Affirmative Action

[Fluffy Coyotes]

The way I see it, it's fundamentally hypocritical for the same governments to tell private businesses not to discriminate while discriminating themselves. Go for one or the other.

Personally, though, I'd support an increased emphasis on making public sector jobs for those who have difficulty getting into the private sector, and high standards of meritocracy for these public sector jobs. There are a number of poor whites as well, after all.

[A Quickly Made Puppet]

It's blatant discrimination, giving money to those purely because of their skin color.

Maybe helping out those below a certain income level would be a better idea.

[Ethel mermania]

I support equality of oppertunity, not equality of result.

I support head start, I am against affirmative action.

[Norsklow]

As in Highest SAT score means get a seat,and if your SAT is not creme de la creme, you get to take the walk.

Asians are still being discriminated in workplaces. So we need more affirmative action in this area. Not less.

http://jab.sagepub.com/content/33/3/356.short

If you're talking about college admissions, those are usually based on merit anyways.

I'll believe in it actually delivering the goods when it does deliver - not when you indicate that the present policy hasn't delivered.

[Free Soviets]

what's funny about this is that it is so obviously disconnected from reality that you would think it was somebody mocking people who complain about affirmative action...only it is also literally exactly what they say. makes it impossible to judge on the merits.

anyways, there are still people alive today who threw rocks at black kids who dared go to the white school. and the legacy of that sort of thing continues in a huge way. hell, if you send out identical resumes with different names, the 'whiter' sounding name will get vastly more call-backs.

the past ain't even past.

You realize Affirmative Action has benefited mostly white women?

All economic indicators, higher education admissions’ practices, and corporate and law firm figures show that when it comes to leveling the playing field in the past 30 years, white women—not black men, black women or other persons of color—have gained the most ground.

yeah, and? women are just as deserving as anyone else of being treated fairly. since we have yet to achieve equity even between white women and white men, its not like we can hold the higher rate of improvement for white women over other groups against them. if anything, this is an argument for strengthening our affirmative action plans.

[Vazeckta]

When picking for jobs and college admissions, it's my view that race and sex should play no part. You pick who is best. You don't choose or not choose someone because of their skin color, sex organs, or with whom they share a bed. In a competitive environment like a workplace or college admissions, you get it because what you've done and accomplished deserves it, not because of who you are.

[Skywarp]

When picking for jobs and college admissions, it's my view that race and sex should play no part. You pick who is best. You don't choose or not choose someone because of their skin color, sex organs, or with whom they share a bed. In a competitive environment like a workplace or college admissions, you get it because what you've done and accomplished deserves it, not because of who you are.

Even race doen't play a part, some people want to make it the part. Lady who works with my wife was mentioning how her son had been to many interviews but hadn't had any job offers yet.... my wife asked her how he dressed and the woman's response was "He wears his good jeans and makes sure his grill is brushed." (and yes, she meant the grill which is put on front teeth) At which point my wife said that he may want to take out the grill and wear better clothes than jeans when he goes to interviews... at which point the woman said "That is racial discrimination!"

[Norstal]

Asians are still being discriminated in workplaces. So we need more affirmative action in this area. Not less.

http://jab.sagepub.com/content/33/3/356.short

If you're talking about college admissions, those are usually based on merit anyways.

I'll believe in it actually delivering the goods when it does deliver - not when you indicate that the present policy hasn't delivered.

Wat.

So because there's different types of affirmative actions and one fails it all fails. Okay. Look, I'm pointing out your notion that Asian-Americans are smarter or have higher SATs doesn't apply in workplaces. Only in college admissions. And even that doesn't work because colleges accept students based on merits.

You're saying something fails using irrelevant arguments. Stop that.

[Vazeckta]

When picking for jobs and college admissions, it's my view that race and sex should play no part. You pick who is best. You don't choose or not choose someone because of their skin color, sex organs, or with whom they share a bed. In a competitive environment like a workplace or college admissions, you get it because what you've done and accomplished deserves it, not because of who you are.

Even race doen't play a part, some people want to make it the part. Lady who works with my wife was mentioning how her son had been to many interviews but hadn't had any job offers yet.... my wife asked her how he dressed and the woman's response was "He wears his good jeans and makes sure his grill is brushed." (and yes, she meant the grill which is put on front teeth) At which point my wife said that he may want to take out the grill and wear better clothes than jeans when he goes to interviews... at which point the woman said "That is racial discrimination!"

Wait, that's racial discrimination? How? I'm confused..

[Norsklow]

You realize Affirmative Action has benefited mostly white women?

All economic indicators, higher education admissions’ practices, and corporate and law firm figures show that when it comes to leveling the playing field in the past 30 years, white women—not black men, black women or other persons of color—have gained the most ground.

yeah, and? women are just as deserving as anyone else of being treated fairly. since we have yet to achieve equity even between white women and white men, its not like we can hold the higher rate of improvement for white women over other groups against them. if anything, this is an argument for strengthening our affirmative action plans.

EVIDENCE!
if your status as a white woman gave you that advantage vis a vis other groups - not white - then I say it is high time that such white women were given the dirtiest end of the stick.
It is time to hold that EXACTLY against the likes of you.

Affirmative action is just a play between 2 white groups - at the expense of everyone else.


Nothing but municipal socialism.

[Skywarp]

Even race doen't play a part, some people want to make it the part. Lady who works with my wife was mentioning how her son had been to many interviews but hadn't had any job offers yet.... my wife asked her how he dressed and the woman's response was "He wears his good jeans and makes sure his grill is brushed." (and yes, she meant the grill which is put on front teeth) At which point my wife said that he may want to take out the grill and wear better clothes than jeans when he goes to interviews... at which point the woman said "That is racial discrimination!"

Wait, that's racial discrimination? How? I'm confused..

Indeed... you should be.

[Tunasai]

What we've done is counteract past racism with a new form of racism that favors the once repressed minority. I believe, any man of any race should be judged not on the color of his skin but on the intelligence he posses, the morals of his heart, and the desire of his soul to prove himself. Whether you are African American to Native American I believe they should be judged on their quality as an individual, as I expect to be judged. Not over the color of their skin

[Saiwania]

I'm fully against affirmative action and would push to undermine or repeal such programs if given the opportunity.

[Free Soviets]

When picking for jobs and college admissions, it's my view that race and sex should play no part. You pick who is best. You don't choose or not choose someone because of their skin color, sex organs, or with whom they share a bed. In a competitive environment like a workplace or college admissions, you get it because what you've done and accomplished deserves it, not because of who you are.

define 'best'
hint: you can't. not in any rigorous and reasonable way that will work in the real world. too many variables.

what you can do is look at who meets the standards you need met, and then look at other factors about them that might be important for various reasons. we do this all the time in hiring people. does this person seem like a good fit with the culture at work here? are they able to dress themselves? etc. well, it turns out that one of the relevant factors we can consider is workplace and school diversity. and it turns out that looking at this factor leads to real improvements for everybody. win-win.

[Free Soviets]

if your status as a white woman gave you that advantage vis a vis other groups - not white - then I say it is high time that such white women were given the dirtiest end of the stick.

why? are not women also underrepresented in the workplace, and especially in positions of power? what makes them less deserving of equality than others? we should implement better policies to improve the situation for everyone, not cut off some for making progress 'too fast'. pick your fights wisely and act constructively to fix problems rather than get bogged down in games of who is most oppressed.

[Big Jim P]

Affirmative action is nothing more than reverse discrimination.

[Norsklow]

if your status as a white woman gave you that advantage vis a vis other groups - not white - then I say it is high time that such white women were given the dirtiest end of the stick.

why? are not women also underrepresented in the workplace, and especially in positions of power? what makes them less deserving of equality than others? we should implement better policies to improve the situation for everyone, not cut off some for making progress 'too fast'. pick your fights wisely and act constructively to fix problems rather than get bogged down in games of who is most oppressed.

You've had all the advantages of race. - which no black or brown or yellow man had.
If anyone deserves a break, it ain't white women ! If you want to talk Oppressors, YOU are one of the Oppressors. Every word you utter in your defense only condemns you further!
Time to strip your lot from all you've gained through affirmative action!

[Free Soviets]

why? are not women also underrepresented in the workplace, and especially in positions of power? what makes them less deserving of equality than others? we should implement better policies to improve the situation for everyone, not cut off some for making progress 'too fast'. pick your fights wisely and act constructively to fix problems rather than get bogged down in games of who is most oppressed.

You've had all the advantages of race. - which no black or brown or yellow man had.
If anyone deserves a break, it ain't white women ! If you want to talk Oppressors, YOU are one of the Oppressors. Every word you utter in your defense only condemns you further!
Time to strip your lot from all you've gained through affirmative action!

see, this is stupid. why tear down those that are slightly ahead of you instead of building everybody up? its not like we can only help one group at a time...

[Yorkopolis]

why? are not women also underrepresented in the workplace, and especially in positions of power? what makes them less deserving of equality than others? we should implement better policies to improve the situation for everyone, not cut off some for making progress 'too fast'. pick your fights wisely and act constructively to fix problems rather than get bogged down in games of who is most oppressed.

You've had all the advantages of race. - which no black or brown or yellow man had.
If anyone deserves a break, it ain't white women ! If you want to talk Oppressors, YOU are one of the Oppressors. Every word you utter in your defense only condemns you further!
Time to strip your lot from all you've gained through affirmative action!

So you want to discriminate someone else because they discriminated someone? I'm sorry sir, but discrimination, no matter whom it is to, is wrong, always, wherever you are.

[Big Jim P]

Actually, let me re-phrase my previous post in the interests of accuracy: Affirmative action is discrimination, nothing more and nothing less.

[Norsklow]

You've had all the advantages of race. - which no black or brown or yellow man had.
If anyone deserves a break, it ain't white women ! If you want to talk Oppressors, YOU are one of the Oppressors. Every word you utter in your defense only condemns you further!
Time to strip your lot from all you've gained through affirmative action!

see, this is stupid. why tear down those that are slightly ahead of you instead of building everybody up? its not like we can only help one group at a time...

You support affirmative action. You're ahead of the curve. Time to pull you back waaaay behind the place that Rosa Parks had and put you DEAD LAST! You deserve nothing.

[Neo Art]

Affirmative action is nothing more than reverse discrimination.

It took THREE WHOLE PAGES for someone to trot this one out?

For shame NSG, for shame!

I mean, really, it's a completely meaningless phrase devoid of even the slightest bit of substance or intellectual nuance, but it's such an old chestnut someone usually could be counted on to leap on that grenade on page 1.

[Big Jim P]

Affirmative action is nothing more than reverse discrimination.

It took THREE WHOLE PAGES for someone to trot this one out?

For shame NSG, for shame!

I mean, really, it's a completely meaningless phrase devoid of even the slightest bit of substance or intellectual nuance, but it's such an old chestnut someone usually could be counted on to leap on that grenade on page 1.

Note: Truth takes one sentence. Bullshit takes three.

[Neo Art]

see, this is stupid. why tear down those that are slightly ahead of you instead of building everybody up? its not like we can only help one group at a time...

You support affirmative action. You're ahead of the curve. Time to pull you back waaaay behind the place that Rosa Parks had and put you DEAD LAST! You deserve nothing.

Does anyone else read this in the Gene Wilder's Willy Wonka voice?

"You get nothing! You lose! Good day, sir!"

[Neo Art]

Note: Truth takes one sentence. Bullshit takes three.

Meaningless gibberish, however, appears to take exactly two.