All Y’all Atheists.

[Divair]

I am Christian, but I respect the Atheists.

Same here.

Personally, I don't see why we have to fight over religion. I'll admit some Christians might bash atheists, but actually a majority of Christians could care less.

You mean "couldn't care less".

[Veladio]

When it comes to the Christian god and why I stopped following him, I have a couple of answers, but none are more fleshed out in comedy than the one that I share with George Carlin:

Trillions and trillions of prayers every day asking and begging and pleading for favors. 'Do this' 'Gimme that' 'I want a new car' 'I want a better job'. And most of this praying takes place on Sunday. And I say fine, pray for anything you want. Pray for anything. But...what about the divine plan? Remember that? The divine plan. Long time ago god made a divine plan. Gave it a lot of thought. Decided it was a good plan. Put it into practice. And for billion and billions of years the divine plan has been doing just fine. Now you come along and pray for something. Well, suppose the thing you want isn't in god's divine plan. What do you want him to do? Change his plan? Just for you? Doesn't it seem a little arrogant? It's a divine plan. What's the use of being god if every run-down schmuck with a two dollar prayer book can come along and fuck up your plan? And here's something else, another problem you might have; suppose your prayers aren't answered. What do you say? 'Well it's god's will. God's will be done.' Fine, but if it gods will and he's going to do whatever he wants to anyway; why the fuck bother praying in the first place? Seems like a big waste of time to me. Couldn't you just skip the praying part and get right to his will? [George Carlin, from "You Are All Diseased".]

[Ifreann]

I foe'd God years ago.

His prayers to you are left unanswered then?

I see when he posts, but not the content.

[The Blaatschapen]

His prayers to you are left unanswered then?

I see when he posts, but not the content.

So you see two empty slabs of stone?

[Ifreann]

I see when he posts, but not the content.

So you see two empty slabs of stone?

I see smoke above the bush, but no fire.

[Mavorpen]

So you see two empty slabs of stone?

I see smoke above the bush, but no fire.

So what you're saying is... God doesn't shave.

[Genivaria]

I see smoke above the bush, but no fire.

So what you're saying is... God doesn't shave.

[Divair]

When it comes to the Christian god and why I stopped following him, I have a couple of answers, but none are more fleshed out in comedy than the one that I share with George Carlin:

Trillions and trillions of prayers every day asking and begging and pleading for favors. 'Do this' 'Gimme that' 'I want a new car' 'I want a better job'. And most of this praying takes place on Sunday. And I say fine, pray for anything you want. Pray for anything. But...what about the divine plan? Remember that? The divine plan. Long time ago god made a divine plan. Gave it a lot of thought. Decided it was a good plan. Put it into practice. And for billion and billions of years the divine plan has been doing just fine. Now you come along and pray for something. Well, suppose the thing you want isn't in god's divine plan. What do you want him to do? Change his plan? Just for you? Doesn't it seem a little arrogant? It's a divine plan. What's the use of being god if every run-down schmuck with a two dollar prayer book can come along and fuck up your plan? And here's something else, another problem you might have; suppose your prayers aren't answered. What do you say? 'Well it's god's will. God's will be done.' Fine, but if it gods will and he's going to do whatever he wants to anyway; why the fuck bother praying in the first place? Seems like a big waste of time to me. Couldn't you just skip the praying part and get right to his will? [George Carlin, from "You Are All Diseased".]

Personally, I prefer this quote:

[Johz]

But if a particular government worker wore, say, a cross or a burqa, is the government endorsing a religion? If a child says in the classroom "But everyone knows God doesn't exist", can a teacher say "Well actually, I'd disagree with you here, here and here"?

Government employees wearing a symbol of their faith is not a problem. A teacher voicing her personal beliefs (unless carefully couched as being solely his/her personal beliefs) in the classroom is not okay.

But someone with a job doesn't immediately become an entity of their employer. Surely the teacher has the right to say "well actually, Christians don't believe that all non-Christians will be roasted in hell for an eternity, and I also find it quite offensive that you insist on calling Easter "zombie Jesus day"."

[Seperates]

Government employees wearing a symbol of their faith is not a problem. A teacher voicing her personal beliefs (unless carefully couched as being solely his/her personal beliefs) in the classroom is not okay.

But someone with a job doesn't immediately become an entity of their employer. Surely the teacher has the right to say "pwell actually, Christians don't believe that all non-Christians will be roasted in hell for an eternity, and I also find it quite offensive that you insist on calling Easter "zombie Jesus day"."

Well you can say that, but you can't discipline the kid unless he is bullying others for their belief in the Zombie Jesus or disrupting class time.

And I would of course retort "You can't speak for all the denominations of Christianity, though the thought is nice. After all, if I can be good and go to heaven without worshiping Jesus/God, for what purpose does the worship of Jesus/God exist? And I apologize for calling your stolen pagan holiday 'Zombie Jesus Day'... how about we respect the true creators of the holiday and call it the 'Spring Solstice'?"

[Page]

But someone with a job doesn't immediately become an entity of their employer. Surely the teacher has the right to say "pwell actually, Christians don't believe that all non-Christians will be roasted in hell for an eternity, and I also find it quite offensive that you insist on calling Easter "zombie Jesus day"."

Well you can say that, but you can't discipline the kid unless he is bullying others for their belief in the Zombie Jesus or disrupting class time.

And I would of course retort "You can't speak for all the denominations of Christianity, though the thought is nice. After all, if I can be good and go to heaven without worshiping Jesus/God, for what purpose does the worship of Jesus/God exist? And I apologize for calling your stolen pagan holiday 'Zombie Jesus Day'... how about we respect the true creators of the holiday and call it the 'Spring Solstice'?"

*raises arm* Winner!

[Seperates]

Well you can say that, but you can't discipline the kid unless he is bullying others for their belief in the Zombie Jesus or disrupting class time.

And I would of course retort "You can't speak for all the denominations of Christianity, though the thought is nice. After all, if I can be good and go to heaven without worshiping Jesus/God, for what purpose does the worship of Jesus/God exist? And I apologize for calling your stolen pagan holiday 'Zombie Jesus Day'... how about we respect the true creators of the holiday and call it the 'Spring Solstice'?"

*raises arm* Winner!

Please, don't. I should only speak my mind, not inflate my ego. But thank you, regardless.

[Page]

You had me at "stolen pagan holiday" <3

[Seperates]

You had me at "stolen pagan holiday" <3

Well it is. Original Christians didn't have holidays, what with not really having defined seasons in the desert/Mediterranian. Only the party-fond pagans did, celebrating the turning of the seasons and the more or less defined changes that accompanied them. When Christians were preaching to the pagans, they found that they could mix and match to make the faith more easy to swallow... but the one thing they could never erase was the power of the seasons, because they were undeniable. So instead of getting rid of them, they adapted them into having Christian backgrounds. And some America secularization and poof, "Easter", "Christmas" and "Hallow's Eve" were born.

I do love history. <3

[Johz]

But someone with a job doesn't immediately become an entity of their employer. Surely the teacher has the right to say "pwell actually, Christians don't believe that all non-Christians will be roasted in hell for an eternity, and I also find it quite offensive that you insist on calling Easter "zombie Jesus day"."

Well you can say that, but you can't discipline the kid unless he is bullying others for their belief in the Zombie Jesus or disrupting class time.

And I would of course retort "You can't speak for all the denominations of Christianity, though the thought is nice. After all, if I can be good and go to heaven without worshiping Jesus/God, for what purpose does the worship of Jesus/God exist? And I apologize for calling your stolen pagan holiday 'Zombie Jesus Day'... how about we respect the true creators of the holiday and call it the 'Spring Solstice'?"

And I would of course answer "Certainly I can't answer for all the denominations, but a basic look at the mainline branches of Christianity should enlighten all of us as the the common principles of the religion. And you surmise fairly correctly the reasons why being good is not the key part of getting into heaven, after all, I'm sure you are a very good person at home." And then we could have a discussion about how other religions believe you can get into heaven or any other afterlife, and, despite this being a maths lesson, we all learn something far more useful, especially after we find out that the girl in the third row who never says anything belongs to a very secretive sect of the Aupfegon religion, and explains how she believes we all get eaten by giant slugs after we die. Forever. Just more giant slugs.

[Seperates]

Well you can say that, but you can't discipline the kid unless he is bullying others for their belief in the Zombie Jesus or disrupting class time.

And I would of course retort "You can't speak for all the denominations of Christianity, though the thought is nice. After all, if I can be good and go to heaven without worshiping Jesus/God, for what purpose does the worship of Jesus/God exist? And I apologize for calling your stolen pagan holiday 'Zombie Jesus Day'... how about we respect the true creators of the holiday and call it the 'Spring Solstice'?"

And I would of course answer "Certainly I can't answer for all the denominations, but a basic look at the mainline branches of Christianity should enlighten all of us as the the common principles of the religion. And you surmise fairly correctly the reasons why being good is not the key part of getting into heaven, after all, I'm sure you are a very good person at home." And then we could have a discussion about how other religions believe you can get into heaven or any other afterlife, and, despite this being a maths lesson, we all learn something far more useful, especially after we find out that the girl in the third row who never says anything belongs to a very secretive sect of the Aupfegon religion, and explains how she believes we all get eaten by giant slugs after we die. Forever. Just more giant slugs.

Of course, while that is all interesting, it misses my key point. Without the threat of hell or punishment, religion is more or less pointless, which is why it is pushed so strongly when you are at a young age, with the whole love, acceptance, and such other such nonsense being pushed as soon as you actually begin to think. The ivory-tower vision of religion is not the same as the religion that activly affects the psychs of billions everyday. Much of mainline Christianity does preach hell, regardless of how it is never mentioned other than in Revelations. I know. I was a Catholic, in a fairly liberal branch, but they still heavily implied hell.

The reason they do it is for mere idea survivability. Because If you don't need religion to be good, why have religion? Because it's fun to believe that illogical things are real? If your idea sounds stupid when you voice it, you might want to consider that it might, in fact, be a stupid idea. That doesn't mean you are stupid. But the idea is.

[Johz]

And I would of course answer "Certainly I can't answer for all the denominations, but a basic look at the mainline branches of Christianity should enlighten all of us as the the common principles of the religion. And you surmise fairly correctly the reasons why being good is not the key part of getting into heaven, after all, I'm sure you are a very good person at home." And then we could have a discussion about how other religions believe you can get into heaven or any other afterlife, and, despite this being a maths lesson, we all learn something far more useful, especially after we find out that the girl in the third row who never says anything belongs to a very secretive sect of the Aupfegon religion, and explains how she believes we all get eaten by giant slugs after we die. Forever. Just more giant slugs.

Of course, while that is all interesting, it misses my key point. Without the threat of hell or punishment, religion is more or less pointless, which is why it is pushed so strongly when you are at a young age, with the whole love, acceptance, and such other such nonsense being push as soon as you actually begin to think. The ivory-tower vision of religion is not the same as the religion that activly affects the psychs of billions everyday. Much of mainline Christianity does preach hell, regardless of how it is never mentioned other than in Revelations. I know. I was a Catholic, in a fairly liberal branch, but they still heavily implied hell.

The reason they do it is for mere idea survivability. Because If you don't need religion to be good, why have religion? Because it's fun to believe that illogical things are real? If your idea sounds stupid when you voice it, you might want to consider that it might, in fact, be a stupid idea. That doesn't mean you are stupid. But the idea is.

Coming from another mainline Christian branch, I can tell you that discussion of hell didn't turn up at all in our Sunday School. It was all 'stories Jesus told' and the journeys of the Israelites.

[Seperates]

Of course, while that is all interesting, it misses my key point. Without the threat of hell or punishment, religion is more or less pointless, which is why it is pushed so strongly when you are at a young age, with the whole love, acceptance, and such other such nonsense being push as soon as you actually begin to think. The ivory-tower vision of religion is not the same as the religion that activly affects the psychs of billions everyday. Much of mainline Christianity does preach hell, regardless of how it is never mentioned other than in Revelations. I know. I was a Catholic, in a fairly liberal branch, but they still heavily implied hell.

The reason they do it is for mere idea survivability. Because If you don't need religion to be good, why have religion? Because it's fun to believe that illogical things are real? If your idea sounds stupid when you voice it, you might want to consider that it might, in fact, be a stupid idea. That doesn't mean you are stupid. But the idea is.

Coming from another mainline Christian branch, I can tell you that discussion of hell didn't turn up at all in our Sunday School. It was all 'stories Jesus told' and the journeys of the Israelites.

Ah... so you never paid attention during mass? Or ever heard the "gnashing of teeth" verse on more than one occasion? Then again, you probebly didn't go to Catholic school for the first few years of school.

[Johz]

Coming from another mainline Christian branch, I can tell you that discussion of hell didn't turn up at all in our Sunday School. It was all 'stories Jesus told' and the journeys of the Israelites.

Ah... so you never paid attention during mass? Or ever heard the "gnashing of teeth" verse on more than one occasion? Then again, you probebly didn't go to Catholic school for the first few years of school.

No, I didn't attend a Catholic school, and I admit the CoE system is somewhat more sedate. However, I can honestly say that, despite being fairly precocious as a child, and being one of those kids who'd read and then ask horrible questions, I didn't really come across hell as a key part of my faith. I believed it existed, and I suppose I did connect it to the Dantean infernos. However, I can't really say that I believed me or the people I knew (largely non-Christian, I should point out) would go there.

[Seperates]

Ah... so you never paid attention during mass? Or ever heard the "gnashing of teeth" verse on more than one occasion? Then again, you probebly didn't go to Catholic school for the first few years of school.

No, I didn't attend a Catholic school, and I admit the CoE system is somewhat more sedate. However, I can honestly say that, despite being fairly precocious as a child, and being one of those kids who'd read and then ask horrible questions, I didn't really come across hell as a key part of my faith. I believed it existed, and I suppose I did connect it to the Dantean infernos. However, I can't really say that I believed me or the people I knew (largely non-Christian, I should point out) would go there.

Ah. Church of England, that explains it. Modernly, it is to most religion what watered-down tea is to black coffee. Ironic really, considering how many people died in it's attempt to keep a strong hold on the nation's politics. I was the kid who sat down, read the Bible, asked the hard questions, got the same answers, wasn't satisfied, but got over it, started believing wholeheartedly until I realized after Confirmation that I was really agonistic, despite numerous "religious" expieriences, and NSG killed whatever remaining faith in faith I had.

The simple thing is, religion isn't nessecery. And Occam's Razor as an empirical principle states that we should strip away that which is unnessecery and obtuse unless there is substantial evidence for it. I am good without God. I do not have any need or want to go to heaven. I wish Jesus had lived because I never asked for him to save me. I wish I had never been circumsized, but that is what it is.

We live such short lives. Why should we waste them retelling the fairy tales of our ancestors and taking them seriously, rather than creating our own, studying theirs and the reality around us, attempting to discern the hows and whys of their thinking... and maybe better understanding our own thinking in the process... striving towards the impossible... attempting to relate the vastness of this universe to our own great and feeble human condition.

[Calimera]

We could talk about fun. Thats irreligious...

And that's based on...?

[Dyakovo]

Government employees wearing a symbol of their faith is not a problem. A teacher voicing her personal beliefs (unless carefully couched as being solely his/her personal beliefs) in the classroom is not okay.

But someone with a job doesn't immediately become an entity of their employer.

Actually, while they're on the job, yeah they do...

Surely the teacher has the right to say "well actually, Christians don't believe that all non-Christians will be roasted in hell for an eternity, and I also find it quite offensive that you insist on calling Easter "zombie Jesus day"."

That actually would be fine imo.

[Capisaria]

I'm mostly atheist, i believe that there are spiritual things but i believe science will progress to the point where we'll understand it.

It regarded as anywhere from whatever to OH MY GOD YOU MUST DIE.

[Scrooge Mc Duck Company]

Ok, ok let's be serious now:

[Condunum]

Ok, ok let's be serious now:

(Image)

Because this was definitely needed.