Should books every be censored/banned?

[Mavorpen]

Why ban them? How else is the ideological gap to be closed? How else is the killing to be stopped? Don't fool yourself that you can bomb your way out of it, you are going to have to talk to these people in the end. How do you intend to do that if you don't know anything about them?

You don't talk to terrorists. You destroy them. And their sympathizers (maybe not killing but at least they should be kept away from the public)

And if the sympathizers make up half the country?

[Kemaliste]

You don't talk to terrorists. You destroy them. And their sympathizers (maybe not killing but at least they should be kept away from the public)

And if the sympathizers make up half the country?

State of emergency (or martial law) will be declared in the regions where there is a serious terrorism potential. If the problem is really much bigger, deportation law will be applied.

[Mavorpen]

And if the sympathizers make up half the country?

State of emergency (or martial law) will be declared in the regions where there is a serious terrorism potential. If the problem is really much bigger, deportation law will be applied.

I can honestly say this is absurd as hell.

[Kemaliste]

State of emergency (or martial law) will be declared in the regions where there is a serious terrorism potential. If the problem is really much bigger, deportation law will be applied.

I can honestly say this is absurd as hell.

I know. But unfortunately we don't live in a pinky sweetie peaceful world and you need to be merciless to defend your national entity.

[Mavorpen]

I can honestly say this is absurd as hell.

I know. But unfortunately we don't live in a pinky sweetie peaceful world and you need to be merciless to defend your national entity.

No it isn't. Even if it was, "national entity" is absurd as well.

[Ryadn]

I said 'yes', but I really meant 'all minors shouldn't have unrestricted access to all books'. I detest the idea of books with language changed, like Huck Finn; I'd rather just not give them the book at all. I let my fifth graders read Ender's Game knowing there were one or two questionable words/scenes, and actually thought about blacking out a place where they said 'bitch'. Then my brain slapped me across the face and asked if I was fucking crazy. And I WAS.

[The Corparation]

I said 'yes', but I really meant 'all minors shouldn't have unrestricted access to all books'. I detest the idea of books with language changed, like Huck Finn; I'd rather just not give them the book at all. I let my fifth graders read Ender's Game knowing there were one or two questionable words/scenes, and actually thought about blacking out a place where they said 'bitch'. Then my brain slapped me across the face and asked if I was fucking crazy. And I WAS.

I read Ender' s Game in Fifth grade. Me reading a swear word or tow in it was hardly detrimental to my health. At that age a Kid is going to ignore the parts they don't get opr more probably not be bothered to read the book.

[Mike the Progressive]

Ever. Ever. Ever...*sighs*

[Cill Charthaigh]

I said 'yes', but I really meant 'all minors shouldn't have unrestricted access to all books'. I detest the idea of books with language changed, like Huck Finn; I'd rather just not give them the book at all. I let my fifth graders read Ender's Game knowing there were one or two questionable words/scenes, and actually thought about blacking out a place where they said 'bitch'. Then my brain slapped me across the face and asked if I was fucking crazy. And I WAS.

Why not? I read Huck Finn when I was in 4th grade (uncensored) and I haven't had any urges to hang any of my black friends.

[The Corparation]

I said 'yes', but I really meant 'all minors shouldn't have unrestricted access to all books'. I detest the idea of books with language changed, like Huck Finn; I'd rather just not give them the book at all. I let my fifth graders read Ender's Game knowing there were one or two questionable words/scenes, and actually thought about blacking out a place where they said 'bitch'. Then my brain slapped me across the face and asked if I was fucking crazy. And I WAS.

Why not? I read Huck Finn when I was in 4th grade (uncensored) and I haven't had any urges to hang any of my black friends.

Odd, I read it in third grade and I hung all my black friends, I geuss that extra year really opens your eyes on the issue of race.

[Saint Abbra]

Media doesn't harm anyone, it facilitates (at best) the movement of ideas, knowledge, free thinking and so on, or (at worst) serves to stave off boredom. While I can object to the value of some media, or while I can think of some works as less qualified for "the spotlight" than others, removing media from circulation, editing media or attempts at regulate new media entering the scene is out of the question. One could, for example, write a book containing specific instructions on how to make a bomb, add a map of parliament, and where to best place such bomb, and in my opinion that should not be illegal. I would believe such an author will have a hard time to find a publisher, and I would expect that the police would at least keep an eye out in case anyone who bought the book should try and follow the instructions (Since that would be harmful and that's illegal). Writing the book, publishing the book, selling the book, buying the book, possessing the book or writing the book - all should be legal. Acting on such instructions would be illegal.
One limit would be doing something illegal in order to produce the media. If, in my example, the author had stolen the map of parliament, then that particular page could be required to be removed or replaced with his own work, or in agreement with the owner, or the like. This would need the clausal that if public good outweighs the illegal act it would be legal. Killing or maiming someone is not for public good, while exposing classified military secrets would certainly be.

[Nanatsu no Tsuki]

Even if it's defamation. If the person or people defamed have a problem, they can sue the author and it's their personal problem. But I don't see a reason to ban the book because of libel.

You don't see a problem with someone else deliberately spreading lies about their character? In that case, Obama told me that he is going to pull another Watergate. *nod*

Not at all. The only problem one would have is the imbeciles who believe such a rumor. But there's nothing one can do about imbeciles, is there?

[The Rich Port]

Ah, yes, SUBTLE censorship.

It's still there, but NOBODY KNOWS ABOUT IT.

Yeah, it really annoyed me when I started reading Mein Kampf, to have this "Now don't go and form a genocidal national socialist government" preface treating me like a fucking child.

... Was that an attempt at sarcasm?

What the hell does it have to do with my post?

[Farnhamia]

Yeah, it really annoyed me when I started reading Mein Kampf, to have this "Now don't go and form a genocidal national socialist government" preface treating me like a fucking child.

... Was that an attempt at sarcasm?

What the hell does it have to do with my post?

It's not always about you or your post, you know.

[The Rich Port]

... Was that an attempt at sarcasm?

What the hell does it have to do with my post?

It's not always about you or your post, you know.

Well, I assume it has to do with me. He DID quote me, for a reason I can't understand.

The preface he's talking about (I have my own big black copy of Mein Kampf) talks about how the book is a piece of history, and should not be censored in order to serve as a warning and a window into the mind of hate, prejudice, and political manipulation, as mastered by Hitler and his cabal.

Doesn't sound like kid stuff to me.

If he was trying to be sarcastic, he failed. Miserably.

[Xsyne]

I said 'yes', but I really meant 'all minors shouldn't have unrestricted access to all books'. I detest the idea of books with language changed, like Huck Finn; I'd rather just not give them the book at all. I let my fifth graders read Ender's Game knowing there were one or two questionable words/scenes, and actually thought about blacking out a place where they said 'bitch'. Then my brain slapped me across the face and asked if I was fucking crazy. And I WAS.

I'd be more concerned about the place where Card refers to prepubescent naked boys as "nubile".

(Pretty sure that's the word he uses.)

[Lost Earth]

I personally feel that media, but especially literature shoulod never be banned, ecept for one reason . . . that that literature divulges information which would put the national secutiry of meany persons in danger. For example, a book published giving out details of a nation's missile codes, weaknesses to terrorists, and personal information on members of the military as well as ways to assasinate them, could be potentially banned to protect the country.

[Awesomeland]

How to Synthesize Smallpox in Your Kitchen and Build Nuclear Bombs with Basic Hardware Materials: The Book

If you really think you can do that just because you saw it in a book, I'm pretty sure natural selection will quickly act to remove your kind of defective thinking from the gene pool, probably after you poison and then fatally irradiate yourself.

[The Rich Port]

I personally feel that media, but especially literature shoulod never be banned, ecept for one reason . . . that that literature divulges information which would put the national secutiry of meany persons in danger. For example, a book published giving out details of a nation's missile codes, weaknesses to terrorists, and personal information on members of the military as well as ways to assasinate them, could be potentially banned to protect the country. /ZOMFG WIKIELAKS IS EBUL BLARGAHASLDKFJASL;DKFH

Fixed your post.

You're assuming that this has happened before AND that it was seen as legal.

It hasn't, so your single objection is... Pointless.

[Farnhamia]

I said 'yes', but I really meant 'all minors shouldn't have unrestricted access to all books'. I detest the idea of books with language changed, like Huck Finn; I'd rather just not give them the book at all. I let my fifth graders read Ender's Game knowing there were one or two questionable words/scenes, and actually thought about blacking out a place where they said 'bitch'. Then my brain slapped me across the face and asked if I was fucking crazy. And I WAS.

I'd be more concerned about the place where Card refers to prepubescent naked boys as "nubile".

(Pretty sure that's the word he uses.)

Are you sure it's not "n00bile"?

[Saint Abbra]

I personally feel that media, but especially literature shoulod never be banned, ecept for one reason . . . that that literature divulges information which would put the national secutiry of meany persons in danger. For example, a book published giving out details of a nation's missile codes, weaknesses to terrorists, and personal information on members of the military as well as ways to assasinate them, could be potentially banned to protect the country.

Why is the military needing protection from free speech, when none else are needing this protection? Military secrets needs to be exposed. They're secret for a reason: "Oh, this would hurt our ability to dominate the country and control the media, so let's classify it and never have to deal with this problem again!" Military secrets, government secrets and big corporation secrets should be the first to be fully exposed to the public. Stuff such as missile launch codes can be changed when necessary or the military could just install a better firewall so people can't do anything with the launch codes.

[The Corparation]

How to Synthesize Smallpox in Your Kitchen and Build Nuclear Bombs with Basic Hardware Materials: The Book

If you really think you can do that just because you saw it in a book, I'm pretty sure natural selection will quickly act to remove your kind of defective thinking from the gene pool, probably after you poison and then fatally irradiate yourself.

While smallpox is out of the average mans reach, the average dumbass could conceivably construct a crude dirty bomb if they got enough old smoke detectors and shit.

[Geniasis]

I personally feel that media, but especially literature shoulod never be banned, ecept for one reason . . . that that literature divulges information which would put the national secutiry of meany persons in danger. For example, a book published giving out details of a nation's missile codes, weaknesses to terrorists, and personal information on members of the military as well as ways to assasinate them, could be potentially banned to protect the country.

Why is the military needing protection from free speech, when none else are needing this protection? Military secrets needs to be exposed. They're secret for a reason: "Oh, this would hurt our ability to dominate the country and control the media, so let's classify it and never have to deal with this problem again!" Military secrets, government secrets and big corporation secrets should be the first to be fully exposed to the public. Stuff such as missile launch codes can be changed when necessary or the military could just install a better firewall so people can't do anything with the launch codes.

I dunno. I'm OK with censoring information like, "the military is going to be launching a big operation at <x>, deploying the troops specifically at <location 1, 2, 3> in the hopes of catching <enemy Z> unaware at their blindspot of <insert information>" or "the military is hoping to deploy it's new tank, which is powerful but has a gaping weakness behind the left tread, where a well-placed shot could blow up the whole thing". I don't think that's really necessary, at least not when immediately relevant.

[Saint Abbra]

I dunno. I'm OK with censoring information like, "the military is going to be launching a big operation at <x>, deploying the troops specifically at <location 1, 2, 3> in the hopes of catching <enemy Z> unaware at their blindspot of <insert information>" or "the military is hoping to deploy it's new tank, which is powerful but has a gaping weakness behind the left tread, where a well-placed shot could blow up the whole thing". I don't think that's really necessary, at least not when immediately relevant.

Well, for me it shouldn't be censored under any circumstances. In situations such as you describe, the military of course doesn't need to announce its' intention before doing so, but in case anyone leaked it or found out it should never, ever be censored. In case of diplomatic, military, security or agency operations, when they're completed, should be made accessible by the public as quickly as possible, for example after a week or so. Again, if anyone decides to go public with classified information, it should have no repercussions. If, for example, a journalist had known of the operation against Osama bin Laden, the location and day, and had chosen to publish that knowledge, he should be free to do so.

[Celephais]

... Was that an attempt at sarcasm?

What the hell does it have to do with my post?

I was more replying to the previous post about prefaces in "dodgy" books… I hate them, they're in a way worse than censorship because they're blatantly treating the readership like children.