Bullying, damaging or helpful?

[Arbites]

If you don't want to hear our opinions, don't post here. Simple.

How does defending my opinion suggest I don't wish to hear yours.

I threw the notion that bullying was good out there not because I wholeheartedly advocate it, but because I think it is often perceived as an undoubtedly bad thing, when there are a few people who are stronger for it.

I am saying I don't want to hear your personal stories, because I want you to stick to opinions.

"Bullying is bad because I felt horrible" doesn't cut it.

Bullying is bad because it has been proven to cause lasting psychological damage. Unfortunately, you are not doing much to disprove that notion.

[Arbites]

Physical bullying is equally studied to psychological bullying, and equally as damaging. There literally is no upside to bullying, however much the authoritarian fetishists here want there to be.

And that is your opinion based on reading articles, I have an opinion that contradicts that based on experience.

I know I benefited from the experience, and if I have some long term psychological problem, I don't know what people are complaining about because I love my life.

You don't seem to get it. Your single personal experience does not discount the fact that every other source says bullying does nothing but damage. You say you got over it (a dubious claim, but I digress), good for you. Not everyone does. It's not the victim's fault for getting bullied, and bullies need to be punished accordingly.

[Arbites]

You don't seem to get it. Your single personal experience does not discount the fact that every other source says bullying does nothing but damage. You say you got over it (a dubious claim, but I digress), good for you. Not everyone does. It's not the victim's fault for getting bullied, and bullies need to be punished accordingly.

I have said that before, my personal account does not prove anything, but it casts doubt, and that is all that is needed for debate.

Given the subject matter, not nearly enough doubt. Therein lies the problem.

[Arbites]

HAI GUISE. USING THIS THREAD'S INSANE TROLL LOGIC, I AM PROUD TO ANNOUNCE THAT ALL SCHOOLS WILL NOW BE FITTED WITH HIGHLY RADIOACTIVE NUCLEAR WASTE. IT MIGHT KILL A LOT OF KIDS, BUT ONE OR TWO MIGHT GAIN SUPERPOWER MUTATIONS, AND THAT MAKES IT TOTES MEGAS!

CAVE JOHNSON HERE, THE LAB BOYS TELL ME OPENING A PRIVATE SCHOOL AND USING IT AS A TESTING FACILITY WAS...what did they call it? Unethical? Insane? Waste of money? DID IT ANYWAY! NOW IF ANYBODY WANTS EXTRA CREDIT, JUST HEAD ON DOWN TO THE NURSES OFFICE AND LET US INJECT NANOPARTICLES INTO YOUR TUMORS. WE'VE ALREADY TAKEN CARE OF THE TUMORS PART.

[Arbites]

Given the subject matter, not nearly enough doubt. Therein lies the problem.

Well enough doubt to spark over 100 replies.

It's NSG, the only subjects that don't break 100 replies are ad spam and in-character threads that get moved before they hit 100.

[Arbites]

Had I not been bullied, I wouldn't have ever had a reason to fit in, get friends, and enjoy my life. People who can't take bullying are unfit for the real world. It is a benificial, natural, and normal method of natural selection. Making schools hostile to bullies will only make the problem worse. It will reduce bullying, but it won't end it. In the end it will increase bullying-related suicides, cut first amendment rights, and destroy the motive for loser children to gain friends.
I should probably thank the people who bullied me.
Oh, and bullies were the reason I stopped playing baseball, and started playing sports that I enjoy far more and am actually good at (rugby and football).

You needed that kind of motivation to fit in and play a different sport? I feel very sorry for you. Sounds to me like you let the bullies win.

[Arbites]

This is a very interesting topic indeed. I too am a long-term victim of bullying (even death threats), and I must say that without my experiances I wouldn't be today such a strong advocator of anti-bullying and defense of minority beliefs and backgrounds.

But then again, without bullying I wouldn't be a "who needs prison when you have a firing squad" justice maniac either. You be the judge.

...but...you wouldn't need a judge in that kind of system.

[Arbites]

... Get the fuck out, OP.

This is not a debatable topic. At all. Bullying is never helpful for anyone, ever.

Really, because after being bullied for years, I am in complete and total agreement with the OP.
Bullying actually improved my life. It gave me a reason to fit in and make friends.

For all your natural selection talk, it sounds like you lost the battle. You let them change you, you gave in.

[Arbites]

For all your natural selection talk, it sounds like you lost the battle. You let them change you, you gave in.

I changed completely of my own volition. Does that mean I "win"?

I'm not familiar with your personal history, so I don't know.

[Arbites]

I'm not familiar with your personal history, so I don't know.

See page 6. It's a somewhat long post, but there's a point somewhere in there and it gives plenty of details on my personal situation. The Reader's Digest version: I wanted a sense of purpose, formed a weight-lifting club, and found purpose in that. Everything went up from there, and my bullies backed off (not due to the strength alone, but I bet part of it was because I wasn't an easy emotional target anymore either).

The difference is that you're not claiming that being bullied changed you for the better. You credit yourself for eventually taking the initiative and moving past them, but you're not saying that the actual bullying was a positive. The OP and the one guy I replied to, on the other hand, seem to have Stockholm Syndrome.

[Arbites]

The difference is that you're not claiming that being bullied changed you for the better. You credit yourself for eventually taking the initiative and moving past them, but you're not saying that the actual bullying was a positive. The OP and the one guy I replied to, on the other hand, seem to have Stockholm Syndrome.

Oh, no. The bullying was absolutely terrible, and I can't see how it would ever be beneficial (even if it built drive to overcome them, because that's just spawning hatred in you). I forgave my bullies, but I absolutely never wanted to associate with them ever again. I forgave them, but never enough to let them back into my life. Of course, I've broken this rule for those who became friendly and polite, and some such people were among my best friends. But this was rare.

Yeah, the OP and about 1 other person claim that bullying itself is actually a positive using the age-old "builds character" argument. It's been wrong for ages, but some people just can't let it go.

[Arbites]

Social Darwinism was thoroughly discredited decades go.

Like I said, I am no social darwinist. But I do realize that if it weren't for bullies, I'd have no social skills, freinds, or a life for that matter. I would be a complete and total loser who would be universally hated. Is bullying good, no. Has it helped me a lot? Yes.
Wussifying the whole world will not make there be less bullying or fix the problem. It will decrease bullying, but increase suicide.

Decreasing bullying increases suicide. Cave Johnson would be proud of that theory.

You've got a severe case of Stockholm Syndrome, nothing less.

[Arbites]

Like I said, I am no social darwinist. But I do realize that if it weren't for bullies, I'd have no social skills, freinds, or a life for that matter. I would be a complete and total loser who would be universally hated. Is bullying good, no. Has it helped me a lot? Yes.
Wussifying the whole world will not make there be less bullying or fix the problem. It will decrease bullying, but increase suicide.

Don't you see how you're degrading who you were? You accepted the bullies' insults as the truth, then abandoned who you were just to win their approval. This is not how anyone should handle bullying.

[Arbites]

Only the strange, weird, out-of-place and insecure people are bullied. And they deserve it. See it as corrective treatment to get them to adjust themselves to the norm.

I bullied a lot of kids in my younger years. I taught them to act normal. They owe their future to me.

Oh look, an Internet Tough Guy. Guess this kind of thread brings them out.

[Arbites]

Don't you see how you're degrading who you were? You accepted the bullies' insults as the truth, then abandoned who you were just to win their approval. This is not how anyone should handle bullying.

I certainly don't feel that way. I'm my own person, flaws and all. If the bullies don't like it, they can kiss my bony white a**

That was directed at him, specifically because from what he's said, he has basically let the bullies define who he is.

[Arbites]

How is physically bullying someone helpful, again?

I said, it is more likely to be helpful. The harm here is relatively easy to avoid and is short term.

So a crooked nose from having your nose repeatedly busted doesn't count as long-term damage?

[Arbites]

So a crooked nose from having your nose repeatedly busted doesn't count as long-term damage?

A crooked nose is not harmful to my knowledge. Short term is under a year here I suppose and its the harm not the physical results of said harm.

Deviated septum? Besides, why should you have to get stuck with any physical pain just because some ratfuck meathead is on a power trip and singled you out?

[Arbites]

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

I used to be bullied around quite a lot as a kid, until I eventually learned to hit back, which involved bluffing and intimidation far more than it did involve actual physical force. In other words, I learned to play a rabid dog that everyone deems too dangerous to bother, and I still use this tactic around people that I don't feel safe around with.

The only problem is, genuine sociopaths don't fall for this deception, not even because they would see through it, but simply because they are incapable of being intimidated by it. This has resulted in a few quite painful backlashes, but otherwise works well on most normal people.

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Anyway, bullying is part of the natural animal way of determining the pecking order in the pack. One thing I've learned in my life is that you must always hit back if struck (figuratively and literally), or you will always remain somebody's bitch. So I think it is beneficial because it toughens one and teaches one to stand up for himself. Respect and approval is never handed on a silver platter, it can only be earned with sweat and sometimes blood. Of course, it may drive some hypersensitive weaklings to suicide, but then again, the world doesn't have much use of overly emotional folks anyway.

It is stronger to not give in and change yourself just because some asshole singles you out. Anyone can cave, it takes real balls to stay true to yourself in the face of adversity.

Besides, victim blaming makes no sense. "Maladjusted little shit picking on a random target to work out his insecurities? Well, the victim must've done something to deserve it."

Come on, man, you're a fellow Imperium of Man ripoff. What happened to "death before dishonor"?

[Arbites]

The bully is there to test your resolve. To be what you are means to have the resolve and guts to be it. If you don't have what it takes to stand up against the bully and make him bugger the hell off of you, then you will obviously be his bottom bitch and frankly don't deserve better either.

The bully's purpose is to make you fear him, and the only way you can avoid that is make him fear you, at least to a degree that convinces him to seek for easier prey. Never ever let someone humiliate you unchallenged, even if it means violence. Flesh wounds eventually heal, but pride wounds never do. More often than not, standing up against bullies ended... well, painfully for me, but it was the consistency with which I continued to strike back when struck eventually convinced them to seek more defenseless victims.

And you don't see anything wrong with them simply moving on to do the same thing to someone else? They're obviously the ones with the problem, and as such, corrective action must be taken by authority figures. I don't care what, as long as it keeps them from pointlessly harassing anyone else. By changing who you are, by meeting the bullies' violence with violence, you are stooping to their level, and you have lost.

[Arbites]

And you don't see anything wrong with them simply moving on to do the same thing to someone else? They're obviously the ones with the problem, and as such, corrective action must be taken by authority figures. I don't care what, as long as it keeps them from pointlessly harassing anyone else. By changing who you are, by meeting the bullies' violence with violence, you are stooping to their level, and you have lost.

What a bunch of shit. Are you advocating pacifism and nonviolence? Pfft. Ridiculous. Violence is the greatest problem solver in history.

And if you hate bullies so much then you should have problem with them being put in their place.

Self-defense is fine. Hell, if violence will really solve the problem and you find yourself in a position of strength, then go for it. I'm saying that if you fundamentally change who you are just to pacify, satisfy, or intimidate bullies, then you have lost. Becoming violent and unhinged just to deter bullies who shouldn't be allowed to harass you in the first place, quite frankly, means they got to you.

[Arbites]

Rite of passage? Pecking order? I haven't been bullied in school extensively, yet I can still defend myself. What, people can't live their lives without being bullied, in order to seperate who is 'wimpy' and 'not wimpy'?

Sure they can, but everyone gets bullied to some degree.

You're thinking of teasing. Everyone certainly gets teased at one point or another. Not everyone gets bullied.

[Arbites]

I'd like to be "That guy". Bullying is helpful, in moderation. It helps a person become stronger. It helps people not become flimsy, pansy, weak willed idiots who can't cope with insults.

Its like continually working a muscle. Its hard, it hurts, and it burns. But tomorrow, it becomes stronger.

Its the same thing for bullying. Keeps you mentally resilient.

"Bullying" has been going on for thousands of years. From killing the atheists back in the 1600's to beating up the kid who talks funny on the playground. It's always been with us and its not going away.

Inb4 liberals whining about love and tolerance.

Killing the atheists and beating up a kid who talks funny ain't exactly helping your case, really. The effects of bullying are more akin to an open wound. Treated properly, it might scab over and heal, yet it could still leave lasting scars. Left unchecked, it begins to fester, until you end up with a full-blown potentially lethal staph infection.

[Arbites]

Brava! That guy has NO IDEA how wrong he really is. I'm not a fully 'better' person for the bullying I suffered. Now, if I even feel that I'm being bullied in the slightest...I react.....BADLY

You never learned a greater respect for compassion and humanity? You never learned greater coping skills? Never learned to stand the hell up for yourself? You never learned to shrug off hate? Never learned self respect? Never learned

Boy, I guess you people just let it happen and never thought about it again.

Are you telling me that you didn't try to change your world? Never tried to take control of a situation? Maybe you deserved it if you didn't try to help yourself.

Let me refer you to my status, so I can tell you that I am not trolling. I, for lack of a better word, have a more radical view on this issue.

To be perfectly blunt, I call bullshit. Psychological bullying isn't something you can solve with a no-holds barred cage match in the back alley. If you try to fight back against the type, they'll make you out to be the bad guy, get a bunch of their friends to wail on your ass, and start spreading lies. Ignore it, and you'll wake up and find yourself a pariah for no justifiable reason.

[Arbites]

Bullying toughens up the kid and teaches them to have thicker skin and stop being a thin skinned little weakling makes them learn to stand up for themselves rather than be sheep, and weeds out the weaklings. It made me stronger and taught me to fight back, that others words and thoughts of me unless they were useful to me were simply dirt and that all people unless they are useful to me are simply lower than dirt and to not care about what they say about me unless it directly effects me. Also taught me to never trust anyone always watch my back and fight tooth and nail for myself and myself alone, no one ever came to help me and i learned nobody was going to help me and i learned i must only help myself unless i directly benefit from helping them they are useless to me and to simply ignore them. I don't have my father in my life so i need to fend for myself, I'm the perfect bullying target i go to school in a relatively wealthy neighborhood and i am poor, also I'm an African-American and i have red hair, black eyebrows, and blonde mustache so i was a pretty good target for people until i showed them what happens if they mess with me. when i was in Elementary it was either 2nd or 3rd grade after school this one little slut kept on pushing me in the mud, she would when i wasn't looking run up behind me push me on the ground run away to a safe distance then laugh at me, one day she forgot to run to a safe distance and just laughed at me when i got back up and turned around she was smiling this annoying little smile so i punched her in the face, and then threw her in the mud i preceded to bite and choke on her neck until one of the adults hit me over the head with a plank, from then on everyone knew if you mess with me I'm going to mess you up badly. "Survival of the fittest" animals in the wild have predators to get rid of the weak, we humans have Bully's.

Eh, 3/10. Maddox does it better.

[Arbites]

The 'everyone should become a sociopath' approach to bullying.
I think. It's hard to tell.

Looks more like a Poe or troll to me.