry, I was unaware that Germany, France, and the U.K. were all starving. I'll revise my opinion in light of this fact. Oh, never mind, no, I won't. Because it's not true.

Well, it doesn't matter if you do. When your ideological decisions, for instance, negatively impact the citizens of the United States, it does. There will be no way to stop you through intellectual discussion, because people like you, excuse me, will not listen to common sense and logic regarding politicsSo. Intelligent discussion won't work. I can say "hey! I'm healthy, and I have my own healthcare. The constitution was suppose to limit Government, so allow me to have a tax reduction in order to avoid paying into a public system" You will simply ignore my rational, and push your agenda onto me. I can even give you concrete evidence that a private system is preferable, but it won't work. So for when or if Obama wins, intelligent discussion is over and the very few options that republicans have will be brutish if they're smart.

[Samuraikoku]

So for when or if Obama wins, intelligent discussion is over and the very few options that republicans have will be brutish if they're smart.

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH! *nods*

[New Bastion City]

You've yet to realize the vile blasphemy towards Allah and the prophet Muhammed

A-ha, clever, but your analogy does not compare. I'm not defending a faith-based system, and the threats to the American way of living and well-being of Americans are very real. If Obama wins, he's going to spend. Not only is he going to spend, he's going to push for the same European socialist policies, expand Government and disregard America's debt. The outcomes are predictable; famine, mass poverty just to name a few. How do I know this? because many nations have made the same mistakes that the US is making now, and it has always yielded the same results. What Obama is doing is insanity; pure and simple. I've met people who are so convinced that they're right that it's impossible to convince them otherwise even with all of the evidence in the world. Just look at Christians as an example. These people are dangerous in power, and unfortunately there are very few ways to deter them.

Yeah. I remember the last time I was in Sweden.

Starving people everywhere... And so poor that they had to bathe outside in lakes, even in the dead of winter.

[Galloism]

I can even give you concrete evidence that a private system is preferable, but it won't work.

Well, I'm very big on concrete evidence.

If you would like to make a thread and present this concrete evidence, I will certainly listen to you.

Who knows? You might even sway my opinion.

[Nationstatelandsville]

If they lose this election, they'll just drop Romney and reword the points he used to the extent that people who don't care/people desperate to love the party will think they've changed.

If they lose the midterms, they'll likely have the rug torn out from under them when young Republicans/middle-aged Republicans who are sick of their party's bullshit flock to either the Libertarians or the Democrats.

Either way, the Democrats can only profit if they win 2012 and 2014. If they lose either one, this coming exodus will likely be delayed, but I doubt stopped. The GOP's dug themselves a hole they can't escape - not that it will be long until the Dems figure out how to get themselves into one, too.

In the end, I think the political parties that will be here the day I die will be very different than the ones that were here when I was born - hopefully for the better. You can't get away with bullshit like you used to. The Internet has permanently broken the political machine. Sure, we don't notice it yet, because we live in a world with one generation that doesn't care about the Internet and votes like crazy, and another that does but has already made up its mind/doesn't care, but when the status quo has shifted... well, I can't honestly say. I'd like to think that things will be better, but I don't know.

[Laerod]

And which of these countries are currently in the grip of famine and mass poverty?

Ah! I know! Hungary!

[Saruhan]

I'm sorry, I was unaware that Germany, France, and the U.K. were all starving. I'll revise my opinion in light of this fact. Oh, never mind, no, I won't. Because it's not true.

Well, it doesn't matter if you do. When your ideological decisions, for instance, negatively impact the citizens of the United States, it does. There will be no way to stop you through intellectual discussion, because people like you, excuse me, will not listen to common sense and logic regarding politicsSo. Intelligent discussion won't work. I can say "hey! I'm healthy, and I have my own healthcare. The constitution was suppose to limit Government, so allow me to have a tax reduction in order to avoid paying into a public system" You will simply ignore my rational, and push your agenda onto me. I can even give you concrete evidence that a private system is preferable, but it won't work. So for when or if Obama wins, intelligent discussion is over and the very few options that republicans have will be brutish if they're smart.

Which is why the US government and the founders were natural allies of the Whiskey rebels-Nowaittheycrushedthemwithmilitaryforce, my bad

[Galloism]

And which of these countries are currently in the grip of famine and mass poverty?

Ah! I know! Hungary!

They just need a slice of Turkey.

[Laerod]

Ah! I know! Hungary!

They just need a slice of Turkey.

Letting Turkey into the EU is a socialist policy... D=

[Fnordgasm 5]

I'm sorry, I was unaware that Germany, France, and the U.K. were all starving. I'll revise my opinion in light of this fact. Oh, never mind, no, I won't. Because it's not true.

Well, it doesn't matter if you do. When your ideological decisions, for instance, negatively impact the citizens of the United States, it does. There will be no way to stop you through intellectual discussion, because people like you, excuse me, will not listen to common sense and logic regarding politicsSo. Intelligent discussion won't work. I can say "hey! I'm healthy, and I have my own healthcare. The constitution was suppose to limit Government, so allow me to have a tax reduction in order to avoid paying into a public system" You will simply ignore my rational, and push your agenda onto me. I can even give you concrete evidence that a private system is preferable, but it won't work. So for when or if Obama wins, intelligent discussion is over and the very few options that republicans have will be brutish if they're smart.

You compared Obama to Hitler and Stalin and advocated the violent overthrowing of a government in order to impose your views on an unwilling populace. Until you realise what's wrong with that I don't think you're in a position to speak to us about "intelligent discussion".

[Galloism]

Well, it doesn't matter if you do. When your ideological decisions, for instance, negatively impact the citizens of the United States, it does. There will be no way to stop you through intellectual discussion, because people like you, excuse me, will not listen to common sense and logic regarding politicsSo. Intelligent discussion won't work. I can say "hey! I'm healthy, and I have my own healthcare. The constitution was suppose to limit Government, so allow me to have a tax reduction in order to avoid paying into a public system" You will simply ignore my rational, and push your agenda onto me. I can even give you concrete evidence that a private system is preferable, but it won't work. So for when or if Obama wins, intelligent discussion is over and the very few options that republicans have will be brutish if they're smart.

You compared Obama to Hitler and Stalin and advocated the violent overthrowing of a government in order to impose your views on an unwilling populace. Until you realise what's wrong with that I don't think you're in a position to speak to us about "intelligent discussion".

To preserve democracy, no less.

[Transhuman Proteus]

I'm sorry, I was unaware that Germany, France, and the U.K. were all starving. I'll revise my opinion in light of this fact. Oh, never mind, no, I won't. Because it's not true.

Well, it doesn't matter if you do. When your ideological decisions, for instance, negatively impact the citizens of the United States, it does. There will be no way to stop you through intellectual discussion, because people like you, excuse me, will not listen to common sense and logic regarding politicsSo. Intelligent discussion won't work. I can say "hey! I'm healthy, and I have my own healthcare. The constitution was suppose to limit Government, so allow me to have a tax reduction in order to avoid paying into a public system" You will simply ignore my rational, and push your agenda onto me. I can even give you concrete evidence that a private system is preferable, but it won't work. So for when or if Obama wins, intelligent discussion is over and the very few options that republicans have will be brutish if they're smart.

What does that have to do with the fact these European countries with the European socialist policies are neither in the grip of famine or mass poverty? They have been at it for a while - shouldn't they be starving by now? It's been a while since I've been in Sweden or Norway, but when I was I didn't observe much famine. Or any famine. At all.

And is that the old religious argument of "oh, I could give you undeniable proof but wont because I know it wont change you mind?" - no, if you have concrete proof provide it. If it is as you say it will change our minds.

If it is only concrete proof in your fantasies face the fact it will be challenged. If you don't provide it you are simply confirming it doesn't exist but you want to pretend you have a leg to stand on - no one is going to buy it.

So for when or if Obama wins, intelligent discussion is over and the very few options that republicans have will be brutish if they're smart.

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH! *nods*

I think even Da Orks would look at that and go "and deze humies call us dum".

[Nationstatelandsville]

You compared Obama to Hitler and Stalin and advocated the violent overthrowing of a government in order to impose your views on an unwilling populace. Until you realise what's wrong with that I don't think you're in a position to speak to us about "intelligent discussion".

To preserve democracy, no less.

The only way to preserve democracy is to blatantly ignore it and overthrow it. If you weren't such commies, you'd know that.

[Unified Republic of Carpania]

If the GOP fades, it would be partly because because they allowed America to become multicultural when Dubya was in office. Minority voters who put racial identity politics before everything else (which isn't all of them, mind you) will vote for the Democrats no matter what the Republicans do. John McCain was a case in point. McCain and Dole ran as reach-across-the-aisle moderates who few people were enthused about and they lost; Reagan won his election. HW Bush won on Reagan's coattails, but lost after breaking his promise on taxes. Pandering doesn't win elections. Standing up for what you believe does.

As for predictions to future elections, I think we're going to see third parties get more power no matter the election's outcome. And I think the Republican field for the next open election will involve Rick Santorum, Rand Paul, Governor Jindal (particularly if it's in 2016), and Jeb Bush (as the establishment candidate) eyeing the top prize.

[Laerod]

If the GOP fades, it would be partly because because they allowed America to become multicultural when Dubya was in office. Minority voters who put racial identity politics before everything else (which isn't all of them, mind you) will vote for the Democrats no matter what the Republicans do. John McCain was a case in point. McCain and Dole ran as reach-across-the-aisle moderates who few people were enthused about and they lost; Reagan won his election. HW Bush won on Reagan's coattails, but lost after breaking his promise on taxes. Pandering doesn't win elections. Standing up for what you believe does.

What.

[Samuraikoku]

I think even Da Orks would look at that and go "and deze humies call us dum".

"Oi, dese 'oomies iz gonna get zogged!"

[Alien Space Bats]

<grabs metal ruler, dons habit, whacks knuckles all the way around>

Stop it! Stop it! Stop it!!!

<tosses aside habit>

Good. I always hated drag anyway. Now, a fine woman in a three-piece suit...

<shakes off image, focuses>

The purpose of this thread is not to debate whether Obama and his fellow Democrats are socialists, or whether Republicans are idiots. Even if exactly one of those statements is true, that's not germane to this conversation. Ixnay!

And as OP, I'm going to make an executive decision and say that, while civil violence may well be the response some conservatives choose, secession is simply not an option we should discuss here, primarily because it's not a feasible option at all.

Why is it not a feasible option? Because if you're looking at the so-called "red-blue" map of America, this is not the map that matters:

That map (i.e., the one directly above) is an illusion, one that makes it look like every person in Arizona is a Republican and every person in Pennsylvania is a Democrat. Obviously, neither of these two things is true. This is the map that matters:

This isn't like 1860, where Republicans and Democrats are cleanly divided along State lines. Rather, the real political maps has red and blue counties sprinkled everywhere, intermingled on a scale that has deep red townships just a few miles away from deep blue cities.

Why does that matter? Because if Republicans decide they want out of the political compact that says that the Party that wins the election gets to govern the country, there's isn't going to be some magical force that makes Republicans in Arizona willing to secede while Republicans in Pennsylvania just passively decide to live with the results. It Red America collectively reaches for its guns in an effort to avail itself of some kind of "2nd Amendment remedy", it will do so everywhere; Republicans in so-called "Blue" States will be just as eager to escape "tyranny" - via force - as their "Red State" cousins.

IOW, it won't be a civil war in the sense that the American Civil War was a "civil war" - i.e., a war of secession; no, it will be a civil war in the sense that the Russian Civil War was a civil war - i.e., a town-by-town, city-by-city, grab-control-of-the-reigns-of-power-and-while-you're-at-it-burn-your-neighbor-alive-in-his bed civil war. It will be a war in which the "Reds" rise up, not to break away from the Federal government, but to take control of the Federal government, to establish a "dictatorship of the bourgeoisie" - or, in Marxist terms, to stage a genuine counterrevolution.

It'll be Rwanda on a continental scale.

---

So now, getting back to the purpose of this thread, it is possible that the Republican response to defeat will be armed revolt. I think such a thing unlikely, in no small part because I don't think enough Americans are going to be willing to murder their neighbors in their sleep on the basis of the notion that Barack Obama and the Democrats are socialists. As pissed off as Republicans are, I just can't see the majority of them going postal over being forced to buy health insurance on the private market (even if it does end up being through a State-run public exchange) just because their employers opted not to pony up; nor can I see them committing genocide because Federal income tax rates might go back to where they were in 2000 (horror of horrors that such a monstrously evil thing would be!). Most of us - including even FOX News viewers - are just not that unhinged, foreign stereotypes of gun-toting Americans notwithstanding.

Now, if the conservatives are right (which they're not) and Barack Obama is an evil Islamofascist-Eurosocialist monster, there will be plenty of chances for them to take up arms and rebel once his Dastardly Evil Plan™ begins to fall into place - and in fact, the Patriotic Defenders of Christ, Mom, Virginity, Apple Pie & All Else That Is Wholesome & Decent In the World™ will probably want to let things get bad for a just while, if only to to drive the scales from the eyes of their misguided neighbors; after all, from a purely practical standpoint, grabbing your gun and cooking off several magazines at whatever's handy right now is probably... er, politically premature. All successful revolutions require a certain measure of realized grievance to motivate the masses into armed insurrection anyway, and we ain't there yet.

So for now, the question then becomes: What do Republicans do in the meantime, while Barack Obama and the Evil Democrats are still not yet obvious Agents of the Antichrist™?

[Samozaryadnyastan]

I for one would welcome our new democratic overlords.

Agreeing that I have no idea what either party actually stands for, I dislike what I'm led to believe the Republicans stand for, which is an opinion I've formed largely on the opinion of members and linked articles from this board.
And the quotes the Republican party seems to come out with.

But just like I welcome the next election in my own country which will most likely see the generational defeat of the Conservatives (and unfortunately, yet deservedly) the Liberal Democrats, I would very much be pleased with a 2012 defeat that actually tears the Republican party (as we know it) asunder.

[Fnordgasm 5]

If the GOP fades, it would be partly because because they allowed America to become multicultural when Dubya was in office. Minority voters who put racial identity politics before everything else (which isn't all of them, mind you) will vote for the Democrats no matter what the Republicans do. John McCain was a case in point. McCain and Dole ran as reach-across-the-aisle moderates who few people were enthused about and they lost; Reagan won his election. HW Bush won on Reagan's coattails, but lost after breaking his promise on taxes. Pandering doesn't win elections. Standing up for what you believe does.

As for predictions to future elections, I think we're going to see third parties get more power no matter the election's outcome. And I think the Republican field for the next open election will involve Rick Santorum, Rand Paul, Governor Jindal (particularly if it's in 2016), and Jeb Bush (as the establishment candidate) eyeing the top prize.

So how long have the minorities in the US been of one monolithic mind unwilling to change its mind when it comes to voting?

[Greed and Death]

A bit off to predict them withering, when they are all but guaranteed the House.

My prediction, if they lose the Presidency, they will refuse to pass a budget and this discussion will become moot because the federal govnerment has withered away.

Not ideal, but there are lesser degrees of society I can live with.

[Samozaryadnyastan]

If the GOP fades, it would be partly because because they allowed America to become multicultural when Dubya was in office. Minority voters who put racial identity politics before everything else (which isn't all of them, mind you) will vote for the Democrats no matter what the Republicans do. John McCain was a case in point. McCain and Dole ran as reach-across-the-aisle moderates who few people were enthused about and they lost; Reagan won his election. HW Bush won on Reagan's coattails, but lost after breaking his promise on taxes. Pandering doesn't win elections. Standing up for what you believe does.

As for predictions to future elections, I think we're going to see third parties get more power no matter the election's outcome. And I think the Republican field for the next open election will involve Rick Santorum, Rand Paul, Governor Jindal (particularly if it's in 2016), and Jeb Bush (as the establishment candidate) eyeing the top prize.

So how long have the minorities in the US been of one monolithic mind unwilling to change its mind when it comes to voting?

According to the last 'large' election thread [that I saw], minorities are treated in some models as one of the most unpredictable voting groups.

[North California]

Here's how it goes down:

Neo-conservatives loose all power, and the libertarians who have been infiltrating the GOP for the last six years take over.


or

Neo-conservatives, while holding on to their last bits of power, go even more extreme, pretty much banning libertarians like they did during the primary. We see a rise in the Libertarian Party and independent voters. GOP withers away, and Democrats win the next 5 or elections.