Hitler's Many Failures

[IshCong]

That's rather different than fixing the supply lines, isn't it.

indeed it is.

there are two solutions to the problem, send more supplies or use less supplies.

since A wasn't going to happen option B was the only one possible. since rommel didn't give a shit about supplies, he needed to go.

Rommel couldn't hold Africa with the supplies he had, through no real fault of his own.
Expecting a less competent commander to hold Africa with less supplies is unrealistic.

[The UK in Exile]

indeed it is.

there are two solutions to the problem, send more supplies or use less supplies.

since A wasn't going to happen option B was the only one possible. since rommel didn't give a shit about supplies, he needed to go.

Rommel couldn't hold Africa with the supplies he had, through no real fault of his own.
Expecting a less competent commander to hold Africa with less supplies is unrealistic.

yes I rather think the idea was to send a more competent one. or at the least one who could count.

[Forsher]

indeed it is.

there are two solutions to the problem, send more supplies or use less supplies.

since A wasn't going to happen option B was the only one possible. since rommel didn't give a shit about supplies, he needed to go.

Rommel couldn't hold Africa with the supplies he had, through no real fault of his own.
Expecting a less competent commander to hold Africa with less supplies is unrealistic.

Actually he had a number of opportunites where the supply lines were over extended too far and he needed to go just a little further for victory.

Well, ideally he would find another capable commander, either to replace Rommel or take over his supply lines.

How, exactly, was Rommel at fault for the Royal Navy owning the Mediterranean?

Which is where the RN comes into play. Had that not been the case it is entirely possible that the overextension would have happened slightly later. It might have made a lot of a difference. Of course this post reveals a difference in what aspects we have been looking at.

How, exactly, was Rommel at fault for the Royal Navy owning the Mediterranean?

launching an offensive you don't have supplies for isn't clever.

Well, it can be. And for a while it was but, I suppose, the overall problems that he had (both within and beyond his control) ultimately meant it wasn't.

How, exactly, was Rommel at fault for the Royal Navy owning the Mediterranean?

Yeah, I'm with Pyro on this one.
That wasn't a situation that could have been fixed merely by swapping out commanders in Africa.
I'm still not seeing how Hitler could have fixed Rommel's supply problems.

Hopefully I have now addressed this.

launching an offensive you don't have supplies for isn't clever.

That's rather different than fixing the supply lines, isn't it.

This too.

[IshCong]

Rommel couldn't hold Africa with the supplies he had, through no real fault of his own.
Expecting a less competent commander to hold Africa with less supplies is unrealistic.

yes I rather think the idea was to send a more competent one. or at the least one who could count.

Then explain how Rommel was incompetent, and name a commander more suited for the task.
Please.

[Forsher]

yes I rather think the idea was to send a more competent one. or at the least one who could count.

Then explain how Rommel was incompetent, and name a commander more suited for the task.
Please.

You seem to be under the impression that all of Rommel's supply issues stemmed from the restricted nature of his supllies.

[IshCong]

Then explain how Rommel was incompetent, and name a commander more suited for the task.
Please.

You seem to be under the impression that all of Rommel's supply issues stemmed from the restricted nature of his supllies.

You didn't answer my question...

[The UK in Exile]

yes I rather think the idea was to send a more competent one. or at the least one who could count.

Then explain how Rommel was incompetent, and name a commander more suited for the task.
Please.

no, I believe I will let chief of the general staff Franz Halder explain.

"Now at last he is constrained to state that his forces are not sufficiently strong to allow him to take full advantage of the 'unique opportunities' offered by the overall situation. That is the impression we have had for quite some time over here."

a commander more suited for the task? who knows.

[Forsher]

You seem to be under the impression that all of Rommel's supply issues stemmed from the restricted nature of his supllies.

You didn't answer my question...

Essentially, Rommel went way too far.

[Mike the Progressive]

Being Hitler.

[Forsher]

Then explain how Rommel was incompetent, and name a commander more suited for the task.
Please.

no, I believe I will let chief of the general staff Franz Halder explain.

"Now at last he is constrained to state that his forces are not sufficiently strong to allow him to take full advantage of the 'unique opportunities' offered by the overall situation. That is the impression we have had for quite some time over here."

a commander more suited for the task? who knows.

Also.

Rommel is only overrated because he didn't establish adequate supply lines.

And because he diverted the Axis operation that was ready for Malta to the Lybian theatre.
And because he thought that after Kasserine the Algerian front was secured.
And because he left his command post in North Africa vacant at a crucial time.
And because he completely fucked up the early deployment at the second El-Alamein, opting for a symmetrical defensive configuration not allowing for any counterattack (neither on the shores nor on Al-Qattara).
And because he fucked up the redeployment after Monty's first attack there, and all of his strategy became "trying saving the German units by running back all the way to Tunis".
And because he fucked up all the Atlantic Wall.
And because he wasn't able to mount an armoured counterattack at D+1.



Also... you pointed out that you needed to put up a good supply line. And you stated that Rommel wasn't able to put up supply lines (that is, sucked at strategy). Why would you choose Rommel? Just to be sure to fail again?

And somewhere in here are many answers to that question.

[Foguk]

He was short.

and Austrian.

[Communist Cyrodiil]

His first mistake was invading Poland.

[IshCong]

And because he diverted the Axis operation that was ready for Malta to the Lybian theatre.
And because he thought that after Kasserine the Algerian front was secured.
And because he left his command post in North Africa vacant at a crucial time.
And because he completely fucked up the early deployment at the second El-Alamein, opting for a symmetrical defensive configuration not allowing for any counterattack (neither on the shores nor on Al-Qattara).
And because he fucked up the redeployment after Monty's first attack there, and all of his strategy became "trying saving the German units by running back all the way to Tunis".
And because he fucked up all the Atlantic Wall.
And because he wasn't able to mount an armoured counterattack at D+1.



Also... you pointed out that you needed to put up a good supply line. And you stated that Rommel wasn't able to put up supply lines (that is, sucked at strategy). Why would you choose Rommel? Just to be sure to fail again?

And somewhere in here are many answers to that question.

Risottia's post is much more helpful. Thank you.

[North California]

Or when Americans won the Battle of Britain? Or the battle of El Alamein?
Quite funny how the Americans think they won the war.

Yes, they show up late for every war and then try to take all the credit, saying how they're so tough, when the only reason they never truly suffered major damage was because of their geographical isolation

What's funny though is how a year after the US entered both World Wars against Germany, they ended. Coincidence? No. Face it, nobody wants a prolonged war against the US, so they throw in the towel while everyone else piggy-backs on us. Japan learned the hard way.


I'm not saying America single-highhandedly won the war, but you guys are greatly underestimating our contribution. D-Day wouldn't have even been considered if America wasn't in the fight.

[The Tree Hugging People]

He had one ball..... That's just sad.

[Forsher]

His first mistake was invading Poland.

Assuming he was actually interested in dealing with the Treaty of Versailles the invasion of the rest of Czechoslovakia was the error.

[IshCong]

Yes, they show up late for every war and then try to take all the credit, saying how they're so tough, when the only reason they never truly suffered major damage was because of their geographical isolation

What's funny though is how a year after the US entered both World Wars against Germany, they ended. Coincidence? No.

Blatant lies.

Face it, nobody wants a prolonged war against the US, so they throw in the towel while everyone else piggy-backs on us. Japan learned the hard way.

I'm not saying America single-highhandedly won the war, but you guys are greatly underestimating our contribution. D-Day wouldn't have even been considered if America wasn't in the fight.

It wouldn't have been considered without Britain or the USSR either.
Now, can we get back to the topic rather than more nationalist nit-picking?

[Lynion]

Wait a second, Nazi merely went to the moon: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=He_PWsJqsVY


Seriously though, his major failure was believing he was a better general than the rest of his staff, he didn't listen to anyone especially during the last years of the WW2, invading the Soviet Union and invading North Africa at the same time. He either should've focused on the Soviet Union and gain the oil in the south and then used that to get into the Middle East. That and he wasn't a general of any kind.

[Communist Cyrodiil]

His first mistake was invading Poland.

Assuming he was actually interested in dealing with the Treaty of Versailles the invasion of the rest of Czechoslovakia was the error.

Well his first mistake was picking a fight with the world.

[Forsher]

Assuming he was actually interested in dealing with the Treaty of Versailles the invasion of the rest of Czechoslovakia was the error.

Well his first mistake was picking a fight with the world.

Well, that was his biggest error.

[Jafas United]

Operation Barbarossa and thinking the Italians wouldn't betray him were his two most costly failures.

[Awesomeland]

Hitler's primary mistake, the one they he repeated essentially throughout his later career, breaking rule 17: ignoring his generals. He got lucky early on, and took this as a belief that he knew the business of invading things better than his generals did, and so he repeatedly ignored them. This caught up messily with him.

Rule #17: When I employ people as advisors, I will occasionally listen to their advice.

[IshCong]

Hitler's primary mistake, the one they he repeated essentially throughout his later career, breaking rule 17: ignoring his generals. He got lucky early on, and took this as a belief that he knew the business of invading things better than his generals did, and so he repeatedly ignored them. This caught up messily with him.

Rule #17: When I employ people as advisors, I will occasionally listen to their advice.

Rule #17?
Try Rule #0: I will read the List.

[Goldbar]

His belief in the occult doomed him. He was obsessed with becoming immortal. It drove him mad. He also beleived his own propaganda - he believed he was infallible. He wouldn't listen to anybody in the end - hence many strategic and tactical mistakes. Hitler was already mad when the US entered the war. He would have lost via some huge tactical mistake (like attacking Russia, which he did and in doing so destroyed his own military), or he would have eventually been assassinated.

[IshCong]

His belief in the occult doomed him. He was obsessed with becoming immortal. It drove him mad. He also beleived his own propaganda - he believed he was infallible. He wouldn't listen to anybody in the end - hence many strategic and tactical mistakes. Hitler was already mad when the US entered the war. He would have lost via some huge tactical mistake (like attacking Russia, which he did and in doing so destroyed his own military), or he would have eventually been assassinated.

In Soviet Eastern Europe, USSR invades YOU!
Seriously though, whether Hitler invaded or not, the USSR was going to take a slice out of Germany at some point. Most likely, before the war was concluded otherwise.