Why are there so many left-wingers on NSG?

[RB Rebecca Black]

I would put my money that most of the users on here are aged 12-35. That alone shows leftism.

[The Land Fomerly Known as Ligerplace]

I would put my money that most of the users on here are aged 12-35. That alone shows leftism.

My god, that avatar.

Where in the literal hell did you get cursed with such a thing?

[Selsada]

I really can't see the link between age and politics...

[Sondstead]

1. I know that the vast majority of welfare recipients are white, and that welfare abuse is not that high of a percentage. However, it happens and a lot of it isn't caught. The trick is to disincentivize staying for extended periods of time on welfare without a good reason (economic recession, disability, illness, etc) while getting help to those that need it.

I apologize. I certainly did not mean to imply anything about you personally and I intended to make that clear but forgot to.

2. As for income disparity, some inequality is inevitable- not everyone has equal earning potential- and making sure everyone is equal isn't even fair. However, everyone should be entitled to education and healthcare- the former being important for social mobility and the latter because illness can happen to anyone. There's also a balance between complete inequality and equality- with complete inequality nobody has money, while with complete equality nobody has enough to create businesses of any significant size and scope to provide goods and services for large numbers of people.

Certainly. Really, that seems like a social democratic position in my view.

[North Calaveras]

I really can't see the link between age and politics...

Same here u had fifty year old nazis, age dosnt mean correct but I will say that with age come wisdom, even then it depends

[Free Soviets]

Means tested aid is bureaucratically complicated, inefficient, and creates traps like this. If you want to make a social efficiency argument, people would be much more productive if everyone got a certain level of housing or food benefits regardless of their wealth. Not only would the bureaucracy and enforcement be simpler, it would also mean that no one would have a disincentive to earn more.

Hmmm. Wouldn't it also mean that no one would have a incentive to earn more if they are permanently assure certain things regardless of what they contribute to society?

it seems to me that if we need a systematic threat of starvation to motivate people to do literally anything at all, we've got some insurmountable problems on our hands. luckily we clearly don't. hell, based on the way rich people keep doing shit long after they've acquired enough money to fill a vault and swim in their cash, scrooge mcduck-style, something like simple status competition can drive people to extraordinary lengths.

[The Reasonable]

1. I know that the vast majority of welfare recipients are white, and that welfare abuse is not that high of a percentage. However, it happens and a lot of it isn't caught. The trick is to disincentivize staying for extended periods of time on welfare without a good reason (economic recession, disability, illness, etc) while getting help to those that need it.

I apologize. I certainly did not mean to imply anything about you personally and I intended to make that clear but forgot to.

2. As for income disparity, some inequality is inevitable- not everyone has equal earning potential- and making sure everyone is equal isn't even fair. However, everyone should be entitled to education and healthcare- the former being important for social mobility and the latter because illness can happen to anyone. There's also a balance between complete inequality and equality- with complete inequality nobody has money, while with complete equality nobody has enough to create businesses of any significant size and scope to provide goods and services for large numbers of people.

Certainly. Really, that seems like a social democratic position in my view.

Another problem: too-high taxes on business owners will incentivize outsourcing and thus unemployment. Also, minimum wage has a role in causing outsourcing...this is where the minimum standard of living supplement should come in, if a government wants to reduce unemployment by abolishing minimum wage- not as much for the unemployed as for the working poor, who really should be receiving more benefits as opposed to the perpetually unemployed.

Wealth inequality by itself isn't a bad thing until people don't have any disposable income. Fair =/= equal

And simply wanting universal education and healthcare isn't social democratic, even US liberals support that and they're not social democrats by any means.

[The Land Fomerly Known as Ligerplace]

I apologize. I certainly did not mean to imply anything about you personally and I intended to make that clear but forgot to.



Certainly. Really, that seems like a social democratic position in my view.

Another problem: too-high taxes on business owners will incentivize outsourcing and thus unemployment. Also, minimum wage has a role in causing outsourcing...this is where the minimum standard of living supplement should come in, if a government wants to reduce unemployment by abolishing minimum wage- not as much for the unemployed as for the working poor, who really should be receiving more benefits as opposed to the perpetually unemployed.

Wealth inequality by itself isn't a bad thing until people don't have any disposable income.

I would say wealth inequality could be wholly forgotten about in exchange for thinking instead of what realistic options people have to advance.

Its one thing to be in a class, its an entirely different thing to be trapped there.

P.S. I think it was called social mobility, idk

PPS Im brainstorming on this one, so don't judge too hard.

[The Reasonable]

Another problem: too-high taxes on business owners will incentivize outsourcing and thus unemployment. Also, minimum wage has a role in causing outsourcing...this is where the minimum standard of living supplement should come in, if a government wants to reduce unemployment by abolishing minimum wage- not as much for the unemployed as for the working poor, who really should be receiving more benefits as opposed to the perpetually unemployed.

Wealth inequality by itself isn't a bad thing until people don't have any disposable income.

I would say wealth inequality could be wholly forgotten about in exchange for thinking instead of what realistic options people have to advance.

Its one thing to be in a class, its an entirely different thing to be trapped there.

P.S. I think it was called social mobility, idk

PPS Im brainstorming on this one, so don't judge too hard.

Hence my emphasis on education and healthcare. I guess I am of the US immigrant mentality- I don't care that I'm in the lower class right now, as long as I have opportunities to rise out of it...and if I do but don't take advantage of them it's my own damn fault. Maybe it's this emphasis on personal responsibility that leave me at odds with the social democrats around here...they seem to assume that people will want to improve themselves without some kind of incentive.

[The Land Fomerly Known as Ligerplace]

I would say wealth inequality could be wholly forgotten about in exchange for thinking instead of what realistic options people have to advance.

Its one thing to be in a class, its an entirely different thing to be trapped there.

P.S. I think it was called social mobility, idk

PPS Im brainstorming on this one, so don't judge too hard.

Hence my emphasis on education and healthcare. I guess I am of the US immigrant mentality- I don't care that I'm in the lower class right now, as long as I have opportunities to rise out of it...and if I do but don't take advantage of them it's my own damn fault. Maybe it's this emphasis on personal responsibility that leave me at odds with the social democrats around here...they seem to assume that people will want to improve themselves without some kind of incentive.

Maybe it's a cultural thing.

Hell, maybe culture is the key to making any of these economies work.

[Eaglehood]

We are here,
its just that if we say that we are conservative we automatically get shunned and get called racist and fascist .

[Chulainan]

We are here,
its just that if we say that we are conservative we automatically get shunned and get called racist and fascist .

No that only really happens when someone says they're a nazi.

[Agymnum]

I really can't see the link between age and politics...

Same here u had fifty year old nazis, age dosnt mean correct but I will say that with age come wisdom, even then it depends

Age can bring wisdom, but too often it brings cynicism, which people confuse with wisdom.

Just because you spit at people and declare that 'life isn't fair, suck it up', doesn't make you wise. Makes you about as wise as half the coaches on my old school's sports teams. Hint: not many of them were that wise outside of sports.

A lot of young people tend to be idealists, which is why they're immediately dismissed as not knowing shit about the world. I find it sad that the only thing people seem to eat up nowadays as being wise or intelligent-sounding are the comments of bitter cynics who refuse to make the world better because they've decided the world doesn't deserve their help and now spend the rest of their days spitting and scorning it.

[Maineiacs]

No, but younger people do tend to be more liberal. I'm 17, btw.

Demographically we're the oldest (on average) on this site. I'm 32.

I've got that beat by more than a dozen years.

[St James]

Because there are a lot smart people in NSG.

[North Calaveras]

We are here,
its just that if we say that we are conservative we automatically get shunned and get called racist and fascist .

No that only really happens when someone says they're a nazi.

I call bull I had to ask a mod recently to help because people kept calling me a xenophobe and bigot and every time I asked for solid evidence or quotes none were provided

[Constaniana]

Voting Obama, to me, isn't left wing at all.

I'm 17 and according to Political Compass am a social libertarian and economic centrist (-3 to 4 socially, -1 to +1 economically).

Libertarian ....

Good almigghty Vlad , I'm sorry but why??

I see what you did there

[Cameroi]

there are ns members from all over the world, many from places that do not share the same ideological prejudices as those places which are currently dominant. i don't think its a matter of left wing. its a matter of seeing through how far to the right the so called right-wing, attempts to redefine the center.

[Chulainan]

No that only really happens when someone says they're a nazi.

I call bull I had to ask a mod recently to help because people kept calling me a xenophobe and bigot and every time I asked for solid evidence or quotes none were provided

Solid evidence for what?

[Tavok]

Honestly, it's probably just because most NSGers, and internet users in general, are young. And most young people are leftists.

[North Calaveras]

I call bull I had to ask a mod recently to help because people kept calling me a xenophobe and bigot and every time I asked for solid evidence or quotes none were provided

Solid evidence for what?

Just today I was getting hassled and called a xenophobe and bigot against Muslims(no doubt cause I'm right wing)

[The Reasonable]

Same here u had fifty year old nazis, age dosnt mean correct but I will say that with age come wisdom, even then it depends

Age can bring wisdom, but too often it brings cynicism, which people confuse with wisdom.

Just because you spit at people and declare that 'life isn't fair, suck it up', doesn't make you wise. Makes you about as wise as half the coaches on my old school's sports teams. Hint: not many of them were that wise outside of sports.

A lot of young people tend to be idealists, which is why they're immediately dismissed as not knowing shit about the world. I find it sad that the only thing people seem to eat up nowadays as being wise or intelligent-sounding are the comments of bitter cynics who refuse to make the world better because they've decided the world doesn't deserve their help and now spend the rest of their days spitting and scorning it.

Cynics aren't necessarily people who spit and scorn at the world...and never have I said "life isn't fair, suck it up". What I am when I referred to myself as cynical is that I still want to make the world a better place, but those measures have to disincentivize any possible abuse by moochers. Basically, don't assume that everybody is good at heart and has good motives.

[Agymnum]

Age can bring wisdom, but too often it brings cynicism, which people confuse with wisdom.

Just because you spit at people and declare that 'life isn't fair, suck it up', doesn't make you wise. Makes you about as wise as half the coaches on my old school's sports teams. Hint: not many of them were that wise outside of sports.

A lot of young people tend to be idealists, which is why they're immediately dismissed as not knowing shit about the world. I find it sad that the only thing people seem to eat up nowadays as being wise or intelligent-sounding are the comments of bitter cynics who refuse to make the world better because they've decided the world doesn't deserve their help and now spend the rest of their days spitting and scorning it.

Cynics aren't necessarily people who spit and scorn at the world...and never have I said "life isn't fair, suck it up". What I am when I referred to myself as cynical is that I still want to make the world a better place, but those measures have to disincentivize any possible abuse by moochers.

You're a realist then. Someone who understands the abuse people can do and acts to ensure it doesn't outpace the good people can do are realists.

Cynics portray the world as if it will never get better - as if we're all equally screwed (except the rich) and the best thing to do is just exploit your fellow man since you're all in the same shit-hole together and you're not gonna ever get out.

[Chulainan]

Solid evidence for what?

Just today I was getting hassled and called a xenophobe and bigot against Muslims(no doubt cause I'm right wing)

Well..........what did you say about Muslims then?

[The Land Fomerly Known as Ligerplace]

Just today I was getting hassled and called a xenophobe and bigot against Muslims(no doubt cause I'm right wing)

Well..........what did you say about Muslims then?

Screw that, just send some links.