Jewish Discussion Thread

[Menassa]

Well so you're counting the millions of Muslims and Christians who were forced to convert?

The thousands of people who were slaughtered and their familes converted out of fear?

are those people true Muslims and Christians?

Also we're not looking for people to blindly follow our religion, I'm not going to lie it has many rules that some people may just not want to keep.


That's not a fast, this is a fast:

No eating and drinking.... all day long... including sometimes the night before.

Well your assumption of Islam and Christianity spreading through killing and compulsion, is not very accurate, and if these people were really forced, why didn't they leave those religions, as soon as their military might waned, and here i am referring to Islam, which was spread by Arab armies, the Arabs only effectively ruled over Muslim lands for 2-3 centuries at most, and we know that grudges do last for thousands of years, the Jews are an example, since they were persecuted for a thousand years but they remained Jewish. To add, I would say the greatest contributors to the Islamic faith were actually non-Arab converts, and yes they are real and devout Muslims, and are in many cases, more devout to the religion than Arabs. The country with the largest Muslim population is Indonesia with about 200 million followers( well at least the majority of the population is Muslim), and it was never invaded by Muslims, nor were they under pressure to convert to Islam. I know it's a bit long, but the Mongols who conquered the world's largest empire by actually, massacring whole population and submitting them through fear, collapsed after only a few centuries, the same goes for Alexander the Great, but do you see non-Mongols practicing Mongolian shamanism? But ironically, the Mongols themselves who were the invaders, converted to Islam. I'm not trying to make it personal, I just wanted to know more about Judaism through Jews.

For years Muslims have conquered lands and converted populations... take Constantinople for example.... for hundreds of years many people were put to the sword and were given this ultimatum: 'convert or die'

I am willing to give off all the information I can..... except for the contents in Bava Matzeia on Daf: 121.

[Samonaemia]

The Muslims did conquer many nations but they did not force them to convert, and it seems you did not read the few examples I gave, about people converting without being conquered or forced. Since I'm Egyptian, since the Arabs first conquered Egypt, the population was about 9-10 million Coptic Christians, it is true that Christians in Egypt are unfortunately being persecuted today, but over the span of Muslim dominance in Egypt, our Christian ancestors did not convert at once, but over the course of about 1400 years, and to this day, the population of Christians in the country is about 10-15 million, while they could all have been converted by force.

[Menassa]

The Muslims did conquer many nations but they did not force them to convert, and it seems you did not read the few examples I gave, about people converting without being conquered or forced. Since I'm Egyptian, since the Arabs first conquered Egypt, the population was about 9-10 million Coptic Christians, it is true that Christians in Egypt are unfortunately being persecuted today, but over the span of Muslim dominance in Egypt, our Christian ancestors did not convert at once, but over the course of about 1400 years, and to this day, the population of Christians in the country is about 10-15 million, while they could all have been converted by force.

So you're saying Muslims whenever conquered lands they never converted people by force?

[Samonaemia]

In most cases, no.

[Ethel mermania]

The Muslims did conquer many nations but they did not force them to convert, and it seems you did not read the few examples I gave, about people converting without being conquered or forced. Since I'm Egyptian, since the Arabs first conquered Egypt, the population was about 9-10 million Coptic Christians, it is true that Christians in Egypt are unfortunately being persecuted today, but over the span of Muslim dominance in Egypt, our Christian ancestors did not convert at once, but over the course of about 1400 years, and to this day, the population of Christians in the country is about 10-15 million, while they could all have been converted by force.

sometimes they did, sometimes they didnt. During the conquest, pagans were pretty much always convert or die. people of the book, were usually allowed to remain their religion, but were encouraged to convert

"usually" being a flexible word.

[New Nassrau]

Happy Chanukah Everyone!

Light the candle with a tiny spark, light the candle with a golden flame, with the light shining through the night, light the candle and open up you mind...

*DARN YOU SELEUCID EMPIRE!!!!*

[Menassa]

Happy Chanukah Everyone!

(Image)

Light the candle with a tiny spark, light the candle with a golden flame, with the light shining through the night, light the candle and open up you mind...

*DARN YOU SELEUCID EMPIRE!!!!*

*Dances the hora*

Yevanim nik'b'tsu alai
Azai bimei Chashmanim
U'far'tsu chomot migdalai
V'timu kol hashmanim
Uminotar kankanim
Na'asa nes lashoshanim
B'nei vina, yemei shmona
Kav'u shir ur'nanim
B'nei vina, yemei shmona
Kav'u shir ur'nanim

[New Nassrau]

I actually have a question... everywhere it seems as though they consider the "enemies" of the Maccabees to be Greeks, or Syrian-Greeks... why don't they just say Seleucids?

[Menassa]

I actually have a question... everywhere it seems as though they consider the "enemies" of the Maccabees to be Greeks, or Syrian-Greeks... why don't they just say Seleucids?

The word Yavan translates to mean the word Greek.... we don't care what new names you take up.... I believe Alexander the great conquered syria a while before it and they just called them greeks.

[Volnotova]

Happy Chanukah everyone.

[Menassa]

Happy Chanukah everyone.

Happy Chanukah to yourself!

[Silver Luna Enchantment]

My grandma is Russian Jewish, but my grandpa wasn't practising so my dad doesn't really practise his faith either way even to this day. My mum came from a Catholic family, but she's also non-practising. Me personally I'm atheist.
My dad used to joke about how they would discuss the family's religion, he liked to say "daddy believes he is one of god's chosen people, and mummy thinks god is magic".

[Menassa]

My grandma is Russian Jewish, but my grandpa wasn't practising so my dad doesn't really practise his faith either way even to this day. My mum came from a Catholic family, but she's also non-practising. Me personally I'm atheist.
My dad used to joke about how they would discuss the family's religion, he liked to say "daddy believes he is one of god's chosen people, and mummy thinks god is magic".

Your Grandmother on your Father's side is Jewish?

[Silver Luna Enchantment]

My grandma is Russian Jewish, but my grandpa wasn't practising so my dad doesn't really practise his faith either way even to this day. My mum came from a Catholic family, but she's also non-practising. Me personally I'm atheist.
My dad used to joke about how they would discuss the family's religion, he liked to say "daddy believes he is one of god's chosen people, and mummy thinks god is magic".

Your Grandmother on your Father's side is Jewish?

That's what I said. My grandpa was too but he didn't practise it as much as my grandma.

[Noders]

Happy Chanukah from israel yo's

[Evraim]

Happy Chanukah, everybody!

I actually have a question... everywhere it seems as though they consider the "enemies" of the Maccabees to be Greeks, or Syrian-Greeks... why don't they just say Seleucids?

The word Yavan translates to mean the word Greek.... we don't care what new names you take up.... I believe Alexander the great conquered syria a while before it and they just called them greeks.

More specifically, the enemies of the Maccabees included Jewish and Syrian-Greek partisans who promoted the coerced Hellenization of Judea. In this context, it makes sense to refer to them as Greeks because their cultural norms, language, political framework, and military traditions were principally Greek in origin and they were furthering the process of Hellenization advocated by Alexander and his Diadochi at a level never before attempted.

[Nazi Flower Power]

Well so you're counting the millions of Muslims and Christians who were forced to convert?

The thousands of people who were slaughtered and their familes converted out of fear?

are those people true Muslims and Christians?

Also we're not looking for people to blindly follow our religion, I'm not going to lie it has many rules that some people may just not want to keep.


That's not a fast, this is a fast:

No eating and drinking.... all day long... including sometimes the night before.

Well your assumption of Islam and Christianity spreading through killing and compulsion, is not very accurate,

Hi. I am an atheist. I don't have a horse in this race. Menassa's characterization of Christian and Islamic tactics is pretty accurate.

It's true that subsequent generations, who grew up with Christianity or Islam, have stuck to them out of sincere belief; but it was still the forced conversions that laid the groundwork for those people to be indoctrinated. Even in times when there are no holy wars being waged, the fact that Christians and Muslims shove their religions down other people's throats is the reason why those religions tend to spread more than Judaism.

[Ethel mermania]

Well your assumption of Islam and Christianity spreading through killing and compulsion, is not very accurate,

Hi. I am an atheist. I don't have a horse in this race. Menassa's characterization of Christian and Islamic tactics is pretty accurate.

It's true that subsequent generations, who grew up with Christianity or Islam, have stuck to them out of sincere belief; but it was still the forced conversions that laid the groundwork for those people to be indoctrinated. Even in times when there are no holy wars being waged, the fact that Christians and Muslims shove their religions down other people's throats is the reason why those religions tend to spread more than Judaism.

that and circumcision When jew's did proselytize we did fabulous with the ladies.... the men ... not so much.

[Evraim]

Hi. I am an atheist. I don't have a horse in this race. Menassa's characterization of Christian and Islamic tactics is pretty accurate.

It's true that subsequent generations, who grew up with Christianity or Islam, have stuck to them out of sincere belief; but it was still the forced conversions that laid the groundwork for those people to be indoctrinated. Even in times when there are no holy wars being waged, the fact that Christians and Muslims shove their religions down other people's throats is the reason why those religions tend to spread more than Judaism.

that and circumcision When jew's did proselytize we did fabulous with the ladies.... the men ... not so much.

Thus matrilineal descent.

[Menassa]

that and circumcision When jew's did proselytize we did fabulous with the ladies.... the men ... not so much.

Thus matrilineal descent.

Matrilineal decent is from before that... it is from the Oral Law however... and there is a tale of an interesting case when Moses was in the desert of a dispute taking place.

[Evraim]

Thus matrilineal descent.

Matrilineal decent is from before that... it is from the Oral Law however... and there is a tale of an interesting case when Moses was in the desert of a dispute taking place.

Menassa, why do you always spoil my light-hearted humor?

I would probably argue that matrilineal descent could also be inferred from the Torah itself, but the Oral Law is where most scholars seem to put their eggs.

Also, Happy Hanukkah.

[Menassa]

Matrilineal decent is from before that... it is from the Oral Law however... and there is a tale of an interesting case when Moses was in the desert of a dispute taking place.

Menassa, why do you always spoil my light-hearted humor?

I would probably argue that matrilineal descent could also be inferred from the Torah itself, but the Oral Law is where most scholars seem to put their eggs.

Also, Happy Hanukkah.

Thank you... and a happy Chanukah to you as well.

The Oral Law is where those inferences stem from.

There is no Jokes about The Law!

[Evraim]

Menassa, why do you always spoil my light-hearted humor?

I would probably argue that matrilineal descent could also be inferred from the Torah itself, but the Oral Law is where most scholars seem to put their eggs.

Also, Happy Hanukkah.

Thank you... and a happy Chanukah to you as well.

The Oral Law is where those inferences stem from.

There is no Jokes about The Law!

Then why is one of our forefathers named Yitchak? Everything Jewish has been humorous ever since that historic moment.

[Menassa]

Thank you... and a happy Chanukah to you as well.

The Oral Law is where those inferences stem from.

There is no Jokes about The Law!

Then why is one of our forefathers named Yitchak? Everything Jewish has been humorous ever since that historic moment.

The Law!!

[Evraim]

Then why is one of our forefathers named Yitchak? Everything Jewish has been humorous ever since that historic moment.

The Law!!

Does this mean that G-d is like Judge Dread?

Evil-Doer: *commits sins*

G-d: Repent!

Evil-Doer: No way, grandpa!

G-d: You have been targeted for judgement.

*analyzes the situation for several moments before arriving at a decision*

Guilty. The punishment is execution.

Evil-Doer: No! *flees*

G-d: *smites* I AM THE LAW!!!