Affirmative Action

[Saiwania]

How, exactly, do you know that?

The fact is, this pathetic mangling of an argument has so been beaten to death, I can actually find something I already posted addressing it (subject of male privlege not white privilege, but the concept remains the same). I literally don't have to change a single word of what I said MONTHS ago.

Boo hoo! I'm a member of an historically disadvantaged group, so I feel the need for the government to force colleges/businesses to discriminate against others in order to benefit me!

[Mavorpen]

Based on the fact that I can go walking down the street at night and people won't randomly walk across the street so that they are on the opposite sidewalk, while my roommate (who is black, but otherwise of the same stature and build) can't walk down the same street without somebody randomly crossing the street.

The problem with your argument is that you're fitting everyone into a neat little box.

Society just isn't like that.

Where do you live? Because I could argue the same.

[Greed and Death]

Look if you think your disadvantaged just say your black on your applications, or like me say your native American.

[Mavorpen]

How, exactly, do you know that?

The fact is, this pathetic mangling of an argument has so been beaten to death, I can actually find something I already posted addressing it (subject of male privlege not white privilege, but the concept remains the same). I literally don't have to change a single word of what I said MONTHS ago.

Boo hoo! I'm a member of an historically disadvantaged group, so I feel the need for the government to force colleges/businesses to discriminate against others in order to benefit me!

I've never done this, nor do I advocate for this. How about you actually stop with the generalizations?

[Mavorpen]

Look if you think your disadvantaged just say your black on your applications, or like me say your native American.

For a job application? That's the stupidest idea.

[Neo Art]

Boo hoo! I'm a member of an historically disadvantaged group, so I feel the need for the government to force colleges/businesses to discriminate against others in order to benefit me!

Wait, who the fuck are you talking to? Seriously, again, I think you think you're being clever or profound here, but I honestly can't discern exactly what the fuck you're trying to say.

is this how you want to represent your side? Is this how you want to lead the charge? By being so pathetically bad at making an actual argument that you're forced to put up some strawman of your opposition as being nothing more than a mewling minority, with a hand out for "reparations", like some 21st century internet version of blackface?

Despite the fact that the person you're talking to is an upper class heterosexual white male?

Seriously? THIS is where you want to plant that particular flag?

REALLY?

[Norstal]

How, exactly, do you know that?

The fact is, this pathetic mangling of an argument has so been beaten to death, I can actually find something I already posted addressing it (subject of male privlege not white privilege, but the concept remains the same). I literally don't have to change a single word of what I said MONTHS ago.

Boo hoo! I'm a member of an historically disadvantaged group, so I feel the need for the government to force colleges/businesses to discriminate against others in order to benefit me!

I wonder if anyone knows how affirmative actions work at all.

[Skywarp]

You're wrong, the truth consisted of three in this case, whereas lying bullshit consisted of one.

Care to refute the statement then?

Fairly easy, because affirmative action does not bias people on the basis of characteristic [x]. In fact it implements systems to ensure that discrimination is not practiced. Now, you may content with things past under the supposed guise of "affirmative action" which aren't (such as race quotas) and as such were struck under that.... but it does not apply to the principal of affirmative action itself. Or in short, you're wrong by precept.

[Greed and Death]

Look if you think your disadvantaged just say your black on your applications, or like me say your native American.

For a job application? That's the stupidest idea.

Normally those don't ask except for HR purposes not used in hiring.

But university admissions, go for it.

[Mavorpen]

*shrug* That one-in-a-million exception is still going to receive the benefits of affirmative action, along with his children. How about we pursue the entirely reasonable policy of attaching these benefits to one's family's income level so we don't have ANY one in a million exceptions and the underprivileged folks get the help they "need" instead of handing it out like goodies based on sex or ethnic/racial lineage? Or are minorities not good enough to compete with poor white people for positions?

I really want to taste this myth of "minorities gets hired automatically." Because so far, I haven't experienced it.

Me too. I would tell my parents about this phenomenon so they can quit their jobs and get brand new ones within the span of a couple of hours.

[Saiwania]

I've never done this, nor do I advocate for this. How about you actually stop with the generalizations?

Perhaps I did go a bit too far, I apologize. But in my view, that is exactly what affirmative action is about in practice. You can't implement it without purposefully putting some groups at a disadvantage.

[Norsklow]

Boo hoo! I'm a member of an historically disadvantaged group, so I feel the need for the government to force colleges/businesses to discriminate against others in order to benefit me!

I wonder if anyone knows how affirmative actions work at all.

LABOURAffirmative Action Isn't Working

[Mavorpen]

I've never done this, nor do I advocate for this. How about you actually stop with the generalizations?

Perhaps I did go a bit too far, I apologize. But in my view, that is exactly what affirmative action is about in practice.

Except, it isn't.

[Norstal]

I wonder if anyone knows how affirmative actions work at all.

LABOURAffirmative Action Isn't Working

The American with Disability Act isn't working?

Then how come I keep seeing those blue wheelchair symbols everywhere.

[Norsklow]

Boo hoo! I'm a member of an historically disadvantaged group, so I feel the need for the government to force colleges/businesses to discriminate against others in order to benefit me!

I've never done this, nor do I advocate for this. How about you actually stop with the generalizations?

Hmmm. Wasn't that what I said to you in re Keynes?

[Mavorpen]

For a job application? That's the stupidest idea.

Normally those don't ask except for HR purposes not used in hiring.

But university admissions, go for it.

You know what employers do instead? They look at your name. If you have a "black name" you're less likely to get a callback from an employer.

[Occupied Deutschland]

*shrug* That one-in-a-million exception is still going to receive the benefits of affirmative action, along with his children. How about we pursue the entirely reasonable policy of attaching these benefits to one's family's income level so we don't have ANY one in a million exceptions and the underprivileged folks get the help they "need" instead of handing it out like goodies based on sex or ethnic/racial lineage? Or are minorities not good enough to compete with poor white people for positions?

I really want to taste this myth of "minorities gets hired automatically." Because so far, I haven't experienced it.

That is a myth, so it doesn't really have a taste.

I have never and will never claim that minorities get hired automatically due to Affirmative Action, that's ridiculous. The problem is weighting these people more because of their minority status at all. If we don't want discrimination in the workplace/college...how about we don't discriminate in the workplace/college?

[Norsklow]

LABOURAffirmative Action Isn't Working

The American with Disability Act isn't working?

Then how come I keep seeing those blue wheelchair symbols everywhere.

How come I see you claiming that you're still not getting the square deal?
I would support it - if it did. But it doesn't.

[Norsklow]

Normally those don't ask except for HR purposes not used in hiring.

But university admissions, go for it.

You know what employers do instead? They look at your name. If you have a "black name" you're less likely to get a callback from an employer.

Hear Hear!

Zip code works too.

[Gravlen]

One of the biggest problems with affirmative action seem to be that many of the critics doesn't know what affirmative action actually is.

[Birkinghamia]

You were arguing the whole time that that was "unfair".

You seem lost, perhaps a nap? Might help.

So, I guess you concede.

The whole time you argued that colleges choosing selectively was unfair. Then you said that it's up to colleges to decide who's qualified to attend.

You're not making sense. If I'm misunderstanding your position, please explain.

He's not "qualified"? Someone is deciding he isn't "worth" it? Someone in a room somewhere decides that because of some characteristic of him, he doesn't get to go to Harvard?

Sounds a WHOLE lot like discrimination to me.

I am not sure who you think should determine who is qualified to receive a college education, other than the college.

You've contradicted yourself.

And I disagree.

I know you do. You're wrong.

Are you under some silly notion that all opinions are valuable and yours needs some degree of validation simply because you believe in it? Lots of people believe in all sorts of damned silly things, you're no exception. Not all beliefs are equally valid.

Everyone has their own opinions of how qualified others' beliefs are.

I'm not sure what relevance this has to the topic we're attempting to debate.

[Mavorpen]

I really want to taste this myth of "minorities gets hired automatically." Because so far, I haven't experienced it.

That is a myth, so it doesn't really have a taste.

I have never and will never claim that minorities get hired automatically due to Affirmative Action, that's ridiculous. The problem is weighting these people more because of their minority status at all. If we don't want discrimination in the workplace/college...how about we don't discriminate in the workplace/college?

That's what Affirmative Action is trying to do on a racial, color, etc basis. While the disability acts address people with disabilities. You're pretending we are doing nothing about discrimination. We are.

[Greed and Death]

LABOURAffirmative Action Isn't Working

The American with Disability Act isn't working?

Then how come I keep seeing those blue wheelchair symbols everywhere.

You seem to be confusing accommodation with affirmative action.

[Greed and Death]

Normally those don't ask except for HR purposes not used in hiring.

But university admissions, go for it.

You know what employers do instead? They look at your name. If you have a "black name" you're less likely to get a callback from an employer.

See with a proper name and zip code for employment purposes and a proper check of minority status on university admissions, a white male can get the advantage of both.

Shoot with the new transgender movement the white male can claim to be a girl if he/she chooses.

[Norstal]

The American with Disability Act isn't working?

Then how come I keep seeing those blue wheelchair symbols everywhere.

How come I see you claiming that you're still not getting the square deal?

Do you have problems with reading comprehension or something?

There's different areas of affirmative action. It's not a single monolithic policy that encompasses everything about a person. Currently we have one that effectively protects disabled, veterans, etc. but not ones for others.

I would support it - if it did. But it doesn't.

You really think those ramps and those parking spots for the handicapped existed everywhere before the legislation don't you?