A Sugar Tax on Soda? How about on EVERYTHING?

[The_pantless_hero]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090916/ap_ ... d_soda_tax

One of the proposed plans being circulated more realistically now to fight obesity and pay for the healthcare plan is a tax on soda. Don't get me wrong, I am not opposing that nor will I stop buying soda if it passes, but just taxing soda is entirely disingenuous. They are going after soda because its full of fat making sugar. So what? Has anyone in America looked at their food? What about Kool-Aid, the majority of "juices," all of those pouch drinks? They all contain inordinate amounts of HFCS (high fructose corn syrup, the 'devil' in soda). And that is solely drinks aimed at kids. What about things normal people might use. Ketchup? I am quite certain HFCS is the second ingredient after water. Peanut butter? If you arn't buying the purely natural stuff (peanuts and salt) and it only has HFCS, you are lucky. It usually has molasses as well as palm sugar and such in order to firm it up for spreading. If you arn't putting it together yourself, there is a 75% chance there is HFCS in it. But are they instituting a tax on HFCS? Fuck no. The corn lobby would have every farmer in the US shipped to DC to march in the streets and burn officials in effigy. So they are going solely after soda which is full of "sugar" without ever mentioning that the real problem is almost every god damn product in the US is full of empty calories derived from HFCS just like soda.

[RightWingChristians]

I don't see a problem.


I drink water and Tea.

[Yootopia]

Just reduce the duties on cigarettes, they make you lose weight. Problem solved, an American version of an OBE to my house pls.

[Ashmoria]

id have to agree with you, pantsless. what is the point? are they going to put on such a huge tax that we can no longer reasonably afford to buy sugar sodas? (like they do with the tobacco tax)

do we really want the government to start micromanaging our eating habits? not that we cant USE some micromanagement, its obvious that as a people we are unable to make reasonable dietary decisions, but NO i dont want some bureaucrat deciding these things based on whatever food company gave the most money to the most congressmen to get their priorities included into national food policy.

[Ordo Mallus]

*cough* went over this in my US gov. class and turns out this is a form of communism

[The_pantless_hero]

id have to agree with you, pantsless. what is the point? are they going to put on such a huge tax that we can no longer reasonably afford to buy sugar sodas? (like they do with the tobacco tax)

do we really want the government to start micromanaging our eating habits? not that we cant USE some micromanagement, its obvious that as a people we are unable to make reasonable dietary decisions, but NO i dont want some bureaucrat deciding these things based on whatever food company gave the most money to the most congressmen to get their priorities included into national food policy.

If this is your argument, you don't agree with me. I am not disagreeing with or opposing a sugar tax on soda. I am opposing a tax solely on soda for an ingredient that is in probably a good 75% of processed products. Never mind the sodas that actually use sugar or are diet.

[Papayania]

Bubbles make you fart, and farting is bad for the ozone layer. It's just a "green" tax, in disguise.

[Yootopia]

*cough* went over this in my US gov. class and turns out this is a form of communism

... no.

[Ashmoria]

id have to agree with you, pantsless. what is the point? are they going to put on such a huge tax that we can no longer reasonably afford to buy sugar sodas? (like they do with the tobacco tax)

do we really want the government to start micromanaging our eating habits? not that we cant USE some micromanagement, its obvious that as a people we are unable to make reasonable dietary decisions, but NO i dont want some bureaucrat deciding these things based on whatever food company gave the most money to the most congressmen to get their priorities included into national food policy.

If this is your argument, you don't agree with me. I am not disagreeing with or opposing a sugar tax on soda. I am opposing a tax solely on soda for an ingredient that is in probably a good 75% of processed products.

so you would LOVE to have a sugar tax on every freaking food product in the country?

i thought you were some kind of conservative. damn youre hard to pigeonhole.

[Veblenia]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090916/ap_on_he_me/us_med_soda_tax

One of the proposed plans being circulated more realistically now to fight obesity and pay for the healthcare plan is a tax on soda. Don't get me wrong, I am not opposing that nor will I stop buying soda if it passes, but just taxing soda is entirely disingenuous. They are going after soda because its full of fat making sugar. So what? Has anyone in America looked at their food? What about Kool-Aid, the majority of "juices," all of those pouch drinks? They all contain inordinate amounts of HFCS (high fructose corn syrup, the 'devil' in soda). And that is solely drinks aimed at kids. What about things normal people might use. Ketchup? I am quite certain HFCS is the second ingredient after water. Peanut butter? If you arn't buying the purely natural stuff (peanuts and salt) and it only has HFCS, you are lucky. It usually has molasses as well as palm sugar and such in order to firm it up for spreading. If you arn't putting it together yourself, there is a 75% chance there is HFCS in it. But are they instituting a tax on HFCS? Fuck no. The corn lobby would have every farmer in the US shipped to DC to march in the streets and burn officials in effigy. So they are going solely after soda which is full of "sugar" without ever mentioning that the real problem is almost every god damn product in the US is full of empty calories derived from HFCS just like soda.

Killing the corn subsidies seems like the more elegant solution, although I guess that's completely off the table for political reasons.

[Ordo Mallus]

*cough* went over this in my US gov. class and turns out this is a form of communism

... no.

acttuuuaalllyyy. this is a form of controlling the food market, which happens to be a rather large trait of communism. control the food you control the people. although it is on a much smaller scale than full blown control, this is a varient of it.

[The_pantless_hero]

so you would LOVE to have a sugar tax on every freaking food product in the country?

i thought you were some kind of conservative. damn youre hard to pigeonhole.

No, it would be fair to have a sugar tax on every product loaded down with sugar, especially given that's the reason they are aiming at soda. The only reason they don't is because all of the "sugar" in products is high fructose corn syrup. The corn lobby would be very angry if people were suddenly buying less from one of the cookie jars their hands were in. The corn lobby won't piss and moan if it is restricted to bugs of chips and sodas, ie junk foods. But if it extends to EVERYTHING, their is going to be a mass hurt on them - Ketchup, Peanut Butter, ice cream, Kool-Aid, most "juices," tomato sauce, etc etc

[Soratsin]

*cough* went over this in my US gov. class and turns out this is a form of communism

... no.

acttuuuaalllyyy. this is a form of controlling the food market, which happens to be a rather large trait of communism. control the food you control the people. although it is on a much smaller scale than full blown control, this is a varient of it.

Taxation isn't a form of control on the market. If it was, every nation on earth would have a planned economy. If they were giving the factories quotas and telling them what formula to use in their product, then they would be controlling the market.

[Yootopia]

*cough* went over this in my US gov. class and turns out this is a form of communism

... no.

acttuuuaalllyyy. this is a form of controlling the food market, which happens to be a rather large trait of communism. control the food you control the people. although it is on a much smaller scale than full blown control, this is a varient of it.

Nope.

Communism is about the base of power regarding the economy. The government taxing certain foods isn't communism. The general population taking over the farms and factories and deciding not to produce pop would be.

[Yootopia]

Taxation isn't a form of control on the market.

Yes it is. If I levy a duty of 90 cents to the dollar on, say, Kitkats, but only 30 cents to the dollar on Mars Bars, which will the general public, esp. those on lower incomes be more willing to buy?

If it was, every nation on earth would have a planned economy.

I don't really see why. Non-planned economies generally make for more experimentation and the like, which can pay off, increasing government revenues through income and corporation tax.

[Ashmoria]

so you would LOVE to have a sugar tax on every freaking food product in the country?

i thought you were some kind of conservative. damn youre hard to pigeonhole.

No, it would be fair to have a sugar tax on every product loaded down with sugar, especially given that's the reason they are aiming at soda. The only reason they don't is because all of the "sugar" in products is high fructose corn syrup. The corn lobby would be very angry if people were suddenly buying less from one of the cookie jars their hands were in. The corn lobby won't piss and moan if it is restricted to bugs of chips and sodas, ie junk foods. But if it extends to EVERYTHING, their is going to be a mass hurt on them - Ketchup, Peanut Butter, ice cream, Kool-Aid, most "juices," tomato sauce, etc etc

i dont disagree with that but i really do think that a tax on sugar soda or on ANY food ingredient is a bad idea.

if you dont want the tax, just how do we disagree?

[Yootopia]

if you dont want the tax, just how do we disagree?

Throw some unsweetened orange juice off a pier in Boston.

[Ashmoria]

if you dont want the tax, just how do we disagree?

Throw some unsweetened orange juice off a pier in Boston.

ewww that stuff is nasty. i always drop a tablespoon of sugar into the glass to make it palatable

[Ordo Mallus]

*cough* went over this in my US gov. class and turns out this is a form of communism

... no.

acttuuuaalllyyy. this is a form of controlling the food market, which happens to be a rather large trait of communism. control the food you control the people. although it is on a much smaller scale than full blown control, this is a varient of it.

Nope.

Communism is about the base of power regarding the economy. The government taxing certain foods isn't communism. The general population taking over the farms and factories and deciding not to produce pop would be.

i am 100% certain that my US gov teacher is smarter than you in this field, and when i asked this if this would be classified as a communist bill, he agreed. communism is the complete and total control of every aspect of life. eating candy and other such things happen to be a small aspect of life that is trying to be influenced by the government. this is communism. congrads, did you pass US gov?

[Soratsin]

Yes it is. If I levy a duty of 90 cents to the dollar on, say, Kitkats, but only 30 cents to the dollar on Mars Bars, which will the general public, esp. those on lower incomes be more willing to buy?

Regardless, a tax on HFCS isn't going to result in a class-less society, or a planned economy, taxing a certain food is neither socialist nor communist.

I don't really see why. Non-planned economies generally make for more experimentation and the like, which can pay off, increasing government revenues through income and corporation tax.

If taxation was inherently communist, as Ordo suggested, then wouldn't just about every state on earth have a communist planned economy?

[Ashmoria]

i am 100% certain that my US gov teacher is smarter than you in this field, and when i asked this if this would be classified as a communist bill, he agreed. communism is the complete and total control of every aspect of life. eating candy and other such things happen to be a small aspect of life that is trying to be influenced by the government. this is communism. congrads, did you pass US gov?

are you talking about a highschool class? i dont think its legal to tell the truth about communism in US public schools.

[Soratsin]

i am 100% certain that my US gov teacher is smarter than you in this field, and when i asked this if this would be classified as a communist bill, he agreed. communism is the complete and total control of every aspect of life. eating candy and other such things happen to be a small aspect of life that is trying to be influenced by the government. this is communism. congrads, did you pass US gov?

ignoring the argument from authority...

Your government teacher needs to be fired. The goal of communism is to create a state without class, I.E. a state without a government or any authority whatsoever. What you've described is basic authoritarianism.

[The_pantless_hero]

if you dont want the tax, just how do we disagree?

Throw some unsweetened orange juice off a pier in Boston.

Shouldn't orange juice be "naturally sweetened" 'orange juice sugar' in it?

[The_pantless_hero]

i am 100% certain that my US gov teacher is smarter than you in this field, and when i asked this if this would be classified as a communist bill, he agreed. communism is the complete and total control of every aspect of life. eating candy and other such things happen to be a small aspect of life that is trying to be influenced by the government. this is communism. congrads, did you pass US gov?

Does your "US gov" teacher happen to have a degree in Phys Ed? My US gov teacher was a state senator with a degree in teaching and experience teaching government and taking classes to state competitions about government. I am of the opinion neither you nor your US gov teacher know what you are talking about.

[Bluth Corporation]

One of the proposed plans being circulated more realistically now to fight obesity

None of the government's business.

and pay for the healthcare plan

Not the government's job.