No more meat?

[Big Jim P]

Maybe we should just start limiting the human population.

[The United Soviet Socialist Republic]

Maybe we should just start limiting the human population.

Or limiting hunting?

[Zevassa]

Maybe we should just start limiting the human population.

Or limiting hunting?

Or start hunting the human population. Meat's meat, right?

[Big Jim P]

Or limiting hunting?

Or start hunting the human population. Meat's meat, right?

That's what I said earlier.

[Sociobiology]

thinking like that is why many vegans have nutrient deficiencies.
many vitamins can not be obtained from fruit.

What deficiencies?

b12 is the most common because vitamin tests will not pick up the deficiency, (many foods contain Pseudo-B12 which tests as b-12 but does not function in the human body.)

b12 is acquired in certain animal organs or bacterial farming. one of these supplemental sources is required for a healthy diet.
now many products have these supplements added which is fine, but you will not get it from a purely natural vegan diet.

[Williamson]

Or limiting hunting?

Or start hunting the human population. Meat's meat, right?

yeah cause their no way that could end badly.

[Williamson]

Or limiting hunting?

Or start hunting the human population. Meat's meat, right?

yeah cause their no way that could end badly.

[The United Soviet Socialist Republic]

Or limiting hunting?

Or start hunting the human population. Meat's meat, right?

Sick. Humans have souls, do you think God would approve of us killing our fellow brothers and sisters for food?

[Mavorpen]

It is much more complicated once you have to run pest control for the infrastructure that allows your cities to function so that people like you can talk about morality. Like say the sewers or the water treatment plants or the food supplies. Imagine the cost if you had to carefully manage all that the way you do with your home. Or the costs of having farmers NOT kill pests in their fields. Humane methods don't scale up well.

You do know costs would be lower if this was widespread, correct?

No, rats carried the fleas that carried the infection. Like all other animals of the time. And no, the people did indeed not blame the rats because they believed the plague was caused by evil fog called miasma. That is why they kept having plagues over and over again until someone figured it out.

That's false.

I would love to see a citation for how you intend to feed normal nutrients into something that does not have a digestive system.

That's nice. I didn't say anything about this.

If a technology does not have the capability to match our currently used one to the extent of producing all our currently available products even the most difficult ones than it is not a viable replacement for our currently used one.

Please explain how it isn't capable. They haven't tried it yet.

[Big Jim P]

Or start hunting the human population. Meat's meat, right?

Sick. Humans have souls, do you think God would approve of us killing our fellow brothers and sisters for food?

No gods, no souls. Baby eating atheists you know.

[Sociobiology]

That's fucking nice, but I already addressed this argument. Committing atrocities is not an excuse to deny change. Also, I actually don't kill rats. I have occasionally found one or two in my home sparingly, but every time, I capture them, feed them, and release them. It's not complicated.

It is much more complicated once you have to run pest control for the infrastructure that allows your cities to function so that people like you can talk about morality. Like say the sewers or the water treatment plants or the food supplies. Imagine the cost if you had to carefully manage all that the way you do with your home. Or the costs of having farmers NOT kill pests in their fields. Humane methods don't scale up well.

it gets worse than that
mice released outside are often back inside the house within the day, mice are not stupid houses offer protection from predators and ample food, they remember how they get into houses in the first place. SO it is not only time consuming but ineffective even when it is used.

[Zevassa]

What deficiencies?

b12 is the most common because vitamin tests will not pick up the deficiency, (many foods contain Pseudo-B12 which tests as b-12 but does not function in the human body.)

b12 is acquired in certain animal organs or bacterial farming. one of these supplemental sources is required for a healthy diet.

Vegans with B12 deficiencies are, frankly, doing it wrong. There's enough fortified foods and there's enough natural bacterial/fungal-based sources that a small bit of research will pretty much set you up for life in terms of knowing what and how to eat. B12 in animal organs comes from bacterial and microbial life living inside of the organism.

It's the same as people in far northern regions having a lack of Vitamin D due to a decrease in sun exposure due to the angle of the Earth. You just need to overcompensate for the loss by adding supplements or a larger amount of mushrooms to your diet. I'd be more worried about people being deficient in Vitamin D and thinking that they're okay because they eat meat (and as such obviously have an awesome diet) than I would be about vegans finding B12.

[Mavorpen]

What deficiencies?

b12 is the most common because vitamin tests will not pick up the deficiency, (many foods contain Pseudo-B12 which tests as b-12 but does not function in the human body.)

b12 is acquired in certain animal organs or bacterial farming. one of these supplemental sources is required for a healthy diet.
now many products have these supplements added which is fine, but you will not get it from a purely natural vegan diet.

You do know that it's prevalent in the general population, including meat eaters, correct?

[Geilinor]

The population growth comes from underdeveloped countries, mainly in Africa and South Asia. Those are the places that need to have less births.

[Williamson]

The population growth comes from underdeveloped countries, mainly in Africa and South Asia. Those are the places that need to have less births.

so how would you inforce that in those countries

[Mavorpen]

Or start hunting the human population. Meat's meat, right?

Sick. Humans have souls, do you think God would approve of us killing our fellow brothers and sisters for food?

Wrong. Other species have souls, humans do not.

[Socialdemokraterne]

The problem doesn't seem to me to be a looming meat shortage, the problem I'm focused on is the water shortage. That seems infinitely more important seeing as how the article in the OP (from my reading) indicates that the water shortages would be the causative agent for the meat shortages.

My scope is trained on improving water production/recycling.

[Mavorpen]

The problem doesn't seem to me to be a looming meat shortage, the problem I'm focused on is the water shortage. That seems infinitely more important seeing as how the article in the OP (from my reading) indicates that the water shortages would be the causative agent for the meat shortages.

My scope is trained on improving water production/recycling.

Actually, it's a cycle. The reason we're having a water shortage is in part due to it being wasted and used inefficiently on livestock. Naturally, when the supply of water runs low then, a shortage of meat would follow.

[Sociobiology]

b12 is the most common because vitamin tests will not pick up the deficiency, (many foods contain Pseudo-B12 which tests as b-12 but does not function in the human body.)

b12 is acquired in certain animal organs or bacterial farming. one of these supplemental sources is required for a healthy diet.
now many products have these supplements added which is fine, but you will not get it from a purely natural vegan diet.

You do know that it's prevalent in the general population, including meat eaters, correct?

which is doctors recommend everyone take vitamin supplements.

[Mavorpen]

You do know that it's prevalent in the general population, including meat eaters, correct?

which is doctors recommend everyone take vitamin supplements.

So then vegans should be good if the entire population would become knowledgeable about nutrition at least a little.

[Sociobiology]

The population growth comes from underdeveloped countries, mainly in Africa and South Asia. Those are the places that need to have less births.

if you bring them up to first world standards of living the birth rates drop naturally.

[Mavorpen]

The population growth comes from underdeveloped countries, mainly in Africa and South Asia. Those are the places that need to have less births.

if you bring them up to first world standards of living the birth rates drop naturally.

Until then though, education and women's rights are big factors.

[Big Jim P]

if you bring them up to first world standards of living the birth rates drop naturally.

Until then though, education and women's rights are big factors.

Or simple mass sterilization.

[Sociobiology]

A better question is why we humans evolved morality the way we did.* We have taken the concept of "don't harm others in your group since that is bad for the group and thus bad for you" and turned it into a recursive system of values whose one and only objective is to be self consistent no mater the costs and that now exists solely for the purpose of causing heated debates along the various mediums of communication within our species.

*Other animal species, especially social animals do exhibit limited forms of morality but usually within the group/pack/species and not so broad as we do.

this broad application is a recent development in humans, caused most likely by changes in knowledge and education.

and some animals, like chimps, can even develop cross species morality with proper upbringing.

[Socialdemokraterne]

Actually, it's a cycle. The reason we're having a water shortage is in part due to it being wasted and used inefficiently on livestock. Naturally, when the supply of water runs low then, a shortage of meat would follow.

I'll have to look more deeply into how it is that existing agricultural models put a kink in the water cycle. One would think that the water would, by excretion or by movement through irrigation systems, eventually find its way to a sink somewhere and then evaporate back into the atmosphere. From there it would travel back to its point of origin through rainfall.

But then, in science what seems intuitive isn't always what is, and this is clearly one of those cases or else we wouldn't be talking about it.