Understanding Leftist Mentality

[Khadgar]

Interesting all this concern about people defrauding welfare, but I have yet to see any about charities defrauding donors or charity managers embezzling the shit out of the funds.

:D Indeed.

I have a friend who works in other countries. Clean water stuff.

He hates the Religious charities as they tended to look for the most destitute villages and portray them as the country.

Said villages rarely saw any usable assistance. He does like to tell one story of something useful. One village received several boxes of Bibles. They used them to start their cooking fires. :D

Look at Mother Theresa, she spent a lot of time "helping" the poor, and didn't accomplish jack shit. Probably because what would actually help falls outside of Catholic teachings. Birth control, women's education, STD prevention et cetera.

[Hittanryan]

Interesting all this concern about people defrauding welfare, but I have yet to see any about charities defrauding donors or charity managers embezzling the shit out of the funds.

Indeed.

I have a friend who works in other countries. Clean water stuff.

He hates the Religious charities as they tended to look for the most destitute villages and portray them as the country.

Said villages rarely saw any usable assistance. He does like to tell one story of something useful. One village received several boxes of Bibles. They used them to start their cooking fires.

IIRC the Catholic church vehemently opposed efforts to curtail the spread of AIDS in Africa because it involved the use of...dun dun DUN...contraception. People having sex out of wedlock? Evil! Letting people die for some backwards dogma? Totally justified.

[Rick Rollin]

Those who are between the ages of eighteen and sixty-five (not a minor or a senior) and are not sufferng from a debilitating illness or injury should not be entitled to receive welfare.

What if they are impoverished and can't find a job no matter how hard they try? What if they are homeless and can only find work at (I was going to say McDonalds, but my teacher told us that it actually looks good on a resumé) a movie theatre concession stand?

Then they were clearly useless to begin with and should die with their inferior genes.

[Celephais]

Look at Mother Theresa, she spent a lot of time "helping" the poor, and didn't accomplish jack shit. Probably because what would actually help falls outside of Catholic teachings. Birth control, women's education, STD prevention et cetera.

Now we're getting somewhere: people who can't afford to breed shouldn't! The problem is that means-tested systems which increase benefits based on the number of kids you have do not exactly encourage this behaviour.

[Yandere Schoolgirls]

Some sources brah

Welfare being used at casinos and strippers, brah A second source brah incase you thought the first one was bias

Another source for you brah

this movie is called precious brah it's about a girl who spent her welfare on fried chicken

1. The plural of anecdote is not data.
2. Sensationalist newstories like this are seldom substantiated, and usually serve to promote an editorial agenda, or get people to buy more copy, not actually inform.
3. WTF were you thinking in citing a work of fiction. Even if it were true, are you really going to begrudge someone on TANF benefits the occaisional bucket of fried chicken?

This really is despicable behavior, and I question whether or not you're actually serious and not a troll.

This is why I'm considering to not even bother posting sources anymore. Everytime I do they're greeted with the same "HOGWASH PROPAGANDA" response. Despite the fact that liberals post bias articles all the time.

Lets breakdown the facts presented in said articles though;

Millions of taxpayer dollars have already been spent on vacations, strip clubs and casinos. This represents a huge misallocation in resources that could of been potentially invested privately into ventures that would of provided jobs or new innovations that could have increased the standard of living. It could of went anywhere, but instead the money was stolen (through taxes and inflation) and wasted.


Also, let me give you a personal experience of when I was a cash register attendee at a grocery store I worked for in my neighborhood. A good portion of the people who tried to use EBT were often rude, and unsightly. More often than not they used their welfare benefits to purchase cigarettes and other unnecessary items.

[Inexplicability]

Look at Mother Theresa, she spent a lot of time "helping" the poor, and didn't accomplish jack shit. Probably because what would actually help falls outside of Catholic teachings. Birth control, women's education, STD prevention et cetera.

Now we're getting somewhere: people who can't afford to breed shouldn't! The problem is that means-tested systems which increase benefits based on the number of kids you have do not exactly encourage this behaviour.

What's the alternative? Letting the kids starve?

[Numer]

1. Read encyclopedia dramatica articles on both parties and nationstates
2. Laugh
3. Realize nationstates' overwhelming majority of leftist thinkers. If your a liberal thinker, bash the crap out of every thread even remotely advertising a conservative agenda.
4. ?????
5. PROFIT!

Hilarious and thought provoking. Do you have anything to add or are you just trolling?

Just trolling . I'll step out now, I just had to comment because I see so many of these threads now.

[Sailsia]

Look at Mother Theresa, she spent a lot of time "helping" the poor, and didn't accomplish jack shit. Probably because what would actually help falls outside of Catholic teachings. Birth control, women's education, STD prevention et cetera.

people who can't afford to breed shouldn't!

Way to keep it classy...

[Rick Rollin]

Now we're getting somewhere: people who can't afford to breed shouldn't! The problem is that means-tested systems which increase benefits based on the number of kids you have do not exactly encourage this behaviour.

What's the alternative? Letting the kids starve?

They deserve to. Clearly. No proof necessary.

[Burzzon]

they dont look at the big picture earth isnt fair life isnt fair. socialism cant work its like perpetual motion in a government.. and my friend wanted to punch me when we wee arguing the other day

[Lackland]

What do you do with those who have mental illnesses such as depression, or who develop issues as they age? People who begin by being able to work for the system are not always able to do so. People develop cancer and other problems.

For those with mental illness, such as depression the simple answer is to get them into a job and off of as much state aid as possible. It's funny you use depression as an example, as that isn't a good reason to claim disability which prevents one from working. Most who don't suffer from severe mental problems such as Autism or retardation are easily employable, and when they get a job that can even help to alleviate some of the problems they suffer. Obviously they would still need to receive medical services, whether that is paid for privately or through the state is an entirely different matter.

This would actually free up money for those who develop age related problems, or other more severe problems such as cancer. in other words people that actually need assistance would receive it, instead of it being used for people that don't need it.

[Tlaceceyaya]

they dont look at the big picture earth isnt fair life isnt fair. socialism cant work its like perpetual motion in a government.. and my friend wanted to punch me when we wee arguing the other day

We can try to MAKE it more fair.

[Celephais]

What's the alternative? Letting the kids starve?

No, but having a child is a choice and not something everyone else is obliged to pay for - there is no sense in increasing benefits for people who choose to have another child.

I want a cat, can you and the rest of the taxpayers please stump up? (see how ridiculous that sounds)

[Osthia]

Mother of God...this real American has discovered my Marxist/Maoist/Stalinist plot to rule the world! To the Obama Cave!

In all seriousness, I could say the exact same thing as you in regards to some conservatives. I understand that you are entitled to an opinion because, you know, that's your right. But I also have a right to have an opinion as a leftist/central-leftist. Too much conservatism is bad, and too much leftist policies are bad. I'd like to find a middle ground, but unfortunately, the ultra-conservatives have everyone by the balls, saying that Obama is a Marxist, anti-Christian, anti-American black devil...and some people agree with that.

First, separation of church and state, in regards to your comment on how filthy liberals like moi destroy Judeo-Christian values, is something I agree with. We may have laws based on those values, but we are not, strictly speaking, a Christian country. It is the government's duty to cater to the needs of those who need it. Should the wealthy be taxed a little more? Sure. Does that mean I want them to pay a 100% tax rate? No, no, no!

So yeah, I'm a Democrat, what are you gonna do about it?

[Chetssaland]

they dont look at the big picture earth isnt fair life isnt fair. socialism cant work its like perpetual motion in a government.. and my friend wanted to punch me when we wee arguing the other day

Yeah I'm sure you know all about how life isn't fair. And just because life isn't fair doesn't mean we shouldn't try to make it fair. It's like saying, "Hey, people die, so fuck the sick and modern medicine! At least I'm healthy."

Not sure what the friend part has anything to do with anything.

[Wikkiwallana]

they dont look at the big picture earth isnt fair life isnt fair. socialism cant work its like perpetual motion in a government.. and my friend wanted to punch me when we wee arguing the other day

So because mindless, impersonal forces aren't fair, people shouldn't be either?

I never have, and never will understand that logic.

[Galloism]

What's the alternative? Letting the kids starve?

No, but having a child is a choice and not something everyone else is obliged to pay for - there is no sense in increasing benefits for people who choose to have another child.

I want a cat, can you and the rest of the taxpayers please stump up? (see how ridiculous that sounds)

Well, we have three options the way I see it.

1) Let children starve because of choices their parents made.
2) Give aid to very poor children's parents to avoid starvation.
3) Take children away from poor parents and let government raise them.


... of the three, what is the best option?

[Wikkiwallana]

What's the alternative? Letting the kids starve?

No, but having a child is a choice and not something everyone else is obliged to pay for - there is no sense in increasing benefits for people who choose to have another child.

I want a cat, can you and the rest of the taxpayers please stump up? (see how ridiculous that sounds)

Are childless people entitled to have one child?

Edit: I should clarify that in this hypothetical, they can afford a child.

[Nidaria]

No, but having a child is a choice and not something everyone else is obliged to pay for - there is no sense in increasing benefits for people who choose to have another child.

I want a cat, can you and the rest of the taxpayers please stump up? (see how ridiculous that sounds)

Well, we have three options the way I see it.

1) Let children starve because of choices their parents made.
2) Give aid to very poor children's parents to avoid starvation.
3) Take children away from poor parents and let government raise them.


... of the three, what is the best option?

#2 naturally. I support welfare for those who need it, such as children in starvation.

[Neutraligon]

What do you do with those who have mental illnesses such as depression, or who develop issues as they age? People who begin by being able to work for the system are not always able to do so. People develop cancer and other problems.

For those with mental illness, such as depression the simple answer is to get them into a job and off of as much state aid as possible. It's funny you use depression as an example, as that isn't a good reason to claim disability which prevents one from working. Most who don't suffer from severe mental problems such as Autism or retardation are easily employable, and when they get a job that can even help to alleviate some of the problems they suffer. Obviously they would still need to receive medical services, whether that is paid for privately or through the state is an entirely different matter.

This would actually free up money for those who develop age related problems, or other more severe problems such as cancer. in other words people that actually need assistance would receive it, instead of it being used for people that don't need it.

THe problem is that people often don't want to hire the mentally ill or handicapped, it isn't that they aren't capable, it's that people don't want them.

[Socialdemokraterne]

This is why I'm considering to not even bother posting sources anymore. Everytime I do they're greeted with the same "HOGWASH PROPAGANDA" response. Despite the fact that liberals post bias articles all the time.

You cited a work of fiction as evidence that welfare abuse is widespread in the United States IN REAL LIFE. What sort of a reaction did you expect? You further submitted information on two states' welfare systems, one state of which (Pennsylvania) had successfully implemented measures which substantially diminished abuse. So you really only submitted one state's worth of problems that remain worthy of note.

Lets breakdown the facts presented in said articles though;

Millions of taxpayer dollars have already been spent on vacations, strip clubs and casinos. This represents a huge misallocation in resources that could of been potentially invested privately into ventures that would of provided jobs or new innovations that could have increased the standard of living. It could of went anywhere, but instead the money was stolen (through taxes and inflation) and wasted.

And you seem to have conveniently forgotten that whistleblower protection helps to diminish this abuse, as is demonstrated by one of your own sources. I'm not debating whether or not welfare fraud exists. I'm asking you to demonstrate that it is pervasive. You failed to do so.

Also, let me give you a personal experience of when I was a cash register attendee at a grocery store I worked for in my neighborhood. A good portion of the people who tried to use EBT were often rude, and unsightly. More often than not they used their welfare benefits to purchase cigarettes and other unnecessary items.

Don't. Personal accounts do not serve as evidence of pervasive abuse of the welfare system.

[Khadgar]

What's the alternative? Letting the kids starve?

No, but having a child is a choice and not something everyone else is obliged to pay for - there is no sense in increasing benefits for people who choose to have another child.

I want a cat, can you and the rest of the taxpayers please stump up? (see how ridiculous that sounds)

It would be better to give people the education and options to avoid having children if they don't want them. The "conservative" answer in the US at present is, if you're sexually active you deserve to get pregnant. Once you're pregnant you're stuck with the kid and they'll legislate to that effect. Once the baby pops out though, fuck him, until he's old enough to join the military.

[Galloism]

No, but having a child is a choice and not something everyone else is obliged to pay for - there is no sense in increasing benefits for people who choose to have another child.

I want a cat, can you and the rest of the taxpayers please stump up? (see how ridiculous that sounds)

It would be better to give people the education and options to avoid having children if they don't want them. The "conservative" answer in the US at present is, if you're sexually active you deserve to get pregnant. Once you're pregnant you're stuck with the kid and they'll legislate to that effect. Once the baby pops out though, fuck him, until he's old enough to join the military.

I've always thought that was odd.

Spending a few million per year on free or subsidized contraception would save us billions on welfare.

[Tmutarakhan]

What if they are impoverished and can't find a job no matter how hard they try? What if they are homeless and can only find work at (I was going to say McDonalds, but my teacher told us that it actually looks good on a resumé) a movie theatre concession stand?

You do know that there are plenty of charities and churches that would help them. There are too few of the people you described to overwhelm the charities, so do not even try that arguement.

I know the opposite.

[Lackland]

THe problem is that people often don't want to hire the mentally ill or handicapped, it isn't that they aren't capable, it's that people don't want them.

Well then that's a problem to be taken up by the legal system, not the government. There are laws that prevent discrimination, and one feels they have been discriminated against they can take legal recourse.