Income Taxes: Are They Theft?

[Sibirsky]

What? Deflation adds to anyone with a savings account.

You do know what deflation is, correct?

Sorry, read wikipedia wrong, was in a hurry, the correct expression was "punishes anyone who owes any money".

Fair enough. It does do that. Deflation rewards savers, punishes borrowers. Inflation does the opposite.

[Jinos]

The contract happened at 18. Did you even read what I wrote?

If you don't have full citizenship at birth, then that means the contract is not fully enumerated.

There's still the matter of where I signed? Living to age 18 is not a valid entry condition for a contract since there is still no consent to contract given.

Why would you "Sign" anything?

Did you have to go to the DMV to "get your full citizenship"? You don't even need to register to vote or anything. It just happens, one day you're 18, you don't even need to blow the candles out on a damn cake.

It's not about giving consent. Consent is assumed until otherwise made apparent. If you DON'T want to give consent, go to another country, become a citizen of that country, and renounce citizenship of this country.

[Vurtunia]

It's not like Obama wants condoms to be passed out in churches.

Shame, really.

I recomend against starting a religious argument on this thread. Mods 'ill be on it faster then a dog on a steak.

[Yootwopia]

That everywhere has a bullshit currency that serves its purpose and is replaced by something 'better' but not?

Decrying fiat currencies as being without value by design is an underanalysis of currency as a Thing.

I didn't say "without" value by design. I said "declining" value. Which is mostly correct.

Still not really tackling the core issue here, which is that you've thought a bit about this but not very much.

[Sibirsky]

Her payments are adjusted for inflation.

Assuming it's CPI, the baboushka shouldn't have a declining standard of living?

But she will. Because CPI is lower than actual inflation.

[Sibirsky]

The fuck are you on?

Don't call me a comrade either.

Comrade just means brother-in-arms, co-believer. Chillax.

Not to me, it doesn't. To me it's a dirty, disgusting word.

And I know what it means.

[Sibirsky]

When was fucking war declared?

Oh, you missed the part that only congress can declare war?

Are you right about anything?

AUMF stands for Authorization for Use of Military Force. It passed both houses. Congress declared war.

Edit: typo

No, they did not.

[Wikkiwallana]

How? How will you avoid defaults if you do not increase the money supply?

Private or public? Private: if all debts are profitable, an increase in M would correspond to an increase in Y, not P, so prices would remain stable. Public: by not running deficits.

How do you avoid defaults in a gold standard?

Pray or strike it rich on a good vein.

[Yootwopia]

Assuming it's CPI, the baboushka shouldn't have a declining standard of living?

But she will. Because CPI is lower than actual inflation.

Right in your 1990 system which hails from Bizarro World, where people never change what they buy according to market pressures, yeah?

[Wikkiwallana]

AUMF stands for Authorization for Use of Military Force. It passed both houses. Congress declared war.

Edit: typo

No, they did not.

I'm sorry, are you arguing that a bill called Authorization for Use of Military Force was not a declaration of war? Because that's what it sounds like, and I just want to make sure before I start laughing like a hyena.

[Yootwopia]

Private or public? Private: if all debts are profitable, an increase in M would correspond to an increase in Y, not P, so prices would remain stable. Public: by not running deficits.

How do you avoid defaults in a gold standard?

Pray or strike it rich on a good vein.

Or drop a nuke on the Kuwaiti holdings, natch.

[Sibirsky]

Apparently you also have no idea what the Bill of Rights is.

Oh, you're talking about the reproductive aid thing?

Yeah, that's not really religious persecution, it's business regulation. It's not like Obama wants condoms to be passed out in churches.

Um, what? I'm talking about indefinite detention and the right to assassinate citizens without giving them any chance to defend themselves in a court of law.

You know, shit that could affect everyone.

[Sibirsky]

Her payments are adjusted for inflation.

If her payments are adjusted for inflation, the how is she getting less money?

How payments are adjusted for inflation at less than the rate of inflation.

[Patriqvinia]

There's still the matter of where I signed? Living to age 18 is not a valid entry condition for a contract since there is still no consent to contract given.

Why would you "Sign" anything?

Did you have to go to the DMV to "get your full citizenship"? You don't even need to register to vote or anything. It just happens, one day you're 18, you don't even need to blow the candles out on a damn cake.

It's not about giving consent. Consent is assumed until otherwise made apparent. If you DON'T want to give consent, go to another country, become a citizen of that country, and renounce citizenship of this country.

Oh okay. When you're 57, I will have a pool put into your backyard; you will have to pay the bill, but you don't have to use the pool; if you don't like it, you can move.

[Hydesland]

Discuss.

[Death Metal]

Oh, you're talking about the reproductive aid thing?

Yeah, that's not really religious persecution, it's business regulation. It's not like Obama wants condoms to be passed out in churches.

Can you find a full text of the law that proves otherwise?

Until then, PolitiFact has this:

What the rule says

The newly final rule stems from the Affordable Care Act of 2010 — what Republican presidential candidates call "Obamacare." It affects the health plans employers offer their employees. Among its requirements is that most plans include birth control coverage without out-of-pocket costs. But it’s part of a broader push to provide preventive care without extra fees.

That's it. It's a health plan law.

Hell, if you want to play the imposing values card, a religious employer refusing to provide these to an employee on religious grounds is imposing values on the employee. How is that okay, but this isn't?

[Yootwopia]

http://hypnotoad.comoj.com/tax.png

Discuss.

Tithes are voluntary.

[Wikkiwallana]

(Image)

Discuss.

Well played, Mr. Venn.

[Revolutopia]

Can you find a full text of the law that proves otherwise?

Until then, PolitiFact has this:

What the rule says

The newly final rule stems from the Affordable Care Act of 2010 — what Republican presidential candidates call "Obamacare." It affects the health plans employers offer their employees. Among its requirements is that most plans include birth control coverage without out-of-pocket costs. But it’s part of a broader push to provide preventive care without extra fees.

That's it. It's a health plan law.

Hell, if you want to play the imposing values card, a religious employer refusing to provide these to an employee on religious grounds is imposing values on the employee. How is that okay, but this isn't?

Slappy face dealt with the randomly out of the blue reference to the Birth Control issue, which was obviously not what Sibs was talking about.

[Wikkiwallana]

http://hypnotoad.comoj.com/tax.png

Discuss.

Tithes are voluntary.

He said desire, not will.

[United Dependencies]

You've got a series of loosely connected premises that in no way justify the previous circular argument. Nevermind the fact that "well-ordered" societies have existed in the past without taxes:

Looesely connected? Hardly

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icelandic_Commonwealth

So instead of leaders being elected, you would have the leader be the person who can buy that position. This is somehow better than the current system? Furthermore this system did no prevent the buyout of all defense and subsequent creation of a state monopoly on it.

http://badquaker.com/archives/554

I'm sorry but Rothbard is an economist not a historian. I hardly trust anything he has to say on the matter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_anarchist_communities

Ah yes the anarchist commune. They are small and filled with like minded individuals. Hardly in need of any real government.

[Hydesland]

http://hypnotoad.comoj.com/tax.png

Discuss.

Tithes are voluntary.

Even in ye olden times?

[Augarundus]

Property is theft.

Even Marx thought Proudhon was stupid here.

[Yootwopia]

Tithes are voluntary.

Even in ye olden times?

Nope. In proper countries nowadays, though, yes they are.

[Death Metal]

Um, what? I'm talking about indefinite detention and the right to assassinate citizens without giving them any chance to defend themselves in a court of law.

You know, shit that could affect everyone.

Again, are allowed by the Constitution.

Article I, Section 9, Clause 2:

The Privilege of the Writ of Habeas Corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in Cases of Rebellion or Invasion the public Safety may require it.

US Citizens planning terrorist attacks on the US can be considered rebellion and a danger to public safety.


Also has precedence, see Lincoln.

EDIT- Wrong tags. Also, I condemn Paul for doing this not because of the Constitutionality, but because of the hypocrisy of doing this then saying he wouldn't as part of a bid for office.