Why Iran needs the Nuke

[Risottia]

... extremists would get their hands on nuclear weapons.

Which is a reasonable fear.
But somehow, the US and Israel didn't raise such harsh objections about the nuclear arsenal of a notorious Taliban-ridden country - the very same country where Osama Bin Laden himself found a rather safe shelter. One wonders why.

[Farnhamia]

The idea that Iran needs a nuclear weapon so that it can exact revenge on another country (or even threaten it) is one of the reasons the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, which Iran signed and ratified, was created.

And how does one defend itself from the threats of non-NPT countries... like, dunno, one bordering Iran, and the other threatening Iran on a weekly basis?

IF Iran is trying to build nuclear weapons (which so far still isn't certain), I hardly think Iran's neighbours have done a lot to persuade them not to...

I would worry about Pakistan more than Israel. But are you saying the solution to poor foreign relations is nuclear weapons? Aren't we supposed to be moving away from that sort of thing? You know, the Cold War is over and all that jazz?

[Risottia]

I would worry about Pakistan more than Israel.

I am.
Although both countries tend to have quite a militant attitude.

But are you saying the solution to poor foreign relations is nuclear weapons?

No, actually, my proposed solution to nuclear weapons would be better international relations - because, in a situation of poor foreign relations, weapon proliferation cannot be prevented. Expecially about nuclear weapons, which are quite easy to make. Curiously enough, building an accurate missile for nuclear delivery is HARDER than building a nuclear bomb.

[Farnhamia]

I would worry about Pakistan more than Israel.

I am.
Although both countries tend to have quite a militant attitude.

But are you saying the solution to poor foreign relations is nuclear weapons?

No, actually, my proposed solution to nuclear weapons would be better international relations.

I see. An armed society is a polite society, is it?

[Risottia]

I am.
Although both countries tend to have quite a militant attitude.


No, actually, my proposed solution to nuclear weapons would be better international relations.

I see. An armed society is a polite society, is it?

I see I have to clarify.

My thought is: Better foreign relations => less countries thinking they need nukes (or that they need better/more nukes). Bad foreign relations => more countries thinking they need more nukes.

edit: or, paraphrasing: "a polite society becomes an unarmed one".

[Farnhamia]

I see. An armed society is a polite society, is it?

I see I have to clarify.

My thought is: Better foreign relations => less countries thinking they need nukes (or that they need better/more nukes). Bad foreign relations => more countries thinking they need more nukes.

I should make the coffee stronger on Mondays.

[Risottia]

I see I have to clarify.

My thought is: Better foreign relations => less countries thinking they need nukes (or that they need better/more nukes). Bad foreign relations => more countries thinking they need more nukes.

I should make the coffee stronger on Mondays.

We need MORE AND STRONGER COFFEE OF MASS DESTRUCTION!!! AND MOKA MISSILES TO DELIVER IT!!!

...oh wait...

[Kemaliste]

Iran is a fascist country which massacres its minorities. The Turk-populated northwest of this country (South Azerbaijan) is systematically enslaved and assimilated and persifized. Iran should be obliterated.

I can understand your being sensitive about Azeri minorities in Iran. But you should suppress your emotional feelings and approach to this issue in a rationalist way. Iran is now being targeted by western imperialists, so it would be unlogical to serve the interests of them.

The best solution is to talk with Iran as a friend and ask for them to treat Azeris in a fair way there. But don't act in a way that would put you in the same side with western imperialists.

[Choronzon]

Only the completely detached think that allowing Iran, a signatory of the NPT, to acquire nuclear weapons is somehow justified. Of course, these people are almost always the same ones who claim to support disarmament and decry proliferation. In reality, they're bitter, and primarily, anti-American. They are so feverishly and pettily anti-American that they're blinded to the things they support, to the point that they discard reason and investigation, and instead opt for reactionary policy on the grounds of "nuclear fairness".

No, in reality we're people who aren't shills of the Israel lobby or people who think that only allowing one state in a region to have nukes (especially when that state fancies itself the local tyrant) is bad for stability. Yelling ANTI-AMERICAN is almost as hollow as yelling ANTI-SEMITE!

And I don't support disarmament.

Only the most rabid Israeli puppet or the total sheltered xenophobe who has bought into the US's IRAN IS AN EVIL TERRORIST STATE WHO WANTS TO END THE WORLD FOR ALLAH!!!!! could think Iran shouldn't have a nuke as long as we allow Israel to keep its arsenal.

Regardless of what Iran has done or not done, or what Israel has done or not done, it's legally bound to stay nuclear-free (well, power plants are okay). The reason people support Iran is not because it's actually sensible, but because they get caught up in metapolitical bullshit that blinds them from evaluating the situation in any rational fashion.

International Law is a joke. A total and complete joke. There are schools of IR that reject its legitimacy entirely (and its one of the more popular schools). Its called "realism" and I'm not just making that up or giving it that name to be a douche.

So, actually, there are plenty of rational reasons why it could be argued that Iran should have a nuke. And they have been stated multiple times in this thread. You just going LOLOLOLOL INTERNATIONAL LAW! is not an acceptable refutation.

[The House of Petain]

... extremists would get their hands on nuclear weapons.

Which is a reasonable fear.
But somehow, the US and Israel didn't raise such harsh objections about the nuclear arsenal of a notorious Taliban-ridden country - the very same country where Osama Bin Laden himself found a rather safe shelter. One wonders why.

I agree with you...Pakistan has been everything but a friend, that still does not change my opinion about a nuclear Iran though.

[Qanchia]

Yes it is fascism or at least its racism.Its interesting that Turks hate almost every nation what have borders with them.Hmmm

The armenians make headaches in every nation they exist. They stole land from Azerbaijan and now trying to steal land from Georgia in order to create a greater armenia

Have you considered the possibility that the same might be true for minorities in Iran? Iran's alleged mistreatment of minorities is probably nothing compared to the Armenian genocide.

[Kemaliste]

The armenians make headaches in every nation they exist. They stole land from Azerbaijan and now trying to steal land from Georgia in order to create a greater armenia

Have you considered the possibility that the same might be true for minorities in Iran? Iran's alleged mistreatment of minorities is probably nothing compared to the Armenian genocide.

Comparing a country's present mistreatment toward its minorities to a failed relocation attempt made by an Empire over 100 years ago... Poor haters, you don't have any argument else to talk against Turkey except this fabricated issue.

Anyways, while I don't agree with their regime, I'm still with Iran against western imperialism.

[L Ron Cupboard]

Comparing a country's present mistreatment toward its minorities to a failed relocation attempt made by an Empire over 100 years ago... Poor haters, you don't have any argument else to talk against Turkey except this fabricated issue.

Not that much of a one off though is it?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ma ... _in_Turkey

[Farnhamia]

Have you considered the possibility that the same might be true for minorities in Iran? Iran's alleged mistreatment of minorities is probably nothing compared to the Armenian genocide.

Comparing a country's present mistreatment toward its minorities to a failed relocation attempt made by an Empire over 100 years ago... Poor haters, you don't have any argument else to talk against Turkey except this fabricated issue.

Anyways, while I don't agree with their regime, I'm still with Iran against western imperialism.

"A failed relocation attempt"? I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

[Choronzon]

Have you considered the possibility that the same might be true for minorities in Iran? Iran's alleged mistreatment of minorities is probably nothing compared to the Armenian genocide.

Comparing a country's present mistreatment toward its minorities to a failed relocation attempt made by an Empire over 100 years ago... Poor haters, you don't have any argument else to talk against Turkey except this fabricated issue.

And then Turkey wonders why the EU wont let it play with them.

[Kemaliste]

Comparing a country's present mistreatment toward its minorities to a failed relocation attempt made by an Empire over 100 years ago... Poor haters, you don't have any argument else to talk against Turkey except this fabricated issue.

Not that much of a one off though is it?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ma ... _in_Turkey

The last 7 ones are actually examples of a civil fight, not a state-committed crime or something. The other ones happent over 70 years ago. Still, I don't see any relevance with Iran's current oppression of Azeris.

And why are people bringing this issue to Turkey anyway ? why can't you tolerate an average Turkish criticizing a country for oppressing its minority ? we are not the represantatives of the Turkish state here.

[Kemaliste]

Comparing a country's present mistreatment toward its minorities to a failed relocation attempt made by an Empire over 100 years ago... Poor haters, you don't have any argument else to talk against Turkey except this fabricated issue.

And then Turkey wonders why the EU wont let it play with them.

Let EU play with my penis. Turkey will not give up advocating its rightful case for a cheap union about to collapse.

[Kemaliste]

Comparing a country's present mistreatment toward its minorities to a failed relocation attempt made by an Empire over 100 years ago... Poor haters, you don't have any argument else to talk against Turkey except this fabricated issue.

Anyways, while I don't agree with their regime, I'm still with Iran against western imperialism.

"A failed relocation attempt"? I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

Yes. It's normal that you are surprised as you have no knowledge about this issue except what you see in anti-Turk western media or Armenian-made propaganda documentaries.

[Farnhamia]

"A failed relocation attempt"? I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

Yes. It's normal that you are surprised as you have no knowledge about this issue except what you see in anti-Turk western media or Armenian-made propaganda documentaries.

Uh huh. I think I'll just go with the first-hand accounts of members of my family about how badly that "relocation attempt" failed.

Which has nothing to do with the question of Iran "needing" a nuclear weapon, which they don't.

[Kemaliste]

Yes. It's normal that you are surprised as you have no knowledge about this issue except what you see in anti-Turk western media or Armenian-made propaganda documentaries.

Uh huh. I think I'll just go with the first-hand accounts of members of my family about how badly that "relocation attempt" failed.

Which has nothing to do with the question of Iran "needing" a nuclear weapon, which they don't.

I'll not take your worthless family members into consideration about an issue that is needed to be analyzed in a scientific way with reliable sources.

I'm not the one who brought this issue to Turkey. It's you Turcophobics who can't tolerate a Turk stating his opinions about the actions of other countries.

[Swith Witherward]

Uh huh. I think I'll just go with the first-hand accounts of members of my family about how badly that "relocation attempt" failed.

Which has nothing to do with the question of Iran "needing" a nuclear weapon, which they don't.

I'll not take your worthless family members into consideration about an issue that is needed to be analyzed in a scientific way with reliable sources.

I'm not the one who brought this issue to Turkey. It's you Turcophobics who can't tolerate a Turk stating his opinions about the actions of other countries.

First-hand accounts are permissible in a court of law, and are (in my opinion) acceptable when countering someone who accuses someone else of having no knowledge except what's provided by propaganda. Your addition of "worthless" as an adjective regarding Farn's family is unwarranted... and poor form.

[Katganistan]

Uh huh. I think I'll just go with the first-hand accounts of members of my family about how badly that "relocation attempt" failed.

Which has nothing to do with the question of Iran "needing" a nuclear weapon, which they don't.

I'll not take your worthless family members into consideration about an issue that is needed to be analyzed in a scientific way with reliable sources.

I'm not the one who brought this issue to Turkey. It's you Turcophobics who can't tolerate a Turk stating his opinions about the actions of other countries.

*** Warned for flambaiting *** There is NO reaction other than anger to hearing your family called worthless. Now be civil.

[Katganistan]

The kurds are a human rubbishç the armenians- I wont even open a word of them

*** Warned for trolling ***

[Kemaliste]

I'll not take your worthless family members into consideration about an issue that is needed to be analyzed in a scientific way with reliable sources.

I'm not the one who brought this issue to Turkey. It's you Turcophobics who can't tolerate a Turk stating his opinions about the actions of other countries.

First-hand accounts are permissible in a court of law, and are (in my opinion) acceptable when countering someone who accuses someone else of having no knowledge except what's provided by propaganda. Your addition of "worthless" as an adjective regarding Farn's family is unwarranted... and poor form.

Look at the logic. Then I'll call my father and ask for him to fabricate somethings to justify my claims.

[Shazbotdom]

First-hand accounts are permissible in a court of law, and are (in my opinion) acceptable when countering someone who accuses someone else of having no knowledge except what's provided by propaganda. Your addition of "worthless" as an adjective regarding Farn's family is unwarranted... and poor form.

Look at the logic. Then I'll call my father and ask for him to fabricate somethings to justify my claims.

How do you figure that he fabricated those claims? Just because you never met the people in his family doesn't mean that they made up the stories as Oral History is one of the most widely acceptable forms of history in the known world.