Is Religion A Mental Illness?

[Norlund]

No, I don't believe so.

(That's all I'm going to type. And this. And that. Ffffuuuuu-)

Edit: Hells yeah, page 36.

[Jerusalem and Damascus]

Now I think you're just making excuses, and did the exact same thing with the Soviet purges.

And your excuse for Yahweh killing 32.9 billion people iiiissss?

...Did God just start blowing up planets at some point in history and the Bible just didn't mention it?

[Eastern Afrika]

We worshipped deities before we were even Homo Sapiens, so how is religion a mental illnes then

I wouldn't say that humans were worshipping explicit deities before becoming Homo sapiens sapiens. I'd agree with animism, but generally it seems more obvious "deities" come from urbanization and wouldn't form with a hunter-gatherer society too well.

Yes I meant spirits

[The Cummunist State]

And your excuse for Yahweh killing 32.9 billion people iiiissss?

Where the hell did you get 32.9 billion?

A rough estimation. you have to take into account the flood and such things. Hell, with how stupid Yahweh is, he probably killed a few thousand Adams before he found the right damn place to put him in the universe.

[Norlund]

And your excuse for Yahweh killing 32.9 billion people iiiissss?

...Did God just start blowing up planets at some point in history and the Bible just didn't mention it?

"It was as if a million voices cried out and were suddenly silenced."
- Obi-Wan commenting on God's Death Star

[Evraim]

Where the hell did you get 32.9 billion?

A rough estimation. you have to take into account the flood and such things. Hell, with how stupid Yahweh is, he probably killed a few thousand Adams before he found the right damn place to put him in the universe.

I would certainly call this a rough estimation. A very, very "rough" estimation.

...Did God just start blowing up planets at some point in history and the Bible just didn't mention it?

"It was as if a million voices cried out and were suddenly silenced."
- Obi-Wan commenting on God's Death Star

[NERVUN]

Where the hell did you get 32.9 billion?

A rough estimation. you have to take into account the flood and such things. Hell, with how stupid Yahweh is, he probably killed a few thousand Adams before he found the right damn place to put him in the universe.

A very silly one.

There's no way we've gotten anywhere near 32 billion in terms of the whole of humanity since the start (For a rough definition of start) to now.

Hell, IIRC, there's more people alive now than have ever died.

[Norlund]

Where the hell did you get 32.9 billion?

A rough estimation. you have to take into account the flood and such things. Hell, with how stupid Yahweh is, he probably killed a few thousand Adams before he found the right damn place to put him in the universe.

>Rough Estimation
>About a third of all people who have ever lived, ever

I think you've stopped presenting a solid argument.

[Jerusalem and Damascus]

Where the hell did you get 32.9 billion?

A rough estimation. you have to take into account the flood and such things. Hell, with how stupid Yahweh is, he probably killed a few thousand Adams before he found the right damn place to put him in the universe.

Okay, the Adam thing is just flamebaiting, and there's absolutely no way that the Earth's population before the Deluge (which, again, is allegorical though it probably does refer to historical flooding in the Levant that we have evidence of) was nearly 5 times what it is today.

[Ende]

A rough estimation. you have to take into account the flood and such things. Hell, with how stupid Yahweh is, he probably killed a few thousand Adams before he found the right damn place to put him in the universe.

>Rough Estimation
>About a third of all people who have ever lived, ever

I think you've stopped presenting a solid argument.

He stopped presenting solid arguments a while ago.

[The Cummunist State]

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com ... bible.html
This is my source. I'll admit I was a bit wrong, but then again, half of you probably beleive the earth is 6000 years old.

[Jerusalem and Damascus]

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2010/04/drunk-with-blood-gods-killings-in-bible.html
This is my source.

It seems to pull a lot of numbers out of its rear.

EDIT: And no, most of us actually don't. That's a fairly small minority.

[The Cummunist State]

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2010/04/drunk-with-blood-gods-killings-in-bible.html
This is my source.

It seems to pull a lot of numbers out of its rear.

Possibly. How do you account for the other numbers? Besides, I thought we agreed a page ago to stop this? The no moral high ground thing

[Norlund]

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2010/04/drunk-with-blood-gods-killings-in-bible.html
This is my source.

The total there is less than the current population of Canada, which is also 0.38%(ish) of what you cited.

Argaflarga, stop bringing numbers into religious debates.

[Evraim]

It seems to pull a lot of numbers out of its rear.

Possibly. How do you account for the other numbers? Besides, I thought we agreed a page ago to stop this? The no moral high ground thing

We did, but the claims contained in the source are absurd.

[The Cummunist State]

Possibly. How do you account for the other numbers? Besides, I thought we agreed a page ago to stop this? The no moral high ground thing

We did, but the claims contained in the source are absurd.

Okay. I admit I didn't check it completely. You done?

[Jerusalem and Damascus]

It seems to pull a lot of numbers out of its rear.

Possibly. How do you account for the other numbers? Besides, I thought we agreed a page ago to stop this? The no moral high ground thing

The numbers which are actually sourced in the Bible I'll accept, but the ones that are just estimated (which are a lot of them, like the burning people for complaining about food one), I find a bit intellectually dishonest on the part of the blog.

And it's not really about moral high ground. I'm very much certain you're a perfectly good person and whether or not you have faith has no effect on that.

[Ende]

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2010/04/drunk-with-blood-gods-killings-in-bible.html
This is my source. I'll admit I was a bit wrong, but then again, half of you probably beleive the earth is 6000 years old.

Actually, no. The actual creationists are a minority in religion. I would know, as I've been involved in the Church for most of my life. Also, ad hominem.

[The Cummunist State]

Possibly. How do you account for the other numbers? Besides, I thought we agreed a page ago to stop this? The no moral high ground thing

The numbers which are actually sourced in the Bible I'll accept, but the ones that are just estimated (which are a lot of them, like the burning people for complaining about food one), I find a bit intellectually dishonest on the part of the blog.

And it's not really about moral high ground. I'm very much certain you're a perfectly good person and whether or not you have faith has no effect on that.

Thank you.

[Evraim]

We did, but the claims contained in the source are absurd.

Okay. I admit I didn't check it completely. You done?

Possibly.

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2010/04/drunk-with-blood-gods-killings-in-bible.html
This is my source. I'll admit I was a bit wrong, but then again, half of you probably beleive the earth is 6000 years old.

Actually, no. The actual creationists are a minority in religion. I would know, as I've been involved in the Church for most of my life. Also, ad hominem.

Are they? Well, that gives me a little more faith in humanity. Would you happen to have a source?

[The Cummunist State]

http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2010/04/drunk-with-blood-gods-killings-in-bible.html
This is my source. I'll admit I was a bit wrong, but then again, half of you probably beleive the earth is 6000 years old.

Actually, no. The actual creationists are a minority in religion. I would know, as I've been involved in the Church for most of my life. Also, ad hominem.

40 percent of Americans still believe that humans were created by God within the last 10,000 years. It's not a underwhelming minority.

[Nornalhorst]

Women marry their rapist? Haven't seen that as for some of the stranger laws in the old testament Jesus does explain some of them like the food laws and when questioned about them he says God actually cares more about what you say and do then what you eat, or the punishment for working on the sabbath day he explains that the sabbath day is a day to honor God, killing someone for taking the time out to help the sick and injured is just simply evil, and Paul explains that circumscion isn't required for gentile (non-jewish) followers of Christ. Anyway I know its near impossible to never break any laws since we are fallible mortals, that's why God offers to forgive us of our sins that doesn't mean a free ticket to do whatever we like (God isn't stupid he knows the difference between true repentence and someone pretending to repent so they can do sin all over again), he does want us to try our best to uphold his laws its not unreasonable to want people to tell the truth, and to respect and love their neighbor. As for killing everyone where does Jesus ever advocate killing sinners or unbelievers or Jewish persons? If you recall in the bible Jesus was the type of man who would actually go out and talk to sinners when no one else would and showed love and respect not anger and aggression in fact he angered many of the religious people doing so, they thought it was wrong to go out and talk to tax collectors, save people from being stoned, talk to prostitutes and tell them God's word. Also God doesn't exist outside of time and space you got it backwards he exists everywhere in every time its the definition of being omnipresent he is simultaneously the beginning and the end. Hell is infinite because your soul is immortal he can't allow you into heaven if you don't accept his rule or a sinner so you are taken to the dumping ground which is hell, the very word gehenna refers to an ancient dumping ground. Hell is a place of eternal torment as it is a place of eternal seperation from God whenever the Bible describes hell it is described as a place of eternal torment, the place of outer darkness, and seperation in this place since you have abandoned God, God has abandoned you forever. Also your actions have far greater consequences then you can imagine to you a murderer is a man who has decided to kill another man to God a murderer has not only killed someone but has destroyed everything that person could have done, any family he or she could have had, and the influences he/she could have had on this world. A rapist or any other sinner not only effects his or her victim but can indirectly effect the world forever.

WHoaaaaaa, wall of text and preaching buddy, sorry if I don't read all of it. I'll address some of the points you made as I read sideways through it.

As for Jesus never ordering killing others, here's one "So I will cast her on a bed of suffering, and I will make those who commit adultery with her suffer intensely, unless they repent of her ways. I will strike her children dead. Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds. (Revelation 2:22-23)

And if you listened to any of your ill-minded folk in the church, he is either outside of space and time or is everywhere in every time. In the first case, he does not exist. In the second case, We should be able to test and find him. We can't. Because he isn't.

Okay, God doesn't expect us to always live up to his rules as long as we repent. Yeah, well, I think the holy spirit is a whore. <<< unforgivable sin. Next.

Also, to my actions being able to effect the world forever and stuff, yeah. If I murder someone, that may or may not have stopped great evil or great good. How is making a joke about Christianity---nay, how is murdering someone worthy of eternal punishment? It isn't. Nothing is worth eternal punishment. If you think something is and think you are in any way moral, you are completely mistaken.

Revelation 2:22-23 if you read the scriptures around it you will see what is happening.

I know your works, love, service, faith,and your patience; and as for your works, the last are more than the first. Nevertheless I have a few things against you, because you allow that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess, to teach and seduce My servants to commit sexual immorality and eat things sacrificed to idols. And I gave her time to repent of her sexual immorality, and she did not repent. Indeed I will cast her into a sickbed, and those who commit adultery with her into great tribulation, unless they repent of their deeds. I will kill her children with death, and all the churches shall know that I am He who searches the minds and hearts. And I will give to each one of you according to your works. Now to you I say, and to the rest in Thyatira, as many as do not have this doctrine, who have not known the depths of Satan, as they say, I will put on you no other burden. But hold fast what you have till I come.

If you notice no one is being told to kill anyone, instead what it happening is a woman in the Church of Thyatira named Jezebel is teaching the church members to sin and leading them astray. What is being said here is that Jezebel and her followers were given time to repent but they won't so they will be punished and that God desires for the people of Thyatira to repent of their sins and to stop following the false teachings of Jezebel.

Being outside of space and time means for all practical purposes you don't exist this is contrary to what the Bible teaches which is that God exists everywhere. As for not being able to see God, considering that he exists everywhere he is effectively invisible what are you going to be looking for? He's everywhere, within you, outside of you,everywhere, he could be the very "fabric" of the universe. It's not like you are going to fly into space and see a giant face that will look at you and say, "Oh hai thar, I iz watching you, kthxbai". Also its highly likely he exists in other spatial dimensions then our conventional 3 dimensions so perceiving him would be impossible since he is not made up of ordinary matter (if he was he probably wouldn't possess his godly qualties he has in the bible). Then there is the problem that we do not know everything or really anything for that matter so its not like we can say for fact that God doesn't exist. As for listening to other church members you do realize there are over 30,000 different denominations of Christianity and there are tons of other religions out there as well who have a different view on God.

Yes your actions do have far reaching consequences then you would like to imagine. As for why would God send someone to hell, hell is an eternity without God if you disobey his laws and mock him obviously you do not want to live with him forever so he allows those who reject him an eternity without him.

[Jerusalem and Damascus]

The numbers which are actually sourced in the Bible I'll accept, but the ones that are just estimated (which are a lot of them, like the burning people for complaining about food one), I find a bit intellectually dishonest on the part of the blog.

And it's not really about moral high ground. I'm very much certain you're a perfectly good person and whether or not you have faith has no effect on that.

Thank you.

It's not a problem. I've found as debates go on, the brain seems to try and force the debaters to stop by shutting down parts of itself to force us to try and find the most expedient way of ending it.

Though, oddly enough, I've found the longer the debates go on NSG, the more amicably they end.

[The Cummunist State]

WHoaaaaaa, wall of text and preaching buddy, sorry if I don't read all of it. I'll address some of the points you made as I read sideways through it.

As for Jesus never ordering killing others, here's one "So I will cast her on a bed of suffering, and I will make those who commit adultery with her suffer intensely, unless they repent of her ways. I will strike her children dead. Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds. (Revelation 2:22-23)

And if you listened to any of your ill-minded folk in the church, he is either outside of space and time or is everywhere in every time. In the first case, he does not exist. In the second case, We should be able to test and find him. We can't. Because he isn't.

Okay, God doesn't expect us to always live up to his rules as long as we repent. Yeah, well, I think the holy spirit is a whore. <<< unforgivable sin. Next.

Also, to my actions being able to effect the world forever and stuff, yeah. If I murder someone, that may or may not have stopped great evil or great good. How is making a joke about Christianity---nay, how is murdering someone worthy of eternal punishment? It isn't. Nothing is worth eternal punishment. If you think something is and think you are in any way moral, you are completely mistaken.

Revelation 2:22-23 if you read the scriptures around it you will see what is happening.

I know your works, love, service, faith,and your patience; and as for your works, the last are more than the first. Nevertheless I have a few things against you, because you allow that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess, to teach and seduce My servants to commit sexual immorality and eat things sacrificed to idols. And I gave her time to repent of her sexual immorality, and she did not repent. Indeed I will cast her into a sickbed, and those who commit adultery with her into great tribulation, unless they repent of their deeds. I will kill her children with death, and all the churches shall know that I am He who searches the minds and hearts. And I will give to each one of you according to your works. Now to you I say, and to the rest in Thyatira, as many as do not have this doctrine, who have not known the depths of Satan, as they say, I will put on you no other burden. But hold fast what you have till I come.

If you notice no one is being told to kill anyone, instead what it happening is a woman in the Church of Thyatira named Jezebel is teaching the church members to sin and leading them astray. What is being said here is that Jezebel and her followers were given time to repent but they won't so they will be punished and that God desires for the people of Thyatira to repent of their sins and to stop following the false teachings of Jezebel.

Being outside of space and time means for all practical purposes you don't exist this is contrary to what the Bible teaches which is that God exists everywhere. As for not being able to see God, considering that he exists everywhere he is effectively invisible what are you going to be looking for? He's everywhere, within you, outside of you,everywhere, he could be the very "fabric" of the universe. It's not like you are going to fly into space and see a giant face that will look at you and say, "Oh hai thar, I iz watching you, kthxbai". Also its highly likely he exists in other spatial dimensions then our conventional 3 dimensions so perceiving him would be impossible since he is not made up of ordinary matter (if he was he probably wouldn't possess his godly qualties he has in the bible). Then there is the problem that we do not know everything or really anything for that matter so its not like we can say for fact that God doesn't exist. As for listening to other church members you do realize there are over 30,000 different denominations of Christianity and there are tons of other religions out there as well who have a different view on God.

Yes your actions do have far reaching consequences then you would like to imagine. As for why would God send someone to hell, hell is an eternity without God if you disobey his laws and mock him obviously you do not want to live with him forever so he allows those who reject him an eternity without him.

If you keep posting walls of text that are just preaching and making no solid points outside of "god did it" I'm going to stop responding. I have no obligation to continue. Also, God is not within my body. I checked. What the bible teaches is irrelevant unless it is proved true. And the Wind is invisible, we can still test it. Atoms are invisible to the naked eye, we still play around with them, a god should be the same.

[The Cummunist State]

Thank you.

It's not a problem. I've found as debates go on, the brain seems to try and force the debaters to stop by shutting down parts of itself to force us to try and find the most expedient way of ending it.

Though, oddly enough, I've found the longer the debates go on NSG, the more amicably they end.

Yeah, you can only debate for so long before you kinda just black out everything.