Self-acceptance.

[Aelosia]

Oh, I am pretty sure I will never, ever accept myself. So, hardly most people who doesn't have an interest accept me.

I'd like to think that my direct family, mainly my father and my brothers, accept me, but they more like...Endure me, than accept me.

I'd like to think that the other people apart from my direct family that in some moment told me that they love me have accepted me, but I am pretty sure they didn't and acted out of interest. I do believe, however, that their attitudes stem from the fact that acceptance from others depends entirely on self acceptance.

Most people I know act with either indifference, outright interest or even hostility towards me. I haven't seen a case of crystal clear, normal acceptance of others. Becuase noone entirely accept themselves.

[LOL ANARCHY NUBZ]

Self accetance...who cares? If you think you're that bad, do drugs or commit suicide. Otherwise, it obviously doesn;t matter.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Self accetance...who cares? If you think you're that bad, do drugs or commit suicide. Otherwise, it obviously doesn;t matter.

Bravo, bravo. I commend you for the inanity of this post. Bravo!

[LOL ANARCHY NUBZ]

Self accetance...who cares? If you think you're that bad, do drugs or commit suicide. Otherwise, it obviously doesn;t matter.

Bravo, bravo. I commend you for the inanity of this post. Bravo!

Thankyou. But seriously. The drugs work best in personal experience. Not that I've tried ioption two. Yet, anyway.

[Anti-Social Darwinism]

It's the other way around. If we accept ourselves, others will accept us.

But we have to learn to accept ourselves first. That's right, learn. We're taught to accept ourselves by others who accept us for ourselves. This starts with our parents and, later, our teachers - if our parents and teachers don't completely accept us, we don't learn how to accept ourselves. WIthout that strong base from our families and close significant others (teachers, friends) it becomes increasingly more difficult to love and accept ourselves.

[Treznor]

Oh, I am pretty sure I will never, ever accept myself. So, hardly most people who doesn't have an interest accept me.

I'd like to think that my direct family, mainly my father and my brothers, accept me, but they more like...Endure me, than accept me.

I'd like to think that the other people apart from my direct family that in some moment told me that they love me have accepted me, but I am pretty sure they didn't and acted out of interest. I do believe, however, that their attitudes stem from the fact that acceptance from others depends entirely on self acceptance.

Most people I know act with either indifference, outright interest or even hostility towards me. I haven't seen a case of crystal clear, normal acceptance of others. Becuase noone entirely accept themselves.

[tangent]The fact that I desperately want to get you into bed doesn't change my acceptance of you because it hasn't happened and may never happen. Does that still mean my acceptance of you is based out of my own self-interest?[/tangent]

[LOL ANARCHY NUBZ]

Yes

[JarVik]

Self accetance...who cares? If you think you're that bad, do drugs or commit suicide. Otherwise, it obviously doesn;t matter.

Hmn, one ends all possiblilty if self acceptance, and the other can turn you into a homeless, jobless druggie. That will really help with the self acceptance.

A little Escape is one thing, but you really need to look into a self help peer group or something before you try the other stuff.

[LOL ANARCHY NUBZ]

I'm neitehr homeless nor jobless, so I don't see your point.

[Czardas]

Self accetance...who cares? If you think you're that bad, do drugs or commit suicide. Otherwise, it obviously doesn;t matter.

That's the kind of attitude I like to hear!

But, on another point, why is self-acceptance, apparently, so desirable? Why is it always acceptance that is emphasized as opposed to, say, actualization? Is everyone really that insecure?

[Aelosia]

[tangent]The fact that I desperately want to get you into bed doesn't change my acceptance of you because it hasn't happened and may never happen. Does that still mean my acceptance of you is based out of my own self-interest?[/tangent]

The fact that you desperately want me to slip in your bed changes everything. It doesn't matter if it happens or it doesn't.

It does mean your acceptance of me is centered on your self-interest. If I accept that as an acceptance, that would mean that each time someone looks for me because I owe them money means they accept me.

More than hitting a tangent, you nailed the center.

[JarVik]

I'm neitehr homeless nor jobless, so I don't see your point.

Give it time then,

[Treznor]

Self accetance...who cares? If you think you're that bad, do drugs or commit suicide. Otherwise, it obviously doesn;t matter.

That's the kind of attitude I like to hear!

But, on another point, why is self-acceptance, apparently, so desirable? Why is it always acceptance that is emphasized as opposed to, say, actualization? Is everyone really that insecure?

I can't speak for anyone else, but "acceptance" in this context means "acknowledgment." As we discussed earlier, some people aren't willing or never considered looking at themselves critically to figure out who they are. It's sort of like the air: how often do people think about it when they're just sitting in a room focused on something else?

[NotRust]

Self-acceptance just reads to me as "settling with yourself". I want to kick my own ass, and be able to look back and point at the old me and laugh. So no, self-acceptance is a crock.

[Czardas]

Self accetance...who cares? If you think you're that bad, do drugs or commit suicide. Otherwise, it obviously doesn;t matter.

That's the kind of attitude I like to hear!

But, on another point, why is self-acceptance, apparently, so desirable? Why is it always acceptance that is emphasized as opposed to, say, actualization? Is everyone really that insecure?

I can't speak for anyone else, but "acceptance" in this context means "acknowledgment." As we discussed earlier, some people aren't willing or never considered looking at themselves critically to figure out who they are. It's sort of like the air: how often do people think about it when they're just sitting in a room focused on something else?

Acceptance doesn't just mean acknowledgment. Acknowledging the existence of smallpox doesn't mean you have to accept smallpox if you catch it. In short, I feel that the emphasis on self-acceptance is an inherently defeatist attitude, with implications of "since you are this way, you should just accept it and not try to change". Moreover, since self-acceptance (according to everyone's definitions in this thread) is either caused by or is supposed to cause others to accept you, it focuses on others: gain self-acceptance in order that others will like you; subtext: "society wants you to accept yourself; conform to this rule or be outcast."

It seems an insidious cult from this perspective.

[Treznor]

[tangent]The fact that I desperately want to get you into bed doesn't change my acceptance of you because it hasn't happened and may never happen. Does that still mean my acceptance of you is based out of my own self-interest?[/tangent]

The fact that you desperately want me to slip in your bed changes everything. It doesn't matter if it happens or it doesn't.

It does mean your acceptance of me is centered on your self-interest. If I accept that as an acceptance, that would mean that each time someone looks for me because I owe them money means they accept me.

More than hitting a tangent, you nailed the center.

I find that both sad and disturbing. My interest in getting you into bed is a consequence of getting to know you and coming to accept you, not the cause of it. Of course, since my telepathy is broken I have no way to convince you of this.

[Treznor]

Self accetance...who cares? If you think you're that bad, do drugs or commit suicide. Otherwise, it obviously doesn;t matter.

That's the kind of attitude I like to hear!

But, on another point, why is self-acceptance, apparently, so desirable? Why is it always acceptance that is emphasized as opposed to, say, actualization? Is everyone really that insecure?

I can't speak for anyone else, but "acceptance" in this context means "acknowledgment." As we discussed earlier, some people aren't willing or never considered looking at themselves critically to figure out who they are. It's sort of like the air: how often do people think about it when they're just sitting in a room focused on something else?

Acceptance doesn't just mean acknowledgment. Acknowledging the existence of smallpox doesn't mean you have to accept smallpox if you catch it. In short, I feel that the emphasis on self-acceptance is an inherently defeatist attitude, with implications of "since you are this way, you should just accept it and not try to change". Moreover, since self-acceptance (according to everyone's definitions in this thread) is either caused by or is supposed to cause others to accept you, it focuses on others: gain self-acceptance in order that others will like you; subtext: "society wants you to accept yourself; conform to this rule or be outcast."

It seems an insidious cult from this perspective.

If you deny that you have smallpox after you catch it, you're in a world of hurt. The first step to addressing the problem is by acknowledging not only that it exists, but that you have it. This is what I mean by acceptance. Until you accept that you have smallpox, you can't treat it properly.

"Acceptance" in this context is not the same as "resignation." Just because you accept you have a problem doesn't mean you have to stop there.

[Ryadn]

I think the only time we really NEED acceptance from others is in childhood. If our primary caretakers accept us and help us build a solid self-image, that's really all we need. If that doesn't happen, it doesn't really matter how many people later in life sing our praises, we're probably never going to accept ourselves.

[Aelosia]

[tangent]The fact that I desperately want to get you into bed doesn't change my acceptance of you because it hasn't happened and may never happen. Does that still mean my acceptance of you is based out of my own self-interest?[/tangent]

The fact that you desperately want me to slip in your bed changes everything. It doesn't matter if it happens or it doesn't.

It does mean your acceptance of me is centered on your self-interest. If I accept that as an acceptance, that would mean that each time someone looks for me because I owe them money means they accept me.

More than hitting a tangent, you nailed the center.

I find that both sad and disturbing. My interest in getting you into bed is a consequence of getting to know you and coming to accept you, not the cause of it. Of course, since my telepathy is broken I have no way to convince you of this.

Did you telepathy ever worked?

I know it is sad, I think that is one of the reasons why art always says reality is sad.

[Czardas]

If you deny that you have smallpox after you catch it, you're in a world of hurt. The first step to addressing the problem is by acknowledging not only that it exists, but that you have it. This is what I mean by acceptance. Until you accept that you have smallpox, you can't treat it properly.

"Acceptance" in this context is not the same as "resignation."

If you define it that way, no, it's not. Society, however, appears to disagree with you.

Especially, look at works of art and fiction, many of which reinforce the notion that seeking to better yourself is a bad thing. This is a trend that started with the Bible, of which the most famous example is Frankenstein, and which has continued to the present day. And art has always been a barometer of cultural attitudes.

"Accept yourself", in the context given by society as a whole, suggests "accept your place in society", with a subtext of social authoritarianism. If you define it differently as a social libertarian, that's your decision, not necessarily society's.

[LOL ANARCHY NUBZ]

I'm neitehr homeless nor jobless, so I don't see your point.

Give it time then,

Even then, I have the welfare state to svae me.

[Cameroi]

charity begins all the way at home, with accepting one's self.
whatever any belief may claim about the circumstances of our birth,
(which was rally just trying to say ain't none of us all that much better then the next poor sucker, none of us born infallible)
you are the best you anyone can ever be.
it is of course, after that, up to each of us what we do with it.

[Geniasis]

Especially, look at works of art and fiction, many of which reinforce the notion that seeking to better yourself is a bad thing. This is a trend that started with the Bible, of which the most famous example is Frankenstein, and which has continued to the present day. And art has always been a barometer of cultural attitudes.

Que?