Israel vs. Palestine

[The Mongol Ilkhanate]

As to the justification of the US invasion of other countries, they brought justice by returning to peoples the rights denied to them, extremely high and unjust taxes were removed, peoples of all faiths were granted various civil rights and freedoms and the disgusting corruption of monarchies like Iraq were ended

Thanks for the approval, FPCCCOS. Glad to know someone in the Muslim world believes invasion to restore rights and freedom is equitable.

[Unassuming Pacifists]

Are you serious?! As soon as someone plays the card that a country or nation is controlling media, showbiz, politics etc...warning lights start flashing.
Israel was given to the Jewish nation by the UN. There was meant to be a two state system, but guess what, the Palestinians refused that. The Palestinian leadership has only now accepted this proposal when they started to realise that after each time they refuse two states and go to war, Israel wins.
And if you search for any conspiracy on google, you'll get results. I'm surprised the Jews haven't taken google and started to control it.
Oh, and Yaqub was the third Jew alive, I'm sure he would be perfectly happy that his kids have a place to live.

This has nothing to do with crazy-ass conspiracies. It is a fact that Israel wields influence over major media companies due to the simple fact that most are owned in whole or part by Israelis.

You are right to say that the Israelis accepted the two-state solution and the Palestinians didn't. However, the Palestinians were justified in rejecting this proposal as the Israelis had stolen their land and evicted and persecuted their people. Which part of that do you not understand?

Say a burglar comes to your house. Imagine your house is a mansion. Now say this burglar is armed and you are unarmed and he slowly starts to take parts of your mansion for himself, removing all your relatives from the rooms he has taken for himself. Now imagine a neighbor comes and says you and the burglar should divide the mansion between you. Would you accept something as ridiculous as that? Or would you fight to reclaim what is rightfully yours?

What if then after the burglar takes up residence in what is now 'his' part of the mansion, he now starts taking more rooms that are on 'your' side and populating them with relatives and friends. Would you not defend what is yours? And whilst doing this, he brings the press and gets them to believe him so they do a smear campaign against you, describing you as a terrorist. What would you do then?

I don't know what lies you have been fed or where you live, but I suggest you take a trip to Gaza and the West Bank and see the conditions for yourself. The Palestinians have been effectively reduced to stateless, poor and ignored people who have been put into what are essentially two big concentration camps (Gaza and the West Bank)

Before going on with your emotional rhetoric, can you think logically and be open-minded because you blatantly support a state which is known for terrorism, torture, corruption, usurping land, oppressing people and colonizing the lands of other peoples.

If you don't believe what I say, go to an Orthodox Jew who will tell you the same and have been active in protesting against Israel.

For

My friend, I am an orthodox Jew, and I advocate for Israel, not against it. I have also visited both the West Bank and Gaza, met plenty of Arabs who live in Israel, and observed with my own eyes shipments of food and material being taken into Gaza by the IDF.

[FPCCOS]

As to the justification of the US invasion of other countries, they brought justice by returning to peoples the rights denied to them, extremely high and unjust taxes were removed, peoples of all faiths were granted various civil rights and freedoms and the disgusting corruption of monarchies like Iraq were ended

Thanks for the approval, FPCCCOS. Glad to know someone in the Muslim world believes invasion to restore rights and freedom is equitable.

Surely you don't actually believe that the US invaded Iraq for the purpose of
ending injustice, do you. What the Americans did to Iraq was much worse than anything Saddam Hussein did. You claim to have the ability to spot injustice, yet you support the invasion of Iraq. If you do, then you have at best an interesting definition of injustice. And my statement about the Caliphate does not show that I support the invasion of Iraq.

[The Mongol Ilkhanate]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halabja_poison_gas_attack

Got anything worse than that?

We didn't invade to end those things. We just figured "meh, we're in the neighborhood after wiping the floor with Muslims AGAIN, so may as well."

[Disserbia]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halabja_poison_gas_attack

Got anything worse than that?

We didn't invade to end those things. We just figured "meh, we're in the neighborhood after wiping the floor with Muslims AGAIN, so may as well."

I really don't think you can blame Islam for this.

[The Mongol Ilkhanate]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halabja_poison_gas_attack

Got anything worse than that?

We didn't invade to end those things. We just figured "meh, we're in the neighborhood after wiping the floor with Muslims AGAIN, so may as well."

I really don't think you can blame Islam for this.

For which? Halabja? No, I don't. For Israel-Palestinian conflict? Yes, I do.

[Forster Keys]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halabja_poison_gas_attack

Got anything worse than that?

We didn't invade to end those things. We just figured "meh, we're in the neighborhood after wiping the floor with Muslims AGAIN, so may as well."

Well that's stupid. What is this? The Crusades?

[Disserbia]

I really don't think you can blame Islam for this.

For which? Halabja? No, I don't. For Israel-Palestinian conflict? Yes, I do.

lol there are no such thing as Christian Arabs. Good one bro.

[Jafas United]

For which? Halabja? No, I don't. For Israel-Palestinian conflict? Yes, I do.

lol there are no such thing as Christian Arabs. Good one bro.

But they have little, if anything, to do with the Israel-Palestine conflict. Last time I checked, Hamas wasn't a fanatical Christian organization.

[Milks Empire]

lol there are no such thing as Christian Arabs. Good one bro.

But they have little, if anything, to do with the Israel-Palestine conflict. Last time I checked, Hamas wasn't a fanatical Christian organization.

Palestinian Christians are getting harassed just as much as Palestinian Muslims simply because they're Palestinians.

[TomKirk]

But they have little, if anything, to do with the Israel-Palestine conflict. Last time I checked, Hamas wasn't a fanatical Christian organization.

Palestinian Christians are getting harassed just as much as Palestinian Muslims simply because they're Palestinians.

And from Ottoman times to the present, they have been harassed just as much as Jews simply because they're non-Muslim.

[TomKirk]

This can prove that Israelis starve Palestinians and brutally attack those who try to help them.

There is nothing in your source to justify any claim that there is "starvation" in Gaza. They get regular shipments of food-- from Israel. They did not want those others shipping stuff to Gaza without checking to find out if they were bringing arms-- which, of course, they were.

[Forster Keys]

lol there are no such thing as Christian Arabs. Good one bro.

But they have little, if anything, to do with the Israel-Palestine conflict. Last time I checked, Hamas wasn't a fanatical Christian organization.

Of course they don't join radical Islamist organisations, but radical Islamists aren't the be all and end all of the Palestinian liberation movement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Habash

[Cytania]

I'm neutral on this

[Jafas United]

But they have little, if anything, to do with the Israel-Palestine conflict. Last time I checked, Hamas wasn't a fanatical Christian organization.

Of course they don't join radical Islamist organisations, but radical Islamists aren't the be all and end all of the Palestinian liberation movement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Habash

I guess I stand corrected. But the point point I was trying to make is that there aren't any radical Palestinian Christian terrorist groups. the PFLP's undertone isn't a Christian one, whereas groups such as Hamas have a radical Islamist agenda. And I'm saying this as someone who isn't very religious at all.

Also, I may be wrong, but the PFLP's militant wing, the Abu Ali Mustapha Brigades only use Muslims for their attacks. I am not entirely sure, but that is something I heard.

[Disserbia]

lol there are no such thing as Christian Arabs. Good one bro.

But they have little, if anything, to do with the Israel-Palestine conflict. Last time I checked, Hamas wasn't a fanatical Christian organization.

Yes lets remember that the entire Israel/Palestine conflict is about Hamas. No. Get real, stop generalizing.

[Jafas United]

But they have little, if anything, to do with the Israel-Palestine conflict. Last time I checked, Hamas wasn't a fanatical Christian organization.

Yes lets remember that the entire Israel/Palestine conflict is about Hamas. No. Get real, stop generalizing.

Oh for Christ's sake, it was only an example. You've entirely missed my point.

[Costa Fiero]

Palestinian Christians are getting harassed just as much as Palestinian Muslims simply because they're Palestinians.

Christians are getting harassed soley because their Christians. Hamas has even gotten in on the fun by desecrating Christian graves.

[Disserbia]

Yes lets remember that the entire Israel/Palestine conflict is about Hamas. No. Get real, stop generalizing.

Oh for Christ's sake, it was only an example. You've entirely missed my point.

No I haven't you did. The point was that the religion of Islam is not to blame for the Israel/Palestine conflict. Your point that Hamas is "radically Islamist" does not inform or contradict my point in any way.

[Jafas United]

Oh for Christ's sake, it was only an example. You've entirely missed my point.

No I haven't you did. The point was that the religion of Islam is not to blame for the Israel/Palestine conflict. Your point that Hamas is "radically Islamist" does not inform or contradict my point in any way.

Islam does play a part, but it's not entirely to blame. I was addressing your comment about Arab Christians. The fact is, other than George Habash and maybe a few others, Arab Christians have made very little contribution to the conflict. They haven't set up their own militant groups based around their religion like the fanatical Islamists have.

[Disserbia]

No I haven't you did. The point was that the religion of Islam is not to blame for the Israel/Palestine conflict. Your point that Hamas is "radically Islamist" does not inform or contradict my point in any way.

Islam does play a part, but it's not entirely to blame. I was addressing your comment about Arab Christians. The fact is, other than George Habash and maybe a few others, Arab Christians have made very little contribution to the conflict. They haven't set up their own militant groups based around their religion like the fanatical Islamists have.

I don't think Islam itself plays any part, I think people's conception of Islam and their twisting of its meanings for use as a political tool might play a part, but I think blaming any part of the conflict on the religion of Islam is incredibly foolish. Sorry.

[Jafas United]

Islam does play a part, but it's not entirely to blame. I was addressing your comment about Arab Christians. The fact is, other than George Habash and maybe a few others, Arab Christians have made very little contribution to the conflict. They haven't set up their own militant groups based around their religion like the fanatical Islamists have.

I don't think Islam itself plays any part, I think people's conception of Islam and their twisting of its meanings for use as a political tool might play a part, but I think blaming any part of the conflict on the religion of Islam is incredibly foolish. Sorry.

That's what I was trying to get to. Maybe not so much the religion itself, but the way the religion is interpreted definitely is responsible for a great deal of the conflict. Not just "may", but it's fairly obvious.

We humans always have to correct ourselves for our behavior and fighting "In the name of God" is a perfect scapegoat. It is wilfully ignorant of you to say people's perception of Islam "may" only play a part in the conflict.

[Disserbia]

I don't think Islam itself plays any part, I think people's conception of Islam and their twisting of its meanings for use as a political tool might play a part, but I think blaming any part of the conflict on the religion of Islam is incredibly foolish. Sorry.

That's what I was trying to get to. Maybe not so much the religion itself, but the way the religion is interpreted definitely is responsible for a great deal of the conflict. Not just "may", but it's fairly obvious.

We humans always have to correct ourselves for our behavior and fighting "In the name of God" is a perfect scapegoat. It is wilfully ignorant of you to say people's perception of Islam "may" only play a part in the conflict.

Acknowledging the difference between a religion and how it is interpreted is the difference between tolerance and intolerance, between open-mindedness and bigotry. Ideologies don't fail or cause conflict, people do that. Additionally, no evil regime that happens to be of a certain religious persuasion represents the entire population of people of that religion either.

[Jafas United]

That's what I was trying to get to. Maybe not so much the religion itself, but the way the religion is interpreted definitely is responsible for a great deal of the conflict. Not just "may", but it's fairly obvious.

We humans always have to correct ourselves for our behavior and fighting "In the name of God" is a perfect scapegoat. It is wilfully ignorant of you to say people's perception of Islam "may" only play a part in the conflict.

Acknowledging the difference between a religion and how it is interpreted is the difference between tolerance and intolerance, between open-mindedness and bigotry.

Yes I know...your point?

[Disserbia]

That's what I was trying to get to. Maybe not so much the religion itself, but the way the religion is interpreted definitely is responsible for a great deal of the conflict. Not just "may", but it's fairly obvious.

We humans always have to correct ourselves for our behavior and fighting "In the name of God" is a perfect scapegoat. It is wilfully ignorant of you to say people's perception of Islam "may" only play a part in the conflict.

Acknowledging the difference between a religion and how it is interpreted is the difference between tolerance and intolerance, between open-mindedness and bigotry. Ideologies don't fail or cause conflict, people do that. Additionally, no evil regime that happens to be of a certain religious persuasion represents the entire population of people of that religion either.