If you could change one thing in history.

[Port Dragon Blitz]

I would stop the Newest Indiana Jones Movie from being made...

[Gryphonia]

I bloody well WOULD go back to Con-stan-ti-nople. Because you COULD go back to Con-stan-ti-nople.

.... It's everybody's business but the Turks.

[Libertariya]

Hard to pick. Some thoughts are :

1. Kill Alexander Hamilton before he could poison the newly formed United States;

2. Kill Abraham Lincoln before he could launch his treasonous war of aggression against the southern States;

3. Kill Keynes before he could develop his poisonous economic theories;

4. Kill Henry Clay before he could develop the "American System".

LOL kind of sounds like I would only want to kill people, but that's not the case - it just seems to be the most effective way that I could guarantee certain individuals didn't cause certain things to come to pass. If there was a more peaceful, less aggressive way of accomplishing those goals, I would do so.

[Dracoria]

Hard to pick. Some thoughts are :

1. Kill Alexander Hamilton before he could poison the newly formed United States;

2. Kill Abraham Lincoln before he could launch his treasonous war of aggression against the southern States;

3. Kill Keynes before he could develop his poisonous economic theories;

4. Kill Henry Clay before he could develop the "American System".

LOL kind of sounds like I would only want to kill people, but that's not the case - it just seems to be the most effective way that I could guarantee certain individuals didn't cause certain things to come to pass. If there was a more peaceful, less aggressive way of accomplishing those goals, I would do so.

Get them really high or drunk and keep them partying through their mid-20s, then hope they never turn their lives around to make something of themselves? Hey, it works for our generation!

[Tatenkraken]

I never liked white people settling America. I would have eradicated the plague that wiped out most (98%) of indigenous people to North America before it really started to hit the natives hard.

[Nazis in Space]

I never liked white people settling America. I would have eradicated the plague that wiped out most (98%) of indigenous people to North America before it really started to hit the natives hard.

nope.avi

[Libertariya]

I never liked white people settling America. I would have eradicated the plague that wiped out most (98%) of indigenous people to North America before it really started to hit the natives hard.

LOL, that idea has some potential - if only there was TV in their day, it would probably work

[Tatenkraken]

I never liked white people settling America. I would have eradicated the plague that wiped out most (98%) of indigenous people to North America before it really started to hit the natives hard.

nope.avi

http://www.pbs.org/gunsgermssteel/varia ... llpox.html

Sorry, I meant 95%. Memory failed to serve me correctly.

[Gigaverse]

Hard to pick. Some thoughts are :

1. Kill Alexander Hamilton before he could poison the newly formed United States;

2. Kill Abraham Lincoln before he could launch his treasonous war of aggression against the southern States;

3. Kill Keynes before he could develop his poisonous economic theories;

4. Kill Henry Clay before he could develop the "American System".

LOL kind of sounds like I would only want to kill people, but that's not the case - it just seems to be the most effective way that I could guarantee certain individuals didn't cause certain things to come to pass. If there was a more peaceful, less aggressive way of accomplishing those goals, I would do so.

Get them really high or drunk and keep them partying through their mid-20s, then hope they never turn their lives around to make something of themselves? Hey, it works for our generation!

In their case, I understand. For others, however, I don't.

[Anacasppia]

I'd erase Stalin.

[Nazis in Space]

nope.avi

http://www.pbs.org/gunsgermssteel/varia ... llpox.html

Sorry, I meant 95%. Memory failed to serve me correctly.

Still nope.avi. The losses are greatly exaggerated in popular media. A decent figure for a single-epidemic loss (Taking a few years) is in the thirty+change range.

Multiple epidemics can of course achieve a 90% loss rate relative to the original population, but that ignores the process of population growth via giving birth - people don't just die with no new ones popping out of random vaginas.

To be quite frank, the 'Everyone died of smallpox!' thing is largely the creation of apologists who'd like to pretend that a white genocide of various American ethnicities never happened.

Unfortunately for them, we actually have control groups to cover what happens when you remove the 'Mass Murder' aspect and count solely on diseases. A fair number of Latin American countries cover this... With relatively pure native population counts of between 10 & 30 (In extreme cases over 50) percent, and Mestizo populations typically in the 30- 70% range.

Their means of agricultural production, and thus population densities, were, particularly in the area south of Mexico and north of Peru, no greater than they were in North America east of the mississippi.

How can this be when diseases did almost the entire job?

It can't, and they didn't. Mass murder did. And the North American colonists did a hell of a lot of a better job at it than the Spaniards, despite the whole economieda business.

[Tatenkraken]

http://www.pbs.org/gunsgermssteel/varia ... llpox.html

Sorry, I meant 95%. Memory failed to serve me correctly.

Still nope.avi. The losses are greatly exaggerated in popular media. A decent figure for a single-epidemic loss (Taking a few years) is in the thirty+change range.

Multiple epidemics can of course achieve a 90% loss rate relative to the original population, but that ignores the process of population growth via giving birth - people don't just die with no new ones popping out of random vaginas.

To be quite frank, the 'Everyone died of smallpox!' thing is largely the creation of apologists who'd like to pretend that a white genocide of various American ethnicities never happened.

Unfortunately for them, we actually have control groups to cover what happens when you remove the 'Mass Murder' aspect and count solely on diseases. A fair number of Latin American countries cover this... With relatively pure native population counts of between 10 & 30 (In extreme cases over 50) percent, and Mestizo populations typically in the 30- 70% range.

Their means of agricultural production, and thus population densities, were, particularly in the area south of Mexico and north of Peru, no greater than they were in North America east of the mississippi.

How can this be when diseases did almost the entire job?

It can't, and they didn't. Mass murder did. And the North American colonists did a hell of a lot of a better job at it than the Spaniards, despite the whole economieda business.

You're refuting a point that doesn't even make a difference. I still wish America belonged to the natives who owned this land rather than the imperialists.

[Nazis in Space]

That's nice, but removing diseases ain't gonna make it happen.

This was, incidentally, touched upon early in this thread.

[Rebelhood]

Sir Francis Drake being anniliated by the Spanish Armada.

[Dissant Machine Empire]

That comet that killed the dinosuars nevert o happen...Wonder how that would be

[Dracoria]

Has anyone touched on a sudden surge of materials and manpower enabling Poland to push further into, and in fact conquer Russia as far as Moscow in the Polish-Soviet War rather than ending at somewhat of a stalemate?

[Dissant Machine Empire]

Has anyone touched on a sudden surge of materials and manpower enabling Poland to push further into, and in fact conquer Russia as far as Moscow in the Polish-Soviet War rather than ending at somewhat of a stalemate?

I didn't even know there was a polish-soviet war

[Dracoria]

Has anyone touched on a sudden surge of materials and manpower enabling Poland to push further into, and in fact conquer Russia as far as Moscow in the Polish-Soviet War rather than ending at somewhat of a stalemate?

I didn't even know there was a polish-soviet war

It's one of those forgotten wars. Right after WWI.

Poland had been an independent nation again for about a year, they got in a tussle with the newly soviet Russia. Polish initiated the attack, Soviets pushed hard in a counter, they got to Warsaw, the Polish encircled and dismantled their vanguard then pushed back equally hard. By the end, the League of Nations was calling on Poland to cease the hostilities, as both nations had exhausted their fighting ability but Poland had the momentum again.

The Ukraine was also involved, albeit split in twain as the Poles had conquered half of it.

This war may have been what caused the Soviets to bide their time through early WWII; it also gave their leaders a hatred of the Poles, which may have led to some of the atrocities perpetrated during Soviet occupation. Not that Nazi occupation would prove to be any better. But yeah, the Soviets dared not attack Poland alone, if that tells you anything.

[Lichian]

Scotland discovered and colonized America, building a powerful military while doing so.

[Dissant Machine Empire]

Scotland discovered and colonized America, building a powerful military while doing so.

Scotland? Seems a bit random. Also, didn't it used to be part of the British Empire back then anyways...so that wouldn't be really changing anything since that is what Britain did

[Dracoria]

The Scottish Highlanders would've fit right in. A tendency toward drinking and fighting, living in the hills, a firm belief that they were never defeated, rumors of certain acts with livestock... Yeah, they would have been from Maryland on south.

[Sucrati]

The Scots? How about the Vikings successfully inhabited the Atlantic Seaboard (probably extending to the Savannah Georgia point on the coast from Canada); Then what?

[Dracoria]

The Scots? How about the Vikings successfully inhabited the Atlantic Seaboard (probably extending to the Savannah Georgia point on the coast from Canada); Then what?

They'd move further west, get fat, and then we'd have the midwest. Oh wait, that's pretty much what happened anyway.

[Divair]

The Scots? How about the Vikings successfully inhabited the Atlantic Seaboard (probably extending to the Savannah Georgia point on the coast from Canada); Then what?

Viking empire.


That would be awesome.

[Estrimbaal]

Sir Francis Drake being anniliated by the Spanish Armada.

How does having England being overrun and conquered by the Spanish, help ANYBODY?