The Most Hideous Betrayer

[New Sapienta]

Not to mentions the "Republic" was corrupt as hell.


Not to mention, it is undetermined whether or not Caesar would return power. So they may have killed an innocent man.

Considering the Roman people got a lot nicer than the general subhuman cruelty common to the Republic era, I'd say Caesar improved the place.

I know, the Senate was so much in the wrong it's hard for me to see how someone would support them.

[Sabara]

Considering the Roman people got a lot nicer than the general subhuman cruelty common to the Republic era, I'd say Caesar improved the place.

I know, the Senate was so much in the wrong it's hard for me to see how someone would support them.

Julius was a complete Dictator.

[Jerusalem and Damascus]

I know, the Senate was so much in the wrong it's hard for me to see how someone would support them.

Julius was a complete Dictator.

Absolutely, he was, but the people loved him for a reason, and chose him over the Senate, for a reason.

Having a jerk as a leader is better than an oligarchy of Hannibal Lecters.

[New Sapienta]

I know, the Senate was so much in the wrong it's hard for me to see how someone would support them.

Julius was a complete Benovalant Dictator.

Fixed

[Sabara]

Julius was a complete Dictator.

Absolutely, he was, but the people loved him for a reason, and chose him over the Senate, for a reason.

Having a jerk as a leader is better than an oligarchy of Hannibal Lecters.

But still, a complete takeover of the Senate is unnacceptable.

[Celritannia]

Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader

(He betrayed both the Jedi and the Emperor)

[New Sapienta]

Absolutely, he was, but the people loved him for a reason, and chose him over the Senate, for a reason.

Having a jerk as a leader is better than an oligarchy of Hannibal Lecters.

But still, a complete takeover of the Senate is unnacceptable.

You do realize the Senate was pretty much just an Oligarchy right?

[New Freedomstan]

Vidkun Quisling.

[Jerusalem and Damascus]

Julius was a complete Benovalant Dictator.

Fixed

Thinking about it, you might be closer to the truth. The man eliminated an entire fourth of debts in the Roman Imperium, introduced term limits to governors, rebuilt Carthage and Corinth...

[Astrolinium]

I know, the Senate was so much in the wrong it's hard for me to see how someone would support them.

Julius was a complete Dictator.

Hey, that's not fair.
The title was "Dictator Perpetuo".

[New Sapienta]

Fixed

Thinking about it, you might be closer to the truth. The man eliminated an entire fourth of debts in the Roman Imperium, introduced term limits to governors, rebuilt Carthage and Corinth...

I wonder what would have happened if he wasn't assassinated.

[Jerusalem and Damascus]

Thinking about it, you might be closer to the truth. The man eliminated an entire fourth of debts in the Roman Imperium, introduced term limits to governors, rebuilt Carthage and Corinth...

I wonder what would have happened if he wasn't assassinated.

Probably no massive civil wars like the ones that followed his death in the OTL?

[Natty Narwhal]

Bill Nye.

[New Sapienta]

I wonder what would have happened if he wasn't assassinated.

Probably no massive civil wars like the ones that followed his death in the OTL?

Althoguh it did lead to Octavian being in charge, and it made sureCaesar didn't give power back to the corrupt Senate.

SeemsBrutus actualy made sure the Senate didn't get power again.

[Jerusalem and Damascus]

Probably no massive civil wars like the ones that followed his death in the OTL?

Althoguh it did lead to Octavian being in charge, and it made sureCaesar didn't give power back to the corrupt Senate.

SeemsBrutus actualy made sure the Senate didn't get power again.

True enough. Considering his own attempts at power grabs during the war, I think the Republic era was just at a natural sort of end.

[New Sapienta]

Althoguh it did lead to Octavian being in charge, and it made sureCaesar didn't give power back to the corrupt Senate.

SeemsBrutus actualy made sure the Senate didn't get power again.

True enough. Considering his own attempts at power grabs during the war, I think the Republic era was just at a natural sort of end.

Indeed.

[Thatchland]

No. What I'm saying is - it cannot be a betrayal if it is part of the entire process to complete the plan. What would have been a betrayal, to Jesus and "God's plan", if Judas had not been an informant. Then a new person would have had to be persuaded to do the task for the plan to come to fruition.

An interesting version. But nobody forced him to be an informant.

Didn't say he was forced. Jesus and Judas could have had a long heart-to-heart about "God's Plan". Those that wrote the new testament weren't with Jesus and Judas 24/7. It could have gone down something like this:

• Jesus: Yo, Judas - so you know how I'm the Son of God, right?
• Judas: Damn straight, bro - we wouldn't be spreading your good word if you weren't.
• Jesus: Well, see ... how do I say this ... Dad says that in order for people to go to heaven ... I, well, I have to die. On a cross. Soon.
• Judas: Wha?!?! No way!!!
• Jesus: Yep. It's tough to wrap my head around to. But Dad's always right, ya know?
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: Ok. Well, anyway, I'm to die on a cross then be buried in a tomb. For three days. During those three days, my soul will go preach Dad's plan to the souls that have gone on before us. That way they can accept me as their savior and go to heaven.
• Judas: Wait. You mean for thousands of years people have been going to hell because you weren't born yet?
• Jesus: It's not that simple - but in summary, yes.
• Judas: WTF, dude???
• Jesus: Just hear me out. After those three days, I will be resurrected and roll away the stone to my tomb. I'll say a few words and then head up to heaven. Body and soul.
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: This is Dad's plan. Gotta go with it, you know? I'm the savior.
• Judas: You know I'll follow you to the ends of the earth. But man, this is deep shit to understand.
• Jesus: Now you know why I was in the desert for 40 days. Took me that long to get used to the idea, myself.
• Judas: So when are you going to tell the rest of the Apostles?
• Jesus: Well, see ... I can't. It would ruin the surprise. They have to live it fresh. Kind of a Stanislavski "method" thing that Dad prefers. I'm only supposed to tell you.
• Judas: ... whhhhyyyyyy?
• Jesus: Well, someone has to turn me into the priests and the Romans so that I can be crucified ...
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: ...
• Judas: ... and ... This has to do with me, how?
• Jesus: ...
• Judas: HOLY SHIT! NO WAY MAN! I'M NOT TURNING YOU IN!!! You're my bro!
• Jesus: Dad's will be done, Judas.
• Judas: Really? Can I think about this?
• Jesus: Well, yes. But I really need you as my wingman on this. You are the guy who can get this done. You've been a successful business man, our treasurer, you have the connections. All the others are fishermen and shepherds. No one is going to really listen to them. But you, you're the one whom the priests will believe.
• Judas: I guess ... but this is heavy shit. This is God's plan for salvation though, right?
• Jesus: As Dad as my witness. I truly need you to do this for me. For us. For them. For everyone's soul for eternity.
• Judas: But they are all going to hate me. They'll think I betrayed you. I'll be Numero uno on the most wanted list.
• Jesus: Earthly possessions and pride are not our way. Our true rewards awaits in heaven. I've got you covered.
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: What do you say? Can I count on you?
• Judas: (sighs) I'll do it. For you ... and for them. I've got your back, bro.
• Jesus and Judas fist-bump and head back to the rest of the Apostles

[Forsher]

An interesting version. But nobody forced him to be an informant.

Didn't say he was forced. Jesus and Judas could have had a long heart-to-heart about "God's Plan". Those that wrote the new testament weren't with Jesus and Judas 24/7. It could have gone down something like this:

• Jesus: Yo, Judas - so you know how I'm the Son of God, right?
• Judas: Damn straight, bro - we wouldn't be spreading your good word if you weren't.
• Jesus: Well, see ... how do I say this ... Dad says that in order for people to go to heaven ... I, well, I have to die. On a cross. Soon.
• Judas: Wha?!?! No way!!!
• Jesus: Yep. It's tough to wrap my head around to. But Dad's always right, ya know?
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: Ok. Well, anyway, I'm to die on a cross then be buried in a tomb. For three days. During those three days, my soul will go preach Dad's plan to the souls that have gone on before us. That way they can accept me as their savior and go to heaven.
• Judas: Wait. You mean for thousands of years people have been going to hell because you weren't born yet?
• Jesus: It's not that simple - but in summary, yes.
• Judas: WTF, dude???
• Jesus: Just hear me out. After those three days, I will be resurrected and roll away the stone to my tomb. I'll say a few words and then head up to heaven. Body and soul.
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: This is Dad's plan. Gotta go with it, you know? I'm the savior.
• Judas: You know I'll follow you to the ends of the earth. But man, this is deep shit to understand.
• Jesus: Now you know why I was in the desert for 40 days. Took me that long to get used to the idea, myself.
• Judas: So when are you going to tell the rest of the Apostles?
• Jesus: Well, see ... I can't. It would ruin the surprise. They have to live it fresh. Kind of a Stanislavski "method" thing that Dad prefers. I'm only supposed to tell you.
• Judas: ... whhhhyyyyyy?
• Jesus: Well, someone has to turn me into the priests and the Romans so that I can be crucified ...
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: ...
• Judas: ... and ... This has to do with me, how?
• Jesus: ...
• Judas: HOLY SHIT! NO WAY MAN! I'M NOT TURNING YOU IN!!! You're my bro!
• Jesus: Dad's will be done, Judas.
• Judas: Really? Can I think about this?
• Jesus: Well, yes. But I really need you as my wingman on this. You are the guy who can get this done. You've been a successful business man, our treasurer, you have the connections. All the others are fishermen and shepherds. No one is going to really listen to them. But you, you're the one whom the priests will believe.
• Judas: I guess ... but this is heavy shit. This is God's plan for salvation though, right?
• Jesus: As Dad as my witness. I truly need you to do this for me. For us. For them. For everyone's soul for eternity.
• Judas: But they are all going to hate me. They'll think I betrayed you. I'll be Numero uno on the most wanted list.
• Jesus: Earthly possessions and pride are not our way. Our true rewards awaits in heaven. I've got you covered.
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: What do you say? Can I count on you?
• Judas: (sighs) I'll do it. For you ... and for them. I've got your back, bro.
• Jesus and Judas fist-bump and head back to the rest of the Apostles

Where did you find the time to type that out of the Bible?

Seriously, I was told that's pretty much how it went.

[The Anglo-Saxon Empire]

Considering the Roman people got a lot nicer than the general subhuman cruelty common to the Republic era, I'd say Caesar improved the place.

I know, the Senate was so much in the wrong it's hard for me to see how someone would support them.

Because an incompetent corrupt senate is a better governing body than Nero or Caligula or Caracalla. Also, it was more stable, the Republic never had four coups in a single year. Hell just look at the first five emperors, one was known to have died peacefully, one may have been assassinated, two were assassinated, and the fifth killed himself to avoid assassination. Doesn't exactly sound stable. Rome wasn't even so much a monarchy as it was a third world country with every other leader getting murdered or executed after a coup.

[New Sapienta]

I know, the Senate was so much in the wrong it's hard for me to see how someone would support them.

Because an incompetent corrupt senate is a better governing body than Nero or Caligula or Caracalla. Also, it was more stable, the Republic never had four coups in a single year. Hell just look at the first five emperors, one was known to have died peacefully, one may have been assassinated, two were assassinated, and the fifth killed himself to avoid assassination. Doesn't exactly sound stable. Rome wasn't even so much a monarchy as it was a third world country with every other leader getting murdered or executed after a coup.

The string of poor emperors were a bad case number of events, but you seem to forget the 5 good emperors(http://ancienthistory.about.com/od/roma ... perors.htm)
An I would say Rome was pretty stable during the Pax Romana.(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pax_Romana)
Ans it's funny you call it a Repbulic, when it was really just an Oligarchy of the old Roman nobles, rather than something the people actually supported.
Third world country? Rome controlled almost the entirity of Europe under its Monarchy

[Nightkill the Emperor]

An interesting version. But nobody forced him to be an informant.

Didn't say he was forced. Jesus and Judas could have had a long heart-to-heart about "God's Plan". Those that wrote the new testament weren't with Jesus and Judas 24/7. It could have gone down something like this:

• Jesus: Yo, Judas - so you know how I'm the Son of God, right?
• Judas: Damn straight, bro - we wouldn't be spreading your good word if you weren't.
• Jesus: Well, see ... how do I say this ... Dad says that in order for people to go to heaven ... I, well, I have to die. On a cross. Soon.
• Judas: Wha?!?! No way!!!
• Jesus: Yep. It's tough to wrap my head around to. But Dad's always right, ya know?
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: Ok. Well, anyway, I'm to die on a cross then be buried in a tomb. For three days. During those three days, my soul will go preach Dad's plan to the souls that have gone on before us. That way they can accept me as their savior and go to heaven.
• Judas: Wait. You mean for thousands of years people have been going to hell because you weren't born yet?
• Jesus: It's not that simple - but in summary, yes.
• Judas: WTF, dude???
• Jesus: Just hear me out. After those three days, I will be resurrected and roll away the stone to my tomb. I'll say a few words and then head up to heaven. Body and soul.
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: This is Dad's plan. Gotta go with it, you know? I'm the savior.
• Judas: You know I'll follow you to the ends of the earth. But man, this is deep shit to understand.
• Jesus: Now you know why I was in the desert for 40 days. Took me that long to get used to the idea, myself.
• Judas: So when are you going to tell the rest of the Apostles?
• Jesus: Well, see ... I can't. It would ruin the surprise. They have to live it fresh. Kind of a Stanislavski "method" thing that Dad prefers. I'm only supposed to tell you.
• Judas: ... whhhhyyyyyy?
• Jesus: Well, someone has to turn me into the priests and the Romans so that I can be crucified ...
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: ...
• Judas: ... and ... This has to do with me, how?
• Jesus: ...
• Judas: HOLY SHIT! NO WAY MAN! I'M NOT TURNING YOU IN!!! You're my bro!
• Jesus: Dad's will be done, Judas.
• Judas: Really? Can I think about this?
• Jesus: Well, yes. But I really need you as my wingman on this. You are the guy who can get this done. You've been a successful business man, our treasurer, you have the connections. All the others are fishermen and shepherds. No one is going to really listen to them. But you, you're the one whom the priests will believe.
• Judas: I guess ... but this is heavy shit. This is God's plan for salvation though, right?
• Jesus: As Dad as my witness. I truly need you to do this for me. For us. For them. For everyone's soul for eternity.
• Judas: But they are all going to hate me. They'll think I betrayed you. I'll be Numero uno on the most wanted list.
• Jesus: Earthly possessions and pride are not our way. Our true rewards awaits in heaven. I've got you covered.
• Judas: ...
• Jesus: What do you say? Can I count on you?
• Judas: (sighs) I'll do it. For you ... and for them. I've got your back, bro.
• Jesus and Judas fist-bump and head back to the rest of the Apostles

This is my personal canon.

[Daistallia 2104]

No Quisling?

I am disappoint.

Seconded. Quisling is synonymous with betrayal.

Holy mackerel people, Judah betrayed the Lord our Savior.

Very interesting. When did Judas creep replace Devadatta in the story?

It's just a fad, like the "can X country vs Y country: who will win?" we had a month or two ago.

A month ago? Those havce been around since before NSG existed.

[Tagmatium]

I know, the Senate was so much in the wrong it's hard for me to see how someone would support them.

Because an incompetent corrupt senate is a better governing body than Nero or Caligula or Caracalla. Also, it was more stable, the Republic never had four coups in a single year. Hell just look at the first five emperors, one was known to have died peacefully, one may have been assassinated, two were assassinated, and the fifth killed himself to avoid assassination. Doesn't exactly sound stable. Rome wasn't even so much a monarchy as it was a third world country with every other leader getting murdered or executed after a coup.

You did get characters like Sulla fairly regularly, however.

[Bookburnia]

Seconded. Quisling is synonymous with betrayal.

Yes. I have forgot him. But there was a Finnish Quisling also. But he is not as well-known as Quisling http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Wille ... Government

[Bookburnia]

Seconded. Quisling is synonymous with betrayal.

Hungarian Quisling http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ern%C5%91_Ger%C5%91