Have I no right?

[New Kereptica]

Agree wholeheartedly.

I refuse.

[Muravyets]

I am the child of a rape victim. Yeah, the child of the rapist and my mom. I would have been aborted if my mom would've had access to that.

Now, for all you people out there who are "pro-women's choice," have I no right to life? I could've died and you'd just assume that my life for my mother's comfort was a more than fair trade. I am very successful today and would like to know why in the United States eagle eggs are better protected than our children. I would like to know how you think it's okay to kill something that has a heartbeat, a hand, a face, and is LIVING and GROWING inside of someone? This is MURDER.

Have I no right to life?

Why is this trade considered so equal? A life and comfort are NOT EQUAL!

Agree wholeheartedly.

57 pages of thread. Does it occur to you at all that there might be some argument about that? Would you like to address any part of it? Or do you just not care?

[Dyakovo]

I am the child of a rape victim. Yeah, the child of the rapist and my mom. I would have been aborted if my mom would've had access to that.

Now, for all you people out there who are "pro-women's choice," have I no right to life? I could've died and you'd just assume that my life for my mother's comfort was a more than fair trade. I am very successful today and would like to know why in the United States eagle eggs are better protected than our children. I would like to know how you think it's okay to kill something that has a heartbeat, a hand, a face, and is LIVING and GROWING inside of someone? This is MURDER.

Have I no right to life?

Why is this trade considered so equal? A life and comfort are NOT EQUAL!

Agree wholeheartedly.

So you support slavery?

[Dyakovo]

I am the child of a rape victim. Yeah, the child of the rapist and my mom. I would have been aborted if my mom would've had access to that.

Now, for all you people out there who are "pro-women's choice," have I no right to life? I could've died and you'd just assume that my life for my mother's comfort was a more than fair trade. I am very successful today and would like to know why in the United States eagle eggs are better protected than our children. I would like to know how you think it's okay to kill something that has a heartbeat, a hand, a face, and is LIVING and GROWING inside of someone? This is MURDER.

Have I no right to life?

Why is this trade considered so equal? A life and comfort are NOT EQUAL!

Agree wholeheartedly.

57 58 pages of thread. Does it occur to you at all that there might be some argument about that? Would you like to address any part of it? Or do you just not care?

Fixed, since Mura apparently can't count tonight...
Yes, I know, it was on page 57 when you responded...

[Ashmoria]

I am the child of a rape victim. Yeah, the child of the rapist and my mom. I would have been aborted if my mom would've had access to that.

Now, for all you people out there who are "pro-women's choice," have I no right to life? I could've died and you'd just assume that my life for my mother's comfort was a more than fair trade. I am very successful today and would like to know why in the United States eagle eggs are better protected than our children. I would like to know how you think it's okay to kill something that has a heartbeat, a hand, a face, and is LIVING and GROWING inside of someone? This is MURDER.

Have I no right to life?

Why is this trade considered so equal? A life and comfort are NOT EQUAL!

Agree wholeheartedly.

so you think that a woman should be forced to bear the child of a rapist?

[Muravyets]

I am the child of a rape victim. Yeah, the child of the rapist and my mom. I would have been aborted if my mom would've had access to that.

Now, for all you people out there who are "pro-women's choice," have I no right to life? I could've died and you'd just assume that my life for my mother's comfort was a more than fair trade. I am very successful today and would like to know why in the United States eagle eggs are better protected than our children. I would like to know how you think it's okay to kill something that has a heartbeat, a hand, a face, and is LIVING and GROWING inside of someone? This is MURDER.

Have I no right to life?

Why is this trade considered so equal? A life and comfort are NOT EQUAL!

Agree wholeheartedly.

57 58 pages of thread. Does it occur to you at all that there might be some argument about that? Would you like to address any part of it? Or do you just not care?

Fixed, since Mura apparently can't count tonight...
Yes, I know, it was on page 57 when you responded...

Smart ass. Maybe if you all had more of a life, I'd do better at keeping up.

[Walabamba]

Holy crap, I can't believe this thread survived for so long!

As for the actual subject, I think that abortion may not be right in many cases but since your mom was raped and since she was carrying the child of a rapist (no offense) that she had the right to do it.

[Xsyne]

Btw a tapeworm will deteriorate your health over time till you die no matter how good it was before it arrived.

Tapeworms very rarely kill the host. Why would they? They would gain no advantage by doing so, because they're not very good at moving.

Also tapeworms never leave on there own.

Yes, they do. They routinely shed large numbers of body segments (which are organisms in and of themselves) that are expelled in the host's feces. As I recall, tapeworms will also leave when faced with severe environmental stress.

Apparently, pregnancy is not the only thing a person has to be completely ignorant of in order to make an anti-choice argument.

I decided to do a bit of reading, not knowing much about tapeworms, and it turns out that most tapeworm infections or whatever the proper word is are asymptomatic. So comparing a fetus to a tapeworm is flawed, but for a somewhat different reason.*

I also couldn't find anything about tapeworms leaving when faced with environmental stress, although it turns out the individual segments have enough muscle structure to move, and have been known to crawl out the host's anus without even bothering with being expelled in feces. I now know more about tapeworms than I ever wanted to know.

*And I'm not even going to go into the studies that suggest intestinal parasites can actually improve one's health.

[Callisdrun]

Btw a tapeworm will deteriorate your health over time till you die no matter how good it was before it arrived.

Tapeworms very rarely kill the host. Why would they? They would gain no advantage by doing so, because they're not very good at moving.

Also tapeworms never leave on there own.

Yes, they do. They routinely shed large numbers of body segments (which are organisms in and of themselves) that are expelled in the host's feces. As I recall, tapeworms will also leave when faced with severe environmental stress.

Apparently, pregnancy is not the only thing a person has to be completely ignorant of in order to make an anti-choice argument.

I decided to do a bit of reading, not knowing much about tapeworms, and it turns out that most tapeworm infections or whatever the proper word is are asymptomatic. So comparing a fetus to a tapeworm is flawed, but for a somewhat different reason.*

I also couldn't find anything about tapeworms leaving when faced with environmental stress, although it turns out the individual segments have enough muscle structure to move, and have been known to crawl out the host's anus without even bothering with being expelled in feces. I now know more about tapeworms than I ever wanted to know.

*And I'm not even going to go into the studies that suggest intestinal parasites can actually improve one's health.

If you have access to such, I'd like to see them. Not on this thread, of course, as that would be too off topic. But I am curious.

[Milks Empire]

If an adult decides to give away their kidney or blood, it's their decision. If they decide not too, they are allowed that too. Anyone with legal consent has the right to decide this sort of thing. Children and adults dying of natural/accidental/incidental causes is terrible, but forcing a legal adult to give up part of their body for it is not as good.

And this to the letter is what forcing a woman to go through a pregnancy is. You are forcing her to give up part of her body.

[Grave_n_idle]

If an adult decides to give away their kidney or blood, it's their decision. If they decide not too, they are allowed that too. Anyone with legal consent has the right to decide this sort of thing. Children and adults dying of natural/accidental/incidental causes is terrible, but forcing a legal adult to give up part of their body for it is not as good.

And this to the letter is what forcing a woman to go through a pregnancy is. You are forcing her to give up part of her body.

Nuh uh! The uterus is the devil's work, and the normal rules of logic don't apply!

[Milks Empire]

If an adult decides to give away their kidney or blood, it's their decision. If they decide not too, they are allowed that too. Anyone with legal consent has the right to decide this sort of thing. Children and adults dying of natural/accidental/incidental causes is terrible, but forcing a legal adult to give up part of their body for it is not as good.

And this to the letter is what forcing a woman to go through a pregnancy is. You are forcing her to give up part of her body.

Nuh uh! The uterus is the devil's work, and the normal rules of logic don't apply!

I see what you did there.

[Hiddenrun]

I know! It's so unreasonable of me to ask you:

"WHAT DEFINITION OF 'PERSON' ARE YOU USING?"

Sweet sugarcoated Jesusdicks.

I wasn't the one who invoked personhood. I was the one asking someone ELSE to defend it.

Stop trying to shift the burden.

It makes absolutely no sense for you to not have a definition for personhood. Clearly, you define a fetus as not-a-person. Quit playing stupid games, this isn't about burdens, this is about trying to even start a conversation with some clarity. I cannot even begin to fathom how your position is constructed if you go out of your way to avoid telling anyone where you're coming from. You see, I don't have a clear definition for a person. I haven't constructed that part of my argument, because I haven't thought about it all that much, and I'm coming at it from a different angle (father's rights) than most. Is that also the case for you? That you haven't actually thought about it enough to tell us what your definition (legal, biological, spiritual, whatever) is?

I asked you a question. You refuse to answer it and use ridiculous excuses like 'waa, burden shifting' or whatever other crap you pull up. It would have taken you what, five seconds to answer it, instead of post after post making excuses for why you won't? If you simply do not have an answer, can you not be honest and admit it? It is just because it's me asking? Could someone you like ask you and get a fucking answer?

[Grave_n_idle]

Quit playing stupid games, this isn't about burdens,

I'm bored by your dishonesty.

I've repeatedly explained why this is ENTIRELY about burdens, and I've repeatedly shown why the burden is NOT on me.

If you don't feel like taking up the burden of defending personhood (that's understandable) from those who have posted their claims and then fled the scene... well, that's cool.

But if you're going to take up the spirit of their argument, but try to reverse it, so that those QUESTIONING the claim are being pressed to justify their skepticism? Well, then I'm just not interested.

You make your choice.

[Katganistan]

I'm disappointed nobody commented on Bob, the Janitor.

When was the last time that challenge was honestly taken up anyway?

never. Truly, honestly, never. Nobody has ever ACTUALLY attempted to answer it. I've posted it over a half dozen times, and not one single pro-life individual has ever sincerely tried to answer it, except for one, who answered he'd save the janitor, but tried to equivocate about how a "fully formed" life being worth more than a "not formed" life.

I asked him at what point, how big the cooler had to be, before the millions and millions of not formed lives ever were worth more than a fully formed one.

He didn't answer.

I'd save Bob.

[Katganistan]

I tried to put this in its own thread, but the Melkman says nono. So:

I am the potential father of an unconceived love child with Katganistan. This child has all the possibility of growing up to be a happy and productive member of society despite our most likely uneven parenting and most likely my complete absence after a few years.

However, Katganistan doesn't seem to believe that this child has the rights of a human being. In fact, she is valuing her choice and comfort as more important than our imaginary child's life.

To help convince her, I am putting forward the following pro-life arguments that are based on science and truth.

1. The 1st Law of Thermodynamics. Matter and Energy cannot be created or destroyed. The egg that are child will be developed from currently exists in Katganistan's left ovary. The material that will eventually be made into the sperm that I will propel into her body during eight minutes of sweaty, clumsy rutting in a Howard Johnson's budget suite and conference center followed by us watching a Benny Hill DVD in awkward silence while I eat cashews from the mini-bar and she sends text messages to her sister that I pretend I'm not trying to read with my peripheral vision but the only word I can make out is either "distraught" or "disappointing" also already exists, currently in the form of frozen protein in a chicken McNugget in a storage cooler in a McDonalds in Orem, Utah. Thus, our child already exists, in a form.

2. Causality. Causality is not the same as correlation. I say that because its true and makes me sounds smart. Katganistan's refusal to spread for me is causing our child not to exist. This is the same thing as murder. (see Pusey v. Bator, actual case).

3. Thus, if you value human life, you should value the life of our child and support me in seeking injunctive relief from the other mods, who can order Katganistan to refrain from refraining from having sex with me.

Remeber, Katganistan's failure to let me stick my turgid, throbbing tallywhacker into her hoo hoo dilly is the same as MURDER.

....

I don't know what to be outraged about first: the scenario which posits us knocking boots, or that it would be imagined to happen in a Howard Johnson's.

[Katganistan]

Calling it a "babey" doesn't make it a baby.

How is babby formed?

[Sarkhaan]

I tried to put this in its own thread, but the Melkman says nono. So:

I am the potential father of an unconceived love child with Katganistan. This child has all the possibility of growing up to be a happy and productive member of society despite our most likely uneven parenting and most likely my complete absence after a few years.

However, Katganistan doesn't seem to believe that this child has the rights of a human being. In fact, she is valuing her choice and comfort as more important than our imaginary child's life.

To help convince her, I am putting forward the following pro-life arguments that are based on science and truth.

1. The 1st Law of Thermodynamics. Matter and Energy cannot be created or destroyed. The egg that are child will be developed from currently exists in Katganistan's left ovary. The material that will eventually be made into the sperm that I will propel into her body during eight minutes of sweaty, clumsy rutting in a Howard Johnson's budget suite and conference center followed by us watching a Benny Hill DVD in awkward silence while I eat cashews from the mini-bar and she sends text messages to her sister that I pretend I'm not trying to read with my peripheral vision but the only word I can make out is either "distraught" or "disappointing" also already exists, currently in the form of frozen protein in a chicken McNugget in a storage cooler in a McDonalds in Orem, Utah. Thus, our child already exists, in a form.

2. Causality. Causality is not the same as correlation. I say that because its true and makes me sounds smart. Katganistan's refusal to spread for me is causing our child not to exist. This is the same thing as murder. (see Pusey v. Bator, actual case).

3. Thus, if you value human life, you should value the life of our child and support me in seeking injunctive relief from the other mods, who can order Katganistan to refrain from refraining from having sex with me.

Remeber, Katganistan's failure to let me stick my turgid, throbbing tallywhacker into her hoo hoo dilly is the same as MURDER.

....

I don't know what to be outraged about first: the scenario which posits us knocking boots, or that it would be imagined to happen in a Howard Johnson's.

You know, had you not quoted that, I would never have seen it, and wouldn't currently be having urges to dump gallons of bleach and lysol in my eyes.

May my future blindness weigh upon your conscience.

[Verdeguay]

I'd like to see an eagle surf the web.

Who wouldn't? I think we can all agree that, whatever our differences of opinion on abortion may be, it would be awesome to see an eagle surf the web.

[Katganistan]

Removing it from the woman almost certainly counts as intervention, Bottle.

But a woman contributing the required conditions and supplying the required materials, doesn't?

Like I told Bottle, no. It's intervention when there's conscious direction of effort, not when it's 'natural', for lack of a better word.

So, women who are pregnant do NOT need to go to a doctor. They do NOT need to take supplements. They do NOT need to eat properly. They do NOT need to stop smoking and stop drinking. They do NOT need to get proper rest. They do NOT need to get regular checkups.... they do NOT need to schedule appointments, or make arrangements to deliver somewhere....

Because all of those things would be INTERVENTION.

[Katganistan]

Is this thread still going even?

Crazy...

So, who opposes pro-life and what art thou reasoning?

Go back to the last post you read, and catch up.

[Slaytesics]

My opinion is now completely changed on this....If you were cloned and you clone xperimented on i guess it is not murder.

[The Norse Hordes]

My opinion is now completely changed on this....If you were cloned and you clone xperimented on i guess it is not murder.

What?

[Bavin]

My opinion is now completely changed on this....If you were cloned and you clone xperimented on i guess it is not murder.

What?

I got the first half, then I blanked out, and all I got at the end was 'it is not murder'

[Slaytesics]

OOC: BAvin you are a thread stalker

I think the Woman has no right, and right, i mean i used to think just right, but now i am just like WTF!