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C.S. Lewis's Irrefutable Proof of Christianity (Or God)

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Todlichebujoku
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Founded: Feb 24, 2012
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Todlichebujoku » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:09 pm

Takaram wrote:Well, I saw this thread two hours ago when it was made, and now it has 18 (probably 19 by the time this gets posts) pages. Glad to see NSG is as fired up as ever.

Well, Logiko doesn't seem to be on right now.. Wait, how many was NSG supposed to get?
早晨!ToBu for short.
[violet] wrote:You are my go-to nation for long names.
Oct 16 2018- Indo States wrote:YOU'RE FALSE TOBU
Apr 21 2020- Llalta wrote:omg tobu you’ve literally given me asthma with ur art

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Veladio
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Ex-Nation

Postby Veladio » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:09 pm

Oh joy...he's back. :palm: My first day back on NSG and I run into an LC thread.
I am a Wiccan. Do not assume I am an Atheist in Religion threads simply because I support complete Secularization of Government Entities.

Social Libertarian (could care less about Economics, there are people who are more educated at it, so it is a waste of time to try and debate me on it.). As stated above I am a Wiccan, and I find solidarity with the Egyptian Deities. I support government secularization as well as complete freedom of religion, as I believe that to truly be secular, the state must respect all beliefs, and favor none. And I recently enlisted in the United States Navy.

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Takaram
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Founded: Feb 23, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Takaram » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:10 pm

Todlichebujoku wrote:
Takaram wrote:Well, I saw this thread two hours ago when it was made, and now it has 18 (probably 19 by the time this gets posts) pages. Glad to see NSG is as fired up as ever.

Well, Logiko doesn't seem to be on right now.. Wait, how many was NSG supposed to get?


I would have figured at least 25 by now :p

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Hurdegaryp
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Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Postby Hurdegaryp » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:11 pm

It must be the time of the year. I've been gone for a while, seems like NationStates has only become more popular during my absence. Using C.S. Lewis' logic, that probably proofs that there is not a benevolent God. This forum is a cruel and chaotic place, pretty much like the world in general. Given human nature, one could argue that Creation serves as a perverse combination of reality TV and a global arena deathmatch, all for the entertainment of a sadistic God that actually did create us in his image in every unfortunate and malicious way!
CVT Temp wrote:I mean, we can actually create a mathematical definition for evolution in terms of the evolutionary algorithm and then write code to deal with abstract instances of evolution, which basically equates to mathematical proof that evolution works. All that remains is to show that biological systems replicate in such a way as to satisfy the minimal criteria required for evolution to apply to them, something which has already been adequately shown time and again. At this point, we've pretty much proven that not only can evolution happen, it pretty much must happen since it's basically impossible to prevent it from happening.

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Individuality-ness
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Founded: Mar 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Individuality-ness » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:12 pm

Xeng He wrote:
Individuality-ness wrote:Why does God know all the right choices?

He made the system, he gets to decide.

My mother made me, and she makes mistakes in judgement all the time. She doesn't know all the right choices. And I'm a legal adult. Does she still decide what is right for me?

Xeng He wrote:
Individuality-ness wrote:Why does He have to be the end-all of all morals?

In a way, he doesn't, but there really isn't any alternative either, so...

So we should just obey our elders for eternity and not learn how to define our own morals? And what if we disagree with one of His morals? Do we still have no right to dissent?

Xeng He wrote:
Individuality-ness wrote:And how does one justify His hypocrisy?

He created us, we owe him everything.

My mother created me, do I owe her a house and half of my future salary to repay all that she gave me?

Xeng He wrote:Theoretically. :unsure:

(I'm kind of doing Devil's Advocate here...)

(I know, but of course, might as well give an argument in response, right? I'm not a great debater either...)
Last edited by Individuality-ness on Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:13 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"I should have listened to her, so hard to keep control. We kept on eating but our bloated bellies still not full."
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Todlichebujoku
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Founded: Feb 24, 2012
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Todlichebujoku » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:13 pm

Veladio wrote:Oh joy...he's back. :palm: My first day back on NSG and I run into an LC thread.

Be joyful, 'tis not Karrasjfa;fjasjdtjoiwetkjstan.
早晨!ToBu for short.
[violet] wrote:You are my go-to nation for long names.
Oct 16 2018- Indo States wrote:YOU'RE FALSE TOBU
Apr 21 2020- Llalta wrote:omg tobu you’ve literally given me asthma with ur art

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Individuality-ness
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Ex-Nation

Postby Individuality-ness » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:14 pm

Todlichebujoku wrote:
Veladio wrote:Oh joy...he's back. :palm: My first day back on NSG and I run into an LC thread.

Be joyful, 'tis not Karrasjfa;fjasjdtjoiwetkjstan.

Damn it, you jinxed it!

:P
"I should have listened to her, so hard to keep control. We kept on eating but our bloated bellies still not full."
Poetry Thread | How to Not Rape | Aspergers v. Assburgers | You Might be an Altie If... | Factbook/Extension

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Mavorpen
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Ex-Nation

Postby Mavorpen » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:14 pm

Todlichebujoku wrote:
Veladio wrote:Oh joy...he's back. :palm: My first day back on NSG and I run into an LC thread.

Be joyful, 'tis not Karrasjfa;fjasjdtjoiwetkjstan.

I lol'd for some reason.
"The Nixon campaign in 1968, and the Nixon White House after that, had two enemies: the antiwar left and black people. You understand what I'm saying? We knew we couldn't make it illegal to be either against the war or black, but by getting the public to associate the hippies with marijuana and blacks with heroin, and then criminalizing both heavily, we could disrupt those communities. We could arrest their leaders. raid their homes, break up their meetings, and vilify them night after night on the evening news. Did we know we were lying about the drugs? Of course we did."—former Nixon domestic policy chief John Ehrlichman

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Tsaraine
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Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Postby Tsaraine » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:15 pm

Individuality-ness wrote:
Xeng He wrote:He created us, we owe him everything.

My mother created me, do I owe her a house and half of my future salary to repay all that she gave me?


Of course not, don't be silly. You owe her all of your future salary, and you have to give it to her with a smile. She loves you and knows better than you and is entirely justified in killing you if you should disagree.

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The Tiger Kingdom
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Founded: May 04, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby The Tiger Kingdom » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:16 pm

Individuality-ness wrote:
Todlichebujoku wrote:Be joyful, 'tis not Karrasjfa;fjasjdtjoiwetkjstan.

Damn it, you jinxed it!

:P

NO! DON'T SAY - OR EVEN ABBREVIATE - ITS NAME!
WHO KNOWS WHAT HORRORS WILL BE UNLEASHED!
When the war is over
Got to start again
Try to hold a trace of what it was back then
You and I we sent each other stories
Just a page I'm lost in all its glory
How can I go home and not get blown away

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Forsher
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Founded: Jan 30, 2012
New York Times Democracy

Postby Forsher » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:17 pm

Death Metal wrote:I mean, seriously, if we're going to base anything on a Lewis, it should be Carrol Lewis.

'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe;
All mimsy were the borogoves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.

"Beware the Jabberwock, my son!
The jaws that bite, the claws that catch!
Beware the Jubjub bird, and shun
The frumious Bandersnatch!"

He took his vorpal sword in hand:
Long time the manxome foe he sought—
So rested he by the Tumtum tree,
And stood awhile in thought.

And as in uffish thought he stood,
The Jabberwock, with eyes of flame,
Came whiffling through the tulgey wood,
And burbled as it came!

One, two! One, two! and through and through
The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
He left it dead, and with its head
He went galumphing back.

"And hast thou slain the Jabberwock?
Come to my arms, my beamish boy!
O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay!"
He chortled in his joy.

'Twas brillig, and the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe;
All mimsy were the borogoves,
And the mome raths outgrabe.


Because vorpal swords go snicker-snack, therefore Jesus was actually the Jabberwock, ergo God is actually a Bhuddist.


FIrstly, it's Lewis Carrol. Secondly, it's the Rev. Charles Dodgson, a mathemetician.
That it Could be What it Is, Is What it Is

Stop making shit up, though. Links, or it's a God-damn lie and you know it.

The normie life is heteronormie

We won't know until 2053 when it'll be really obvious what he should've done. [...] We have no option but to guess.

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The Tiger Kingdom
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Founded: May 04, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby The Tiger Kingdom » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:18 pm

Tsaraine wrote:
Individuality-ness wrote:My mother created me, do I owe her a house and half of my future salary to repay all that she gave me?


Of course not, don't be silly. You owe her all of your future salary, and you have to give it to her with a smile. She loves you and knows better than you and is entirely justified in killing you if you should disagree.

Tsar, you've got it right.
And if you even think of doing something she told you not to do (you're doing it now!), you committed that sin, in your heart. GUILTY! Just like that.
Last edited by The Tiger Kingdom on Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
When the war is over
Got to start again
Try to hold a trace of what it was back then
You and I we sent each other stories
Just a page I'm lost in all its glory
How can I go home and not get blown away

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Germanic Templars
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Founded: Jul 01, 2011
Capitalist Paradise

Postby Germanic Templars » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:18 pm

Individuality-ness wrote:
Germanic Templars wrote:VIVA REVOLUTION!!!!!!!!!!

Kari, is that you? :P


NO, only the awesome power of GT!
Image
Last edited by Germanic Templars on Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

  • INTP
  • All American Patriotic Constitutionalist/Classic libertarian (with fiscal conservatism)
  • Religiously Tolerant
  • Roman Catholic
  • Hoplophilic/ammosexual
  • X=3.13, Y=2.41
  • Supports the Blue


I support Capitalism do you? If so, put this in your sig.

XY = Male, XX = Female

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Todlichebujoku
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Founded: Feb 24, 2012
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Todlichebujoku » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:19 pm

The Tiger Kingdom wrote:
Individuality-ness wrote:Damn it, you jinxed it!

:P

NO! DON'T SAY - OR EVEN ABBREVIATE - ITS NAME!
WHO KNOWS WHAT HORRORS WILL BE UNLEASHED!

BUT... KATGANISTAN!!!!
早晨!ToBu for short.
[violet] wrote:You are my go-to nation for long names.
Oct 16 2018- Indo States wrote:YOU'RE FALSE TOBU
Apr 21 2020- Llalta wrote:omg tobu you’ve literally given me asthma with ur art

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Individuality-ness
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Founded: Mar 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Individuality-ness » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:20 pm

Tsaraine wrote:
Individuality-ness wrote:My mother created me, do I owe her a house and half of my future salary to repay all that she gave me?

Of course not, don't be silly. You owe her all of your future salary, and you have to give it to her with a smile. She loves you and knows better than you and is entirely justified in killing you if you should disagree.

Damn it. Obedient daughter standard strikes again!

The Tiger Kingdom wrote:Tsar, you've got it right.
And if you even thinkof doing something she told you not to do (you're doing it now!), you committed that sin, in your heart. GUILTY! Just like that.

MOTHER, I'M SORRY! I'M SORRY FOR TAKING MY HYPOTHYROID MEDICATION AND DISOBEYING YOUR ORDERS! FORGIVE ME!

The Tiger Kingdom wrote:
Individuality-ness wrote:Damn it, you jinxed it!

:P

NO! DON'T SAY - OR EVEN ABBREVIATE - ITS NAME!
WHO KNOWS WHAT HORRORS WILL BE UNLEASHED!

It's already been unleashed! Hide!
"I should have listened to her, so hard to keep control. We kept on eating but our bloated bellies still not full."
Poetry Thread | How to Not Rape | Aspergers v. Assburgers | You Might be an Altie If... | Factbook/Extension

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The Tiger Kingdom
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Founded: May 04, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby The Tiger Kingdom » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:21 pm

Todlichebujoku wrote:
The Tiger Kingdom wrote:NO! DON'T SAY - OR EVEN ABBREVIATE - ITS NAME!
WHO KNOWS WHAT HORRORS WILL BE UNLEASHED!

BUT... KATGANISTAN!!!!

That one's not quite as immediately rife with dangerous consequences. Better than the alternative.
When the war is over
Got to start again
Try to hold a trace of what it was back then
You and I we sent each other stories
Just a page I'm lost in all its glory
How can I go home and not get blown away

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Ifreann
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Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Ifreann » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:22 pm

Christmahanikwanzikah wrote:
Death Metal wrote:
Prove that "that" exists.


Prove that

Prove.

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Individuality-ness
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Founded: Mar 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Individuality-ness » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:22 pm

Germanic Templars wrote:
Individuality-ness wrote:Kari, is that you? :P

NO, only the awesome1 power of GT!
Image

1. [citation needed]

The Tiger Kingdom wrote:
Todlichebujoku wrote:BUT... KATGANISTAN!!!!

That one's not quite as immediately rife with dangerous consequences. Better than the alternative.

No. No. Not... Seductions...
"I should have listened to her, so hard to keep control. We kept on eating but our bloated bellies still not full."
Poetry Thread | How to Not Rape | Aspergers v. Assburgers | You Might be an Altie If... | Factbook/Extension

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San Leggera
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Ex-Nation

Postby San Leggera » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:23 pm

Doavquas wrote:As a fellow brother in Christ I'd like to remind you that we don't have to "prove" God. He already does that, (Romans 1 starting in verse 18). Just show His love to all people! :hug:

The bible proving the existence of god is about as viable as the Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe proving the existence of Aslan.
#JusticeForGat
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I Just Want to Sell Out My Funeral

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Tsaraine
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Founded: Antiquity
Ex-Nation

Postby Tsaraine » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:23 pm

Todlichebujoku wrote:
The Tiger Kingdom wrote:NO! DON'T SAY - OR EVEN ABBREVIATE - ITS NAME!
WHO KNOWS WHAT HORRORS WILL BE UNLEASHED!

BUT... KATGANISTAN!!!!


Now look what you've done. This planet was perfectly fine, and now we'll have to get a new one. I hope you're happy.

To get back to the topic - CS Lewis, like most apologists for X, is flawed in his arguments because he presupposes that X is correct; he's starting with the result he desires ("God exists and is as described in the Bible") and working backwards from that point. As a result, he's unable to effectively consider the possibility that God does not exist, or is not as described in the Bible; and thus he gets rings run around him by thinkers who are more willing to consider alternatives.

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Individuality-ness
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Founded: Mar 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Individuality-ness » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:24 pm

Tsaraine wrote:
Todlichebujoku wrote:BUT... KATGANISTAN!!!!

Now look what you've done. This planet was perfectly fine, and now we'll have to get a new one. I hope you're happy.

To get back to the topic - CS Lewis, like most apologists for X, is flawed in his arguments because he presupposes that X is correct; he's starting with the result he desires ("God exists and is as described in the Bible") and working backwards from that point. As a result, he's unable to effectively consider the possibility that God does not exist, or is not as described in the Bible; and thus he gets rings run around him by thinkers who are more willing to consider alternatives.

In other words, circular logic, Tsar?
"I should have listened to her, so hard to keep control. We kept on eating but our bloated bellies still not full."
Poetry Thread | How to Not Rape | Aspergers v. Assburgers | You Might be an Altie If... | Factbook/Extension

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San Leggera
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Posts: 13414
Founded: Dec 15, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby San Leggera » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:24 pm

Individuality-ness wrote:
The Tiger Kingdom wrote:That one's not quite as immediately rife with dangerous consequences. Better than the alternative.

No. No. Not... Seductions...

Seductions is still miles better than me when I'm caffeine deprived.
#JusticeForGat
Flag | CoA | Map (bigger!)
I Just Want to Sell Out My Funeral

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Todlichebujoku
Senator
 
Posts: 4839
Founded: Feb 24, 2012
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Todlichebujoku » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:24 pm

Individuality-ness wrote:
Germanic Templars wrote:NO, only the awesome1 power of GT!

1. [citation needed]

The Tiger Kingdom wrote:That one's not quite as immediately rife with dangerous consequences. Better than the alternative.

No. No. Not... Seductions...

Seductions? Seductions????!!!
*hides in a closet*
早晨!ToBu for short.
[violet] wrote:You are my go-to nation for long names.
Oct 16 2018- Indo States wrote:YOU'RE FALSE TOBU
Apr 21 2020- Llalta wrote:omg tobu you’ve literally given me asthma with ur art

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Individuality-ness
Post Czar
 
Posts: 37712
Founded: Mar 02, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Individuality-ness » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:25 pm

San Leggera wrote:
Individuality-ness wrote:No. No. Not... Seductions...

Seductions is still miles better than me when I'm caffeine deprived.

But... her twisted, sadistic evil, her eyes, her knives...
"I should have listened to her, so hard to keep control. We kept on eating but our bloated bellies still not full."
Poetry Thread | How to Not Rape | Aspergers v. Assburgers | You Might be an Altie If... | Factbook/Extension

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Imsogone
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7280
Founded: Dec 18, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Imsogone » Fri Sep 07, 2012 6:26 pm

Individuality-ness wrote:
Tsaraine wrote:Now look what you've done. This planet was perfectly fine, and now we'll have to get a new one. I hope you're happy.

To get back to the topic - CS Lewis, like most apologists for X, is flawed in his arguments because he presupposes that X is correct; he's starting with the result he desires ("God exists and is as described in the Bible") and working backwards from that point. As a result, he's unable to effectively consider the possibility that God does not exist, or is not as described in the Bible; and thus he gets rings run around him by thinkers who are more willing to consider alternatives.

In other words, circular logic, Tsar?


So he reverse-engineered God and thus created him. Cool.
"Normal is an illusion. What is normal for the spider is chaos for the fly" - Morticia Adams.

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