Retroactive Rape

[Keralam]

So what are your proposals to lower rape in society. NSG?

Encourage compassion in younger people. Encourage women to train in effective self-defense. Build open, tolerant communities where women can discuss these issues without feeling ashamed.

And if that fails, beat rapists with sticks.

[Northwest Slobovia]

So what are your proposals to lower rape in society. NSG?

What, you didn't like the first two times I gave a suggestion? Try reducing head injuries to reduce violence induced by brain damage. It's a great no-regrets study: even if it doesn't reduce violence -- and I think it will -- reducing brain damage is worth it by itself.

[Camicon]

So what are your proposals to lower rape in society. NSG?

Reforming rape laws would help. I'm not a civil rights attorney, or anything of the sort, so the 'how', and 'what' escape me.
I'll leave the idea-making to people that know a thing or two about the process, and then make my own informed decision after reading their presented material.

The biggest factor though is teaching boys, at a young age, that abuse of women, especially of a sexual nature, is never right, and is one of the most morally reprehensible acts they could commit.

[Yahkima]

So what are your proposals to lower rape in society. NSG?

Encourage compassion in younger people. Encourage women to train in effective self-defense. Build open, tolerant communities where women can discuss these issues without feeling ashamed.

And if that fails, beat rapists with sticks.

This. Similarly deny on a cultural level any form of "slut-shaming."

The nations with the highest incidence of rape in the world today are the ones in which it is believed that a woman can somehow "bring it on herself" via dress or action.

[The Congregationists]

So what are your proposals to lower rape in society. NSG?

The first and best approach would be to can all forms of anti-materialist, guilt based morality. They don't work. Ethical behavior is most likely from people with a strong and robust sense of self. People force-fed diets of guilt inducing garbage like "original sin" or "white male privilige" don't actually behave virtuously, they fall into cycles of sin - guilt - pennance - temptation - sin; rinse, lather and repeat.

Accept yourself fully and unconditionally. Make conscious your repressed desires and fears. That which is conscious can be controlled. That which you try to repress only ends up resurfacing subconsciously.

The biggest factor though is teaching boys, at a young age, that abuse of women, especially of a sexual nature, is never right, and is one of the most morally reprehensible acts they could commit.

As long as this doesn't become a veiled attack on male heterosexuality. You'd be surprised at how easily we can see the waving finger of the self righteous moralist from behind the veil of political correctness. And we, like you, don't tend to respond well to hypocritical self exhaultation. To that end, I'd also suggest that women ought not to disrespect and abuse men either. IN fact, I think that alone would do a lot to diffuse the current situation.

[Tlaceceyaya]

You seriously believe that allowing women to send men to prison for whatever reason is just?
What if the two have a fight after sex or before it, and the woman decides that since the man doesn't have an alibi, she'll have him sent to prison for several years? When she calms down, she'll get in a LOT of trouble if she comes forward, so she'll probably not do anything. The innocent man who had a fight with his partner after consensual sex or before they were planning to have sex is now stuck in prison for several years and once he's out, his life will be ruined.

It's more utilitarian than just.

So, to stop women from suffering physical and emotional trauma lasting a few years, you are in favour of sending innocent men to prison and ruining the rest of their lives?

[Newrussia]

I thought we had a whole "Innocent before proven guilt" thing in this country.

Bitches be crazy.

[SaintB]

I guess next we'll have murder cases decided simply by the testimony of one alleged witness, then, right? And of course, if someone says that someone else stole something from them, they must be completely true; I mean, who would lie about that? In fact, why don't we just through out that whole "trial" thing and just have one guy dole out verdicts based on whatever he feels like at the time! That'll not only reduce crime across the board, but also lower taxes as we won't need to pay for all those ridiculous "trials" and "judges."

That is not equivalent. It is possible to prevent yourself from being falsely accused of rape. Simply never have sex with anyone. It is not possible to take actions which would prevent you from any possibility of being falsely accused of murder.

Even if you don't have sex someone can accuse you of rape... trust me on that one.

The proposed system assumes all men are rapists and that is pretty much the opposite of everything both men and women have been working for since the beginning of the feminist movement.

[Forsher]

http://blog.iblamethepatriarchy.com/2007/05/16/the-new-page-of-consent/

This article proposes a different system to deal with rape than the current one. Rather than focusing on issues of consent, it presumes that the legal default of all women be "no." In other words, the law assumes that a woman did not want sex unless it can be proven otherwise. This would essentially be a reversal of the burden of proof.

Under this system, all accusations of rape would automatically be considered correct. Every woman who says she was raped was, by definition, raped.

Proponents of the system say that it would definitely cut down of the amount of rapes out there. They also allege that it would not be abused, or if it were abused, the abuse would be so absolutely minor as to be negligible. They also state that it doesn't hurt men at all, since a man is perfectly free to refrain from ever having sex at all if he wants to avoid any risk of being accused of rape.

Opponents allege that it would, in fact, be abused far more than the proponents seem to think. They also assert that it is not only counter to the fundamental notion of innocent until proven guilty, but it also technically criminalizes all heterosexual intercourse.

What does NSG think? Would this legal idea of rape be abused harshly, or is that simply conspiratorial thinking? It seems to be quite obvious that this would lower the overall amount of rape in the world, so the only questions are whether it's just and whether or not the potential for abuse outweighs the benefit.

I'm actually not sure myself. It would certainly lower the amount of rape out there, and the whole notion of constant false rape accusations as revenge from bitter women is pretty much a myth. On the other hand, the potential for abuse does exist. Of course, the potential can be completely avoided if a man simply elects to never have sex. I'm ambivalent here.

You see civilised countries have something known as innocent until proven guilty.

[Grainne Ni Malley]

So, to stop women from suffering physical and emotional trauma lasting a few years, you are in favour of sending innocent men to prison and ruining the rest of their lives?

While I am not on the side of potentially sending innocent men to prison for the "greater good", I would like to point out that the trauma resulting from rape is often carried on for more than just a few years. Sometimes it is a lifetime.

For the sake of fairness, you probably shouldn't defend the likelihood of damage in one person's life by belittling the likelihood of damage in another person's life.

[Caragonia]

And the already-known truth comes out.

This would be nothing but a ploy to advance your warped views on sex, despite the fact that it is the very biological nature of us to engage in it.

No. If you drive, there is a risk of dying in a car crash. If you're terrified of dying in a car crash, my advice is either to get over it or never get into a car.

Terrible false analogy.

If you have sex, there is a risk of being accused of rape. This is true even in the present system. If you're completely terrified of being falsely accused of rape, then either seek out counseling to deal with your unreasonable fear or refrain from having sex. Simple as that.

In your own so very human-hating world maybe. I get that you don't like people having sex, maybe you're a person who prefers hyper-cleanliness instead of having to deal with all those icky leftovers from a sexual encounter.

Pray tell, without any sex ever, how do we survive?

People get on planes despite the small probability that they could crash.

Terrible false analogy again, plus how do we survive? Cloning for centuries would lead to eventual cellular degradation, and the slow retardation and death of the human race.

Additionally, sex can be simple to falsify. There's only a small window after a rape incident in which you can even prove sexual intercourse happened- since you're placing the burden of proof on the defendant, this becomes irrelevant, and abusers of the system could say, "It happened a couple months ago and I was scared to come forth!"

Alibis are still a possible defense.

Oh good.

"Judge A - Where were you at the time of the rape?
Man B - Home alone since my wife was at work.
Judge A - Hmm. Sounds like bull to me. Guilty!"

This is what your own system creates.

I don't know if you're just a rabid misandrist, but your trolling is going a bit far now.

[Katyuscha]

Thought the title said Radioactive Rape... was severely disappointed when I got here...

[Pyravar]

No. Why on Earth would I acknowledge any sort of legitimacy of such an intellectually bankrupt idea with an argument? Mockery is all it deserves, and shock.

I think it's our moral duty to bend over backwards in order to help people who have been historically oppressed. If this means a few innocent men go to prison in order to greatly reduce rape, doesn't the end justify the means?

Keep your backward guilt to yourself. The oppressors are guilty for oppression not just random masses.

[Traxa]

Yeah, no.
Fuck no.

@ FST You see civilised countries have something known as innocent until proven guilty. Pretty much sums up why this would be a bad idea.

@GWO I must say I'm shocked you wouldn't back such a dimwitted tyrannical idea given other things you've come out in support of up to and including fascism itself. I did almost enjoy the cute fantasy about the teachers daughter though it was a good chuckle late at night.

[Renascibilitas]

I think this idea can be summarized as the following:

- Allows a vindictive woman who wants revenge on a man to have a very easy mechanism for doing so.
- Violates the idea of ''innocent before proven guilty''.
- Discriminates against men because their allegations of rape are not automatically considered correct, while allegations of rape by women are.

[Idealismania]

guilty until proven innocent - a bad thing(tm)

This. 100%

[Cill Charthaigh]

When I read through this thread, I laugh whenever FST says "misogyny" when this whole idea is extremely misandrist.

[Four-sided Triangles]

Education, encouraging women to come out about what happened to them, etc.
Definitely not allowing women to have the lives of men they dislike ruined.

The information about what rape is and what it isn't is already out there. If people aren't willing to do the research to educate themselves, what makes you think they'll accept the education if it's shoved in their faces?

[Bengera]

This shit is dumb as fuck.

[UEG-The Systems Alliance]

This still going?

[Renascibilitas]

This shit is dumb as fuck.

I agree.

[The Congregationists]

I'd also like to point out the grand-slam success that zero tolerance and mass incarceration have been in dealing with petty crime and drugs, and so have no reason to believe that swelling America's prison population EVEN MORE by sending even more men who don't belong there is most certain to teach them all that wimmin aren't sex objects.

[1000 Cats]

Another thing to note is that the main reason so many people get away with rape is because their victims simply don't report it. It's not a matter of the justice system being too soft, it's a matter of the justice system not getting involved at all.

[Four-sided Triangles]

Another thing to note is that the main reason so many people get away with rape is because their victims simply don't report it. It's not a matter of the justice system being too soft, it's a matter of the justice system not getting involved at all.

Often because women that bring it forward half to put up with a lot of unnecessary and inappropriate questions that have no relevance to whether or not they were raped.

[The Congregationists]

Another thing to note is that the main reason so many people get away with rape is because their victims simply don't report it. It's not a matter of the justice system being too soft, it's a matter of the justice system not getting involved at all.

Often because women that bring it forward half to put up with a lot of unnecessary and inappropriate questions that have no relevance to whether or not they were raped.

Gathering evidence to try to ascertain the truth or falsehood of an allegation that is perhaps the worst that can be made against a person. Yeah - totally uneccesary and inappropriate. Definately.