blargh! [Closed]

[DaWoad]

Has it occurred to you that they're not trying to get converts at all? They're just insulting theists for fun?

And that's the one thing that pisses me off about atheism. Probably one of the only reasons I haven't become one. If they do that regularly, they really aren't much better than religious people. Really, I've seen religious and non-religious people apply rationalism in the same amount and terms. If atheists REALLY wanted to change things (like they always say) and end religion (which according to them is horrible), wouldn't they attempt to get converts instead of insulting? If they merely participate in it for mockery, they're no better than the radicalist theists.

That being said, not all atheists are like that. It's more like a vocal minority than anything.

The edit's good. I'm glad you realize that there are small groups of idiots in EVERY cause (and big groups in some).
that said, I take issue with your statement that "they're no better than radical theists". This is a statement that gets parroted alot and it is, in the simplest terms, not remotely true. Radical theists blow themselves up, kill innocents, refuse life saving treatments for their children, etc. Average theists preach their religion, attempt to convert people and, occasionally, attempt to get bills based on their beliefs passed into law. "Radical" atheists attempt to convert people and, occasionally, attempt to get bills based on their beliefs passed into law. I very much dislike the sheer amount of self serving hypocrisy that goes into statements like " they're no better than the radicalist theists".

[MUMUNISTAN]

Oh, we're having this thread again?

If Atheists are always "Slamming and disrespecting" religion. Why is it that almost ALL the threads on religion in NSG get started by Christians, ALWAYS on the subject of Atheists 'dissing' Christianity?

You know what I think is really going on? You feel insecure about the fact Atheists criticize religion so you spin it as "bashing"

True. Christians (and other theists) think it's ok to force their religion on others but when someone puts them in their place they call it "bashing".

[Ende]

No, I just got englightened.

About? What'd you realize?

Hopefully this:

Religion in no way can be proved to be correct in its beliefs. A true kind God would not say everything that is in the Bible. However, due to human err and the fact that humans are naturally flawed, if there was a God, his message is somewhat twisted. However, there is nothing innately wrong about having faith, so long as you do not shove it on others, and taken rationally, questioned, and considered. Blind faith is one of the most dangerous forces in existence. Religion is good in smaller doses, though. Makes people happy, can do good things, and most of the teachings are pretty good. That being said, everything in moderation, and there's no way to prove religion.

[Vlack Sturm]

About? What'd you realize?

Hopefully this:

Religion in no way can be proved to be correct in its beliefs. A true kind God would not say everything that is in the Bible. However, due to human err and the fact that humans are naturally flawed, if there was a God, his message is somewhat twisted. However, there is nothing innately wrong about having faith, so long as you do not shove it on others, and taken rationally, questioned, and considered. Blind faith is one of the most dangerous forces in existence. Religion is good in smaller doses, though. Makes people happy, can do good things, and most of the teachings are pretty good. That being said, everything in moderation, and there's no way to prove religion.

That's what I was actually trying to say. My bad... some people can say it better then others.

[Lahuland]

God Is Definitely There

Didn’t really read the Bible, but sat there and just started writing a role-play/story for when I returned home. Then when I got bored with that I got up and started to walk up and down the parking lot of where we were staying, while saying that there no God as to what most non-Catholic-Christians believe in. So then I got on my knees and started to pray (not like a Our Father or a Hail Mary, but what I usually do [talk to Him like he was my dad]). I started with the “good-old-do-I-have-a-purpose-question,” then rambled on of how I couldn’t see the stars in a city, then I was like Mother Mary was the truest woman ever to inhabit the world and that she is the “Shield-bearer of Humanity.” I was looking up to the sky as I said these things, and all of a sudden I got a twitch in my neck and it sent my face and head to look to the left (where the side of the building was). And out from the corner of the building came a heart shaped cloud, illuminated by the moon. I immediately looked up at the sky and saw the clouds separate in a circular movement (as if a fist had punch the sky) to reveal so many stars. After that my vision turned blue (like the blue on Virgin Mary’s gown). And I freaking out like crazy… I told all my friends including some of my atheist friends, some of those atheists started to believe.

As your experience, Atheists are mostly open-minded. I think most Atheists respect Christianity. When an Atheist criticizes a religion, he has no interest and no hatred. So, I guess childish insults are not from Atheists. Honestly, I dislike my first religion (sorry I can't mention what it is). But, i never generalize that all religions are bad. Atheism is like number 0 (neutral). A religion can turn it more positive or more negative depending on dogma.

[Teutonic Territories]

One more thing: God shows himself to us individually. You won't recognize him if you're full of hate. You need faith.

I'm actually a quite likable person. Indeed, I know quite a few atheists and agnostics, and I wouldn't describe any of them as full of hate.

By contrast, the more devout Christians I know tend to be intensely bigoted and hateful individuals.

Your assertion doesn't seem to stand up to reality.

What I'm saying is that if you refuse to believe that God may exist, you will not recognize him. If you are open to the idea of religion, you are much more likely to see Him.

[Ende]

And that's the one thing that pisses me off about atheism. Probably one of the only reasons I haven't become one. If they do that regularly, they really aren't much better than religious people. Really, I've seen religious and non-religious people apply rationalism in the same amount and terms. If atheists REALLY wanted to change things (like they always say) and end religion (which according to them is horrible), wouldn't they attempt to get converts instead of insulting? If they merely participate in it for mockery, they're no better than the radicalist theists.

That being said, not all atheists are like that. It's more like a vocal minority than anything.

The edit's good. I'm glad you realize that there are small groups of idiots in EVERY cause (and big groups in some).
that said, I take issue with your statement that "they're no better than radical theists". This is a statement that gets parroted alot and it is, in the simplest terms, not remotely true. Radical theists blow themselves up, kill innocents, refuse life saving treatments for their children, etc. Average theists preach their religion, attempt to convert people and, occasionally, attempt to get bills based on their beliefs passed into law. "Radical" atheists attempt to convert people and, occasionally, attempt to get bills based on their beliefs passed into law. I very much dislike the sheer amount of self serving hypocrisy that goes into statements like " they're no better than the radicalist theists".

I apologize. That was a heavily generalized and incorrect statement of mine. I'll rephrase it as this.

"Radicalist atheists are no better than fundamentalist Christians in my eyes."

Fundies tend not to blow themselves or kill innocents or refuse life saving treatments, but they are highly annoying. So are radicalist atheists.

[Spetznaz Assault Teams]

About? What'd you realize?

Hopefully this:

Religion in no way can be proved to be correct in its beliefs. A true kind God would not say everything that is in the Bible. However, due to human err and the fact that humans are naturally flawed, if there was a God, his message is somewhat twisted. However, there is nothing innately wrong about having faith, so long as you do not shove it on others, and taken rationally, questioned, and considered. Blind faith is one of the most dangerous forces in existence. Religion is good in smaller doses, though. Makes people happy, can do good things, and most of the teachings are pretty good. That being said, everything in moderation, and there's no way to prove religion.

I believe a Ghandi quote is perfect in this situation

"I love your Christ, but I do not love your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ"

[The Cummunist State]

About? What'd you realize?

Hopefully this:

Religion in no way can be proved to be correct in its beliefs. A true kind God would not say everything that is in the Bible. However, due to human err and the fact that humans are naturally flawed, if there was a God, his message is somewhat twisted. However, there is nothing innately wrong about having faith, so long as you do not shove it on others, and taken rationally, questioned, and considered. Blind faith is one of the most dangerous forces in existence. Religion is good in smaller doses, though. Makes people happy, can do good things, and most of the teachings are pretty good. That being said, everything in moderation, and there's no way to prove religion.

I'm not sure why if there is a god, everyone thinks he has to be kind. That's why I liked Greek and Egyptian myths, the gods were complete dicks, and it fit the reality. And I don't think religion is good in smaller doses either, otherwise I would be religious
I guess it can do good things, but I would feel a bit better if people would get off it with believing creationism and a afterlife and such.

[Vlack Sturm]

Alright guys...

I have gotten all your points. Very well done. Now Vlack is returning to game play as of this moment. Have a nice day.

EDIT: No ill feelings?

[Farnhamia]

Hopefully this:

Religion in no way can be proved to be correct in its beliefs. A true kind God would not say everything that is in the Bible. However, due to human err and the fact that humans are naturally flawed, if there was a God, his message is somewhat twisted. However, there is nothing innately wrong about having faith, so long as you do not shove it on others, and taken rationally, questioned, and considered. Blind faith is one of the most dangerous forces in existence. Religion is good in smaller doses, though. Makes people happy, can do good things, and most of the teachings are pretty good. That being said, everything in moderation, and there's no way to prove religion.

That's what I was actually trying to say. My bad... some people can say it better then others.

I forgive you for your lack of Christian charity in the OP. Go and sin no more.

[The Cummunist State]

I'm actually a quite likable person. Indeed, I know quite a few atheists and agnostics, and I wouldn't describe any of them as full of hate.

By contrast, the more devout Christians I know tend to be intensely bigoted and hateful individuals.

Your assertion doesn't seem to stand up to reality.

What I'm saying is that if you refuse to believe that God may exist, you will not recognize him. If you are open to the idea of religion, you are much more likely to see Him.

Scientists didn't think that the earth revolved around the sun and they still recognized it. And I don't know of any Atheists that are full of hate.

[Ifreann]

sadly, gods are what make people fight and murder.

Bullshit. People choose to fight and murder.

---

Maybe the OP doesn't like the way it's going?

No, I just got englightened.

No reason to stop the thread.

[The Cummunist State]

sadly, gods are what make people fight and murder.

Bullshit. People choose to fight and murder.

---

No, I just got englightened.

No reason to stop the thread.

People choose to fight and murder, but gods and afterlifes are very helpful to their cause.

[DaWoad]

I'm actually a quite likable person. Indeed, I know quite a few atheists and agnostics, and I wouldn't describe any of them as full of hate.

By contrast, the more devout Christians I know tend to be intensely bigoted and hateful individuals.

Your assertion doesn't seem to stand up to reality.

What I'm saying is that if you refuse to believe that God may exist, you will not recognize him. If you are open to the idea of religion, you are much more likely to see Him.

true but only insofar as believing in bigfoot makes you more likely to see it or nessie her or aliens them. It works like this, everyone experiences things that they can't readily explain on occasion. lets say, for example, I've been sick and I get into a shower to try and wake myself up before heading to school. I experience a wave of bliss followed by a lack of vision that slowly returns over a couple of minutes. As a theist you're more likely to say "that was a religious experience, the hand of god touched you and warded you from disease". An atheist is much more likely to say something along the lines of "lack of oxygenated blood to the brain due to the strain from being sick in combination with the heat of the shower caused you to black out." See? the religious person is much more likely to experience god but not, necessarily, because god is real but because they are more willing to ascribe things they can't explain to god rather than to some other source. This thread provides an excellent example of that. Vlack experienced something he couldn't readily explain and, being a theist, attributes it to god. Some of the rest of us see his explanation and attribute it to the physical situation (dark night, clouds break due to wind, blinding you slightly and that explains the experience).

[Yahkima]

I'm actually a quite likable person. Indeed, I know quite a few atheists and agnostics, and I wouldn't describe any of them as full of hate.

By contrast, the more devout Christians I know tend to be intensely bigoted and hateful individuals.

Your assertion doesn't seem to stand up to reality.

What I'm saying is that if you refuse to believe that God may exist, you will not recognize him. If you are open to the idea of religion, you are much more likely to see Him.

Oh I'm open to all sorts of beliefs. I don't limit myself the way theists do by saying, "there must be x many gods, and these must be their characteristics." Or, "If there is an afterlife, it will be like this..."

Still nothing, and I don't refuse to believe anything.

Your assertions don't stand up to reality.


I think what's really going on here is a classic case of, "Seek and ye will find." That's exactly right, seek hard enough and you will find, whether its there or not. In more technical terms this is called confirmation bias.

[Ifreann]

Bullshit. People choose to fight and murder.

---

No reason to stop the thread.

People choose to fight and murder, but gods and afterlifes are very helpful to their cause.

Which has nothing to do with whether their gods exist.

[DaWoad]

The edit's good. I'm glad you realize that there are small groups of idiots in EVERY cause (and big groups in some).
that said, I take issue with your statement that "they're no better than radical theists". This is a statement that gets parroted alot and it is, in the simplest terms, not remotely true. Radical theists blow themselves up, kill innocents, refuse life saving treatments for their children, etc. Average theists preach their religion, attempt to convert people and, occasionally, attempt to get bills based on their beliefs passed into law. "Radical" atheists attempt to convert people and, occasionally, attempt to get bills based on their beliefs passed into law. I very much dislike the sheer amount of self serving hypocrisy that goes into statements like " they're no better than the radicalist theists".

I apologize. That was a heavily generalized and incorrect statement of mine. I'll rephrase it as this.

"Radicalist atheists are no better than fundamentalist Christians in my eyes."

Fundies tend not to blow themselves or kill innocents or refuse life saving treatments, but they are highly annoying. So are radicalist atheists.

works for me and I believe it to be a fairly apt comparison.

[The Cummunist State]

People choose to fight and murder, but gods and afterlifes are very helpful to their cause.

Which has nothing to do with whether their gods exist.

I didn't say it did.

[Yahkima]

People choose to fight and murder, but gods and afterlifes are very helpful to their cause.

Which has nothing to do with whether their gods exist.

Indeed.

Actually I sometimes like to think that if there is a god, this perhaps is the reason he seems to have stopped talking to us the way he used to. He realized he is a negative influence and is trying to minimize the damage.

[Ifreann]

Which has nothing to do with whether their gods exist.

I didn't say it did.

That's the topic of the thread at hand.

[The Cummunist State]

Which has nothing to do with whether their gods exist.

Indeed.

Actually I sometimes like to think that if there is a god, this perhaps is the reason he seems to have stopped talking to us the way he used to. He realized he is a negative influence and is trying to minimize the damage.

I still think if there is a god, he is evil.

[Yahkima]

Indeed.

Actually I sometimes like to think that if there is a god, this perhaps is the reason he seems to have stopped talking to us the way he used to. He realized he is a negative influence and is trying to minimize the damage.

I still think if there is a god, he is evil.

I try to give him the benefit of the doubt (excuse the pun.)

He could be incompetent too. Or something really awful but also unavoidable, like say he's an old Aztec god fueled by human sacrifice: Not his fault, it's just the way he was... um... born? But still a terrible inconvenience upon humanity.

[Norstal]

Alright guys...

I have gotten all your points. Very well done. Now Vlack is returning to game play as of this moment. Have a nice day.

EDIT: No ill feelings?

No.

I'm tired of this. You don't get to run away when your arguments, beliefs, logic, and faith gets crushed. You either admit it and leave the thread open or you continue to post.

[Yahkima]

Alright guys...

I have gotten all your points. Very well done. Now Vlack is returning to game play as of this moment. Have a nice day.

EDIT: No ill feelings?

No.

I'm tired of this. You don't get to run away when your arguments, beliefs, logic, and faith gets crushed. You either admit it and leave the thread open or you continue to post.

Eh, let him run. He knows what happened here, and everyone else can see it too.

There's no reason to rub it in his face.