Anti-Americanism on NationStates

[Divair]

Then get out.

No because the nations I can afford to go to suck too.

I know that feel, bro.

[Yankee Empire]

Then get out.

Wow your objective is a nation populated by idiots.

There's a differance between believing your nations has faults and wanting to fix them and just saying "this country sucks I wish I didn't live here".

[Yankee Empire]

Then get out.

No because the nations I can afford to go to suck too.

Then perhaps you're the one with the problem?

[Zaras]

Letting people suffer isn't a virtue.

You're (probably) not understanding the variability i'm using the word "suffer" for.

It could be used akin to struggle.

Then use "struggle" and stop sounding like you think the fact that people suffer from deprivations and horrible things are somehow noble and virtuous.

[Zaras]

Wow your objective is a nation populated by idiots.

There's a differance between believing your nations has faults and wanting to fix them and just saying "this country sucks I wish I didn't live here".

One person can't fix every fault in the nation.

[Xanixi]

I'm sorry, what now? End embargoes? Trade with everyone? Capitalism?
How the hell did this jump from foreign policy regarding intervention to foreign polcy regarding economics?

An embargo is the same as an intervention,destroying a countries econmy eg Irans cubs etc is a an act of War,How many million Iraqi childern died because of the US led embargo on Iraq?

An embargo doesn't destroy an economy. It forces it to shift to other locations. Granted, any nation with big dependencies on the US (of which neither Cuba nor Iran have) will get tumbled, but it's not the same as sending in trops and deliberately killing people.

And it's not an act of war. That's absurd. 'Tis a nation's right to establish embargoes and eliminate any diplomatic/economy dependencies it may have on another. That does not constituate an declaration of war nor anything of the sort.

As for an accurate estimation as to how many children died due to US-imposed embargoes, I'm not sure. That's not exactly something I keep floating around in my head.

[Yankee Empire]

You're (probably) not understanding the variability i'm using the word "suffer" for.

It could be used akin to struggle.

Then use "struggle" and stop sounding like you think the fact that people suffer from deprivations and horrible things are somehow noble and virtuous.

I'm not in control of how you perceive what I say (that's been made abudantly clear).

But no it's not as if I were implying that Child starvation is virtous, because I don't believe that.

What I meant is in many grand projects whether of our own minds and bodies or of social organization, art , architecture and so on.

It often requires much sacrifice and struggle to attain a goal.

[Yankee Empire]

There's a differance between believing your nations has faults and wanting to fix them and just saying "this country sucks I wish I didn't live here".

One person can't fix every fault in the nation.

No they can't, but the collective whole of society is comprised of individuals. And all one can either do is try or do nothing, bitching is worse than doing nothing in my opinion.

[Ostroeuropa]

The best of america is something you can rally most rational people around.
Free speech. Freedom of and from religion. A Democratic government. etc.
It's seeing something so great and with so much potential fall and be marred by theocracy and bigotry that is the cause of a lot of anti-americanism. You'll find a lot of europeans are passionately "American" in their value system these days, and view a large chunk of the USA as being backward, theocratic, and despotic (The exact same reason the Americans hated europe for a long time.)
So, I think it's perfectly just to think if you are a republican voter you are evil etc. (Unless a libertarian or moderate business type, you know the types i'm talking about.)
And when america is headed by those types of republicans, perfectly rational to call them out on it and say they are the Saudi Arabia of the west.

[Oterro]

There's a differance between believing your nations has faults and wanting to fix them and just saying "this country sucks I wish I didn't live here".

Yep swimming up a waterfall while other people swimming past you are beating you and trying to drown you sure isn't a futile endeavor at all.

[Yankee Empire]

Whats so bad about Saudi Arabia?

[Yankee Empire]

There's a differance between believing your nations has faults and wanting to fix them and just saying "this country sucks I wish I didn't live here".

Yep swimming up a waterfall while other people swimming past you are beating you and trying to drown you sure isn't a futile endeavor at all.

Self defeating mental paradigm never solved anything.

[Divair]

Whats so bad about Saudi Arabia?

Are you kidding me right now?

It's a totalitarian monarchist theocratic hell-hole.

[Yankee Empire]

,

[Ostroeuropa]

Whats so bad about Saudi Arabia?

Despotism, Theocracy, Racism, Sexism, huge wealth gaps, lack of social services.
The only things that work are the churches, the secret police, and the army.
And even they don't work very well.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Whats so bad about Saudi Arabia?

Amnesty International is a good group to ask.

[Yankee Empire]

Whats so bad about Saudi Arabia?

Amnesty International is a good group to ask.

Not really.

[Jormengand]

-snip-

Learn to use tags properly, then we'll talk.

[Ostroeuropa]

Amnesty International is a good group to ask.

Not really.

Who is then?

[Yankee Empire]

Whats so bad about Saudi Arabia?

Despotism, Theocracy, Racism, Sexism, huge wealth gaps, lack of social services.
The only things that work are the churches, the secret police, and the army.
And even they don't work very well.

I really don't have anything against their monarchy, i'm not saying I like everything about them, but as a nation I don't belief the deserve as much grief as they get, then again I think the same about people who hate the U.S.

So what are you gonna do... just be apathetic to it I suppose.

[Yankee Empire]

Not really.

Who is then?

I'm not saying they aren't a legitmate group but they have a narrow sense of what's right and wrong and while I do agree with them on many issues I also disagree with them on many issues.

One should never go to them (or anybody really) as a one stop shop for truth.

[Shadowlandistan]

One of the things I have noticed on the NS forums is that anti-americanism seems to be very rampant. I have seen a lot of posters post things like "I hate America" and "Americans are crazy". And in addition to that I saw a poll on a thread about what people think the worst thing about America is and most people selected the option that the problem is the Americans. I don't understand why there is all of this America bashing here. The United States is the greatest country there is. Most other free nations based their constitutions off ours, if it wasn't for us then it is very likely that most or all of Europe and Asia would be under the control of Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy, and Imperial Japan. It was American humanitarian aid that helped put Europe back on it's feet after the war. We are also the ones that thwarted North Koreas attempt to conquer South Korea. We are the ones who led the free world to victory in the Cold War. When it comes to giving aid to other countries in need it is America that is the most generous. We give several times more humanitarian aid and money to poor nations than any other country. We have the third largest population, third largest land area, largest economy, and the most powerful military. I admit that America does have it's flaws but as President William Clinton said "there is nothing wrong in America that can't be fixed with what is right in America". Every country has it's flaws and home countries of these anti-americans atre surely no exception. So tell me this. Why is anti-americanism so rampant here?

I'm an American and can tell you we are NOT the best, or most free nation there is. I love America and wish we were, but since the early 80's we have been slipping gradually, because of extreme conservative policies. In the 40s we WERE the greatest, as we had FDR's new deal to spur economic growth. Our civil liberties record has become a DISGRACE, with 5% of the worlds population and 1/4th of its prison population.

We can be the best, but in order for that to happen we need to slide our political compass to the left. It won't be an easy fix, but politicians/even so called "liberals" aren't driving us in that direction. It's very sad, but to not acknowledge our problems and still waiving the #1 finger looks, and is stupid to the rest of the world.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Amnesty International is a good group to ask.

Not really.

Okay. Other than a group whose entire rasion d'etre is the recording and publicizing of every human rights abuse that they can find around the world, who would you suggest as a valid source? Or are you simply discarding the evidence presented because it doesn't agree with some preconceived notion of yours?

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Who is then?

I'm not saying they aren't a legitmate group but they have a narrow sense of what right and wrong and while I do agree with them on many issues I also disagree with them on many issues.

One should never got to them (or anybody really) as a one stop shop for truth.

You didn't answer the question. You stated that Amnesty International had "a narrow sense of right and wrong", when the question was not "Why isn't Amnesty International a good source?", but rather "Who is a good source?" You haven't given any links, any source, anything at all to back your idea that Saudi Arabia isn't that bad.

[Oterro]

Yep swimming up a waterfall while other people swimming past you are beating you and trying to drown you sure isn't a futile endeavor at all.

Self defeating mental paradigm never solved anything.

No, I'm correct. Fighting against, and to save, a people that treat any alternative and new idea as high treason and blasphemy is a moronic and perverse endeavor. I can't blame thousands of Americans for feeling isolated from such cretins and I wouldn't dissuade them from ditching the poor hand they were dealt.

Let them stand for themselves.