Christian disscussion thread

[Abatael]

Here's one example of their heretical beliefs, "What does Baptism give? What good is it?

A. It gives the forgiveness of sins, redeems from death and the Devil, gives eternal salvation to all who believe this, just as God's words and promises declare."
-- Martin Luther, his Lutheran Catechism

That is heresy. The thief on the cross was never baptized, yet Jesus promised him paradise that day. Nobody in the Old Testament was ever baptized, but we read that Abraham "believed God," and it was counted unto him for righteousness (Romans 4:3). You get your sins forgiven by placing your faith in the Lord to forgive your sins, NOT by getting baptized.

[Vazdania]

no, it isn't. They worship God, they love Jesus. How is that Heresy? Loving Jesus, Worshipping God, and being moved by the Holy Spirit are the Christian Fath. Lutherans keep all of these things Sacred to thier religion. Each following it. I don't see how you can judge them, for you will be judged in heaven THE SAME WAY.

No, it is. You obviously do not know what heresy is.

uhm, YES, YES I DO. YOU MY DEAR FRIEND DO NOT KNOW WHAT IT MEANS TO BE CHRISTIAN, YOURE CAUGHT UP IN RELIGION. CHRISTIANITY ISN'T A RELIGION ITS A WAY OF LIFE. YOURE SKREWING IT UP BY BRINGING RELIGION INTO IT. Lutherans love God, THEY REJECT SOME CATHOLIC TEACHINGS THAT THE CATHOLIC CHURCH INTRODUCED AFTER PETER WAS DEAD. OBVIOUSLY YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT HAPPENED AFTER PETER SET UP HIS CHURCH IN ITALY.

[Abatael]

Protestant denominations ARE heresy.

Jesus Christ built his Church on Peter, the Vicar of Christ upon Earth. Peter was the Pope, which is the head of the Roman Catholic Church. With the definition of "heresy," by the events, according to the Holy Bible, and by the transitive property, Lutheranism is heresy.

Yes, Jesus built his church around Peter. That doesn't mean Lutherism is heresy. Lutherism rejected some of the teachings that the Catholic church INTRODUCED as it aged.

No, Jesus Christ did not build his Church "around" Peter. He built it on Peter. There is a huge difference, which makes Lutheranism heresy.

And, yes, it does mean Lutheranism is heresy.

[The United Soviet Socialist Republic]

That is a sad argument.

Or, rather, you have no argument, and, as a heretic, you futilely defend your heresy.

Jesus built a church, does that mean I'm a heritic? Most Catholics I have met are not that anti Protestant, I am sure you would get along well with Queen Isabella the First.

[Abatael]

No, it is. You obviously do not know what heresy is.

uhm, YES, YES I DO. YOU MY DEAR FRIEND DO NOT KNOW WHAT IT MEANS TO BE CHRISTIAN, YOURE CAUGHT UP IN RELIGION. CHRISTIANITY ISN'T A RELIGION ITS A WAY OF LIFE. YOURE SKREWING IT UP BY BRINGING RELIGION INTO IT. Lutherans love God, THEY REJECT SOME CATHOLIC TEACHINGS THAT THE CATHOLIC CHURCH INTRODUCED AFTER PETER WAS DEAD. OBVIOUSLY YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT HAPPENED AFTER PETER SET UP HIS CHURCH IN ITALY.

Jesus Christ built his Church; Peter did not build it. There is no Church of Peter.

And, I'm done talking to you, because you obviously have no idea what you are talking about.

[Vazdania]

Here's one example of their heretical beliefs, "What does Baptism give? What good is it?

A. It gives the forgiveness of sins, redeems from death and the Devil, gives eternal salvation to all who believe this, just as God's words and promises declare."
-- Martin Luther, his Lutheran Catechism

That is heresy. The thief on the cross was never baptized, yet Jesus promised him paradise that day. Nobody in the Old Testament was ever baptized, but we read that Abraham "believed God," and it was counted unto him for righteousness (Romans 4:3). You get your sins forgiven by placing your faith in the Lord to forgive your sins, NOT by getting baptized.

I can only speak for Baptists, but, clearly youre mistaking his words. Luther is likely saying that this is a symbol of faith. Obviously Christ and God view it as important, and what type of Baptism are we talking about? Baptism by the Holy Spirit? or Water Baptism? Because they are 2 very different things.

[Abatael]

Or, rather, you have no argument, and, as a heretic, you futilely defend your heresy.

alm :

Jesus built a church, does that mean I'm a heritic? Most Catholics I have met are not that anti Protestant, I am sure you would get along well with Queen Isabella the First. :roll

The way other Catholics react to the heresy Lutheranism has nothing to do with this. You're a heretic, and Lutheranism is heresy.

It's not the fact that Jesus Christ built a Church that makes you a heretic. It's the fact the he built his Church on the first Pope, and you ignore that fact, and willfully practice heresy that makes you a heretic.

[Vazdania]

uhm, YES, YES I DO. YOU MY DEAR FRIEND DO NOT KNOW WHAT IT MEANS TO BE CHRISTIAN, YOURE CAUGHT UP IN RELIGION. CHRISTIANITY ISN'T A RELIGION ITS A WAY OF LIFE. YOURE SKREWING IT UP BY BRINGING RELIGION INTO IT. Lutherans love God, THEY REJECT SOME CATHOLIC TEACHINGS THAT THE CATHOLIC CHURCH INTRODUCED AFTER PETER WAS DEAD. OBVIOUSLY YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT HAPPENED AFTER PETER SET UP HIS CHURCH IN ITALY.

Jesus Christ built his Church; Peter did not build it. There is no Church of Peter.

And, I'm done talking to you, because you obviously have no idea what you are talking about.

In 1517, Martin Luther published his 95 Theses On the Power of Indulgences criticising the Church, including its practice of selling indulgences. He was building on work done by John Wycliffe and Jan Hus, and other reformers joined the cause. Church beliefs and practices under attack by Protestant reformers included purgatory, particular judgment, devotion to Mary, intercession of the saints, most of the sacraments, and authority of the Pope.

SO where exactly in the Bible does it say there is a purgatory? where does it say we needed to be devoted to Mary? where does it say we must have 7 Sacraments??/ HMMM?? O.o HMMM??? nowhere! this is why they split!

[The United Soviet Socialist Republic]

alm :

Jesus built a church, does that mean I'm a heritic? Most Catholics I have met are not that anti Protestant, I am sure you would get along well with Queen Isabella the First. :roll

The way other Catholics react to the heresy Lutheranism has nothing to do with this. You're a heretic, and Lutheranism is heresy.

It's not the fact that Jesus Christ built a Church that makes you a heretic. It's the fact the he built his Church on the first Pope, and you ignore that fact, and willfully practice heresy that makes you a heretic.

Uh so? How does that mean I am a heritic? Plus Lutheranism practices many of the same things as Catholicism.

[Abatael]

Jesus Christ built his Church; Peter did not build it. There is no Church of Peter.

And, I'm done talking to you, because you obviously have no idea what you are talking about.

In 1517, Martin Luther published his 95 Theses On the Power of Indulgences criticising the Church, including its practice of selling indulgences. He was building on work done by John Wycliffe and Jan Hus, and other reformers joined the cause. Church beliefs and practices under attack by Protestant reformers included purgatory, particular judgment, devotion to Mary, intercession of the saints, most of the sacraments, and authority of the Pope.

SO where exactly in the Bible does it say there is a purgatory? where does it say we needed to be devoted to Mary? where does it say we must have 7 Sacraments??/ HMMM?? O.o HMMM??? nowhere! this is why they split!

You know nothing of doctrine.

I will say this once for you: Jesus Christ made Peter the Vicar of Christ upon Earth. Through Apostolic succession, the Papacy, by divine institution, enjoys delegated authority from Jesus over the entire Church; they enjoy the Primacy of Simon Peter.

Through Apostolic succession, the Primacy of the Bishop of Rome is confirmed.

The Pope is the Vicar of Christ upon Earth. Id est, the Pope is the representative of Christ upon Earth. That means he is in the place of Christ.

That is to say, the Pope has full, supreme, and universal power over the whole Church, a power, which he can always exercise unhindered.

Edit:
1. Simon Peter exercised full, supreme, and universal power over the whole Church.
2. The Papacy enjoys the Primacy of Simon Peter, through Apostolic succession.

3. Therefore, the Pope exercises full, supreme, and universal power of the whole Church.

[Abatael]

The way other Catholics react to the heresy Lutheranism has nothing to do with this. You're a heretic, and Lutheranism is heresy.

It's not the fact that Jesus Christ built a Church that makes you a heretic. It's the fact the he built his Church on the first Pope, and you ignore that fact, and willfully practice heresy that makes you a heretic.

Uh so? How does that mean I am a heritic? Plus Lutheranism practices many of the same things as Catholicism.

Using the definition of "heresy," you are a heretic. That's how. Lutheranism fulfills the definition of a heresy. You believe in a heresy, which is what heretics do.

That, therefore, makes you a heretic. That's why I urge you to convert to Roman Catholicism.

[The United Soviet Socialist Republic]

Uh so? How does that mean I am a heritic? Plus Lutheranism practices many of the same things as Catholicism.

Using the definition of "heresy," you are a heretic. That's how. Lutheranism fulfills the definition of a heresy. You believe in a heresy, which is what heretics do.

That, therefore, makes you a heretic. That's why I urge you to convert to Roman Catholicism.

Oh well. I like Lutheranism, and I am sure the billion Protestants like their denomination to. We worship God and Jesus almost exactly the same way as you, not following the exact words of the Pope does not make us heritics. Maybe your a heritic for not following the words of Martin Luther. The 5 billion non Catholics are not heritics and are not going to Hell.

[Neo-Megatopia]

I believe in Jesus, I believe in God. I've been a Lutheran for as long as I can remember, and go to Church on a regular basis. Yet I also believe in evolution, and love science.

Anyone else around here like me? Or am I simply an oddity/heretic/whatever the Hell you want to call it?

[Menassa]

I believe in Jesus, I believe in God. I've been a Lutheran for as long as I can remember, and go to Church on a regular basis. Yet I also believe in evolution, and love science.

Anyone else around here like me? Or am I simply an oddity/heretic/whatever the Hell you want to call it?

I believe in science.

[Neo-Megatopia]

I believe in Jesus, I believe in God. I've been a Lutheran for as long as I can remember, and go to Church on a regular basis. Yet I also believe in evolution, and love science.

Anyone else around here like me? Or am I simply an oddity/heretic/whatever the Hell you want to call it?

I believe in science.

[The United Soviet Socialist Republic]

I believe in science.

[Abatael]

Using the definition of "heresy," you are a heretic. That's how. Lutheranism fulfills the definition of a heresy. You believe in a heresy, which is what heretics do.

That, therefore, makes you a heretic. That's why I urge you to convert to Roman Catholicism.

Oh well. I like Lutheranism, and I am sure the billion Protestants like their denomination to. We worship God and Jesus almost exactly the same way as you, not following the exact words of the Pope does not make us heritics. Maybe your a heritic for not following the words of Martin Luther. The 5 billion non Catholics are not heritics and are not going to Hell.

Martin Luther is not the Vicar of Christ upon Earth. If he were, I would follow his exact words. But he's not, so I don't.

And, because you disobey the Vicar of Christ, is exactly what makes you a heretic. And, I do not want to see you condemned to Hell for simply not following Catholicism.

Please you have to change. I'm begging you to change!

[The United Soviet Socialist Republic]

Oh well. I like Lutheranism, and I am sure the billion Protestants like their denomination to. We worship God and Jesus almost exactly the same way as you, not following the exact words of the Pope does not make us heritics. Maybe your a heritic for not following the words of Martin Luther. The 5 billion non Catholics are not heritics and are not going to Hell.

Martin Luther is not the Vicar of Christ upon Earth. If he were, I would follow his exact words. But he's not, so I don't.

And, because you disobey the Vicar of Christ, is exactly what makes you a heretic. And, I do not want to see you condemned to Hell for simply not following Catholicism.

Please you have to change. I'm begging you to change!

Everyone who isnt Catholic goes to Hell? Menessa is going to Hell for not being Catholic?

[Neo-Megatopia]

What did we learn here? Everyone's going to hell!

[Abatael]

Martin Luther is not the Vicar of Christ upon Earth. If he were, I would follow his exact words. But he's not, so I don't.

And, because you disobey the Vicar of Christ, is exactly what makes you a heretic. And, I do not want to see you condemned to Hell for simply not following Catholicism.

Please you have to change. I'm begging you to change!

Everyone who isnt Catholic goes to Hell? Menessa is going to Hell for not being Catholic?

I'm not the Christ, so I cannot say that with exactitude, but most likely, yes.

There is the chance they won't be, but why risk the chance of being condemned to Hell?

[Vazdania]

Oh well. I like Lutheranism, and I am sure the billion Protestants like their denomination to. We worship God and Jesus almost exactly the same way as you, not following the exact words of the Pope does not make us heritics. Maybe your a heritic for not following the words of Martin Luther. The 5 billion non Catholics are not heritics and are not going to Hell.

Martin Luther is not the Vicar of Christ upon Earth. If he were, I would follow his exact words. But he's not, so I don't.

And, because you disobey the Vicar of Christ, is exactly what makes you a heretic. And, I do not want to see you condemned to Hell for simply not following Catholicism.

Please you have to change. I'm begging you to change!

Baptists have been around sinse Jesus' time you know ._. There is evidence to support the fact that there has been an endless line of succesion sinse that time. Furthermore, one will not be condemned if they worship differently. JOHN 3:16. READ IT LOVE IT KNOW IT.

[Menassa]

Martin Luther is not the Vicar of Christ upon Earth. If he were, I would follow his exact words. But he's not, so I don't.

And, because you disobey the Vicar of Christ, is exactly what makes you a heretic. And, I do not want to see you condemned to Hell for simply not following Catholicism.

Please you have to change. I'm begging you to change!

Everyone who isnt Catholic goes to Hell? Menessa is going to Hell for not being Catholic?

I think I'm going to hell in every religion.

[Abatael]

Martin Luther is not the Vicar of Christ upon Earth. If he were, I would follow his exact words. But he's not, so I don't.

And, because you disobey the Vicar of Christ, is exactly what makes you a heretic. And, I do not want to see you condemned to Hell for simply not following Catholicism.

Please you have to change. I'm begging you to change!

Baptists have been around sinse Jesus' time you know ._. There is evidence to support the fact that there has been an endless line of succesion sinse that time. Furthermore, one will not be condemned if they worship differently. JOHN 3:16. READ IT LOVE IT KNOW IT.

I don't understand what you're trying to say about Baptism.

And, yes, God did love the world so, but not you betray his sacrifice, and don't listen to the Vicar of Christ.

[The United Soviet Socialist Republic]

Everyone who isnt Catholic goes to Hell? Menessa is going to Hell for not being Catholic?

I'm not the Christ, so I cannot say that with exactitude, but most likely, yes.

There is the chance they won't be, but why risk the chance of being condemned to Hell?

Well, you've seemed a bit less than nice but I will consider converting to Catholicism. Course there's a chance the Jews are right, maybe we should both convert to that, why risk it. After all there is no telling which religion is right.

[Vazdania]

Everyone who isnt Catholic goes to Hell? Menessa is going to Hell for not being Catholic?

I think I'm going to hell in every religion.

Have you accepted Jesus as your savior? or, are you Jewish (ethnic group)?