Falkland islands protest outside Brit embassy in BA

[Rio Cana]

I found another island claim problem which was solved after many decades. Maybe, the UK. and Argentina can use it to solve there problems.

The river Island claims were between China and Russia.There arguments seems to almost parallel the UK. and Argentine arguments. Just change the names of the nations from China and Russia to Argentina and the UK. and you would not know the difference. Both sides fought a war in 1969 over the islands. Just like the UK. and Argentina did in 1982. And that the Russian inhabitants of the islands wanted to stay with Russia. Just like the Falkland islanders who want to remain part of the UK.

And how did they solve it. By compromising.

The deal ended a disagreement that in 1969 led to a brief shooting war between the two countries over some contested islands along the Amur River. According to the Chinese media, the Russian government made the most concessions, yielding half of Heixiazi (Bolshoi Ussuriysky in Russian) island and all of Yinlong (Tarabarov) island. As a result, the Russian government withdrew its official presence from 174 square km (67 square miles) of territory that had been the site of bloody clashes in 1969. One reason why this last segment of the frontier along northeast China proved the most challenging to resolve was that the Heixiazi/Bolshoi Ussuriysky Island involves inhabited lands. Since the small Russian community on the island did not want to relocate or become part of China, the two governments drew the boundary in such a way that the populated areas fell within the new Russian half of the island.

The Chinese name for the island which was divided was Heixiazi. The Russians called that island Bolshoi Ussuriysky.

So give Argentina all the uninhabited parts of the Falkland islands.

And Heixiazi/Bolshoi Ussuriysky island is being turned into a major tourist area. China has spent 1.5 billion in infrastructure. Russians are also involved.

It is a cooperative work between China and Russia to launch "One island, two countries” tourism program on Bolshoi Ussuriysky Island. And it is the first in the world to carry out such kind of joint tourism program.

Story - http://www.travellinkdaily.com/EN/WebSi ... 45&FID=369

[Dread Lady Nathicana]

Ok folks - a reminder, as this is clearly an issue that several folks hold near and dear to their hearts:

Please Refrain from making Inflammatory Remarks, Accusations, or Inferrences. And bear in mind that not everyone here has English as a first language - there is no reason to use that as an excuse for dismissing their comments. Also, not everyone agrees - or has to - on who has a 'right' to what here. That's part of the discussion.

Attack the argument, not the poster. And please, don't start going at each other's throats over this, or we'll just have to shut it down. Forcibly ending discussion and debate is NOT the preferred way of handling things, but sometimes that's just how things go.

Thank you.

[Naughtania]

(Edit. I just saw the mod post above me.)

There's this principle called self-determination. People should be ruled by the country they want to be ruled by. Woodrow Wilson was the biggest proponent of it, and it led to freedom for Eastern Europe from foreign rule. (Until WW2.)

In fact, the Falkland Islands are only Overseas Territories. This means they rule themselves, except for defence and diplomacy. Which also means that their oil is not Britain's oil, but FALKLAND'S oil. Britain is not thus stealing from Argentina.

[The Matthew Islands]

I found another island claim problem which was solved after many decades. Maybe, the UK. and Argentina can use it to solve there problems.

The river Island claims were between China and Russia.There arguments seems to almost parallel the UK. and Argentine arguments. Just change the names of the nations from China and Russia to Argentina and the UK. and you would not know the difference. Both sides fought a war in 1969 over the islands. Just like the UK. and Argentina did in 1982. And that the Russian inhabitants of the islands wanted to stay with Russia. Just like the Falkland islanders who want to remain part of the UK.

The Islands you're referring to are completely different and irrelevant.

The people living on the Falklands want to be British. The British have a better legal claim as well. There is no need to compromise because Argentina is wrong.

*edit* Accidentally said the people on the Islands don't want to be British lol

[The Realm of God]

I found another island claim problem which was solved after many decades. Maybe, the UK. and Argentina can use it to solve there problems.

The river Island claims were between China and Russia.There arguments seems to almost parallel the UK. and Argentine arguments. Just change the names of the nations from China and Russia to Argentina and the UK. and you would not know the difference. Both sides fought a war in 1969 over the islands. Just like the UK. and Argentina did in 1982. And that the Russian inhabitants of the islands wanted to stay with Russia. Just like the Falkland islanders who want to remain part of the UK.

The Islands you're referring to are completely different and irrelevant.

The people living on the Falklands don't want to be British. The British have a better legal claim as well. There is no need to compromise because Argentina is wrong.

Well said. We do not need to appease people who want to take our land and force our people to be part of a nation they dont want to be part off.

[Malgrave]

I found another island claim problem which was solved after many decades. Maybe, the UK. and Argentina can use it to solve there problems.

The river Island claims were between China and Russia.There arguments seems to almost parallel the UK. and Argentine arguments. Just change the names of the nations from China and Russia to Argentina and the UK. and you would not know the difference. Both sides fought a war in 1969 over the islands. Just like the UK. and Argentina did in 1982. And that the Russian inhabitants of the islands wanted to stay with Russia. Just like the Falkland islanders who want to remain part of the UK.

And how did they solve it. By compromising.

The deal ended a disagreement that in 1969 led to a brief shooting war between the two countries over some contested islands along the Amur River. According to the Chinese media, the Russian government made the most concessions, yielding half of Heixiazi (Bolshoi Ussuriysky in Russian) island and all of Yinlong (Tarabarov) island. As a result, the Russian government withdrew its official presence from 174 square km (67 square miles) of territory that had been the site of bloody clashes in 1969. One reason why this last segment of the frontier along northeast China proved the most challenging to resolve was that the Heixiazi/Bolshoi Ussuriysky Island involves inhabited lands. Since the small Russian community on the island did not want to relocate or become part of China, the two governments drew the boundary in such a way that the populated areas fell within the new Russian half of the island.

The Chinese name for the island which was divided was Heixiazi. The Russians called that island Bolshoi Ussuriysky.

So give Argentina all the uninhabited parts of the Falkland islands.

And Heixiazi/Bolshoi Ussuriysky island is being turned into a major tourist area. China has spent 1.5 billion in infrastructure. Russians are also involved.

It is a cooperative work between China and Russia to launch "One island, two countries” tourism program on Bolshoi Ussuriysky Island. And it is the first in the world to carry out such kind of joint tourism program.

Story - http://www.travellinkdaily.com/EN/WebSi ... 45&FID=369

The stories of the Falkland Islands cannot relate to these Russian and Chinese Islands

- The Soviet Union occupied the islands from China illegally in the 1920's and as such Russia were at an immediate disadvantage in any diplomatic negotiations about the future of the islands. The British Empire on the other hand never invaded the Falkland Islands and the situation can be explained by quoting history previously posted by Bwitain.

In 1764, French navigator and military commander Louis Antoine de Bougainville founded the first settlement on Berkeley Sound, in present-day Port Louis, East Falkland. In 1765, British captain John Byron explored and claimed Saunders Island on West Falkland, where he named the harbour Port Egmont and a settlement was constructed in 1766. Unaware of the French presence, Byron claimed the island group for King George III. Spain acquired the French colony in 1767 and placed it under a governor subordinate to the Buenos Aires colonial administration. In 1770, Spain attacked Port Egmont and expelled the British presence, bringing the two countries to the brink of war. War was avoided by a peace treaty and the British return to Port Egmont.

In 1774, economic pressures leading up to the American Revolutionary War forced Great Britain to withdraw from many overseas settlements. Upon withdrawal the British left behind a plaque asserting her continued claim. Spain maintained its governor until 1806 who, on his departure, left behind a plaque asserting Spanish claims. The remaining settlers were withdrawn by the United Provinces of the River Plate in 1811.

Spain have a greater claim to the Falkland Islands then Argentina and if I remember correctly Uruguay also hold a great claim to the Falkland Islands then Argentina. You also have to remember that the people to the Falklands don't wish to be part of Argentina.

[The Matthew Islands]

You assume that the Euro's will be uber-jets. They won't. A single aircraft out of position and they cant over Mount Pleasant AFB, a few bombs/missiles later and its bye-bye RAF. The Rapier probably isnt even up to the standard of its job either. And remember, Britain will find it just as hard to replace its aircraft.

The Royal Navy does have a 3,800 mile trip to rearm. Ascenion Island will be the base closest to them, so unless Britain can amass the merchant naval power of WW2 America, it looks like the RN will be pretty hard pressed.

Regarding troops on the island, it is hardly the challenge you make is sound. There is hardly a huge British presence on the island, and easily overwhelmed by a couple boat-loads of troops. And remember, the Argies can fly troops in and out with ease.

And I am amused at how you suddenly are the voice of British public opinion...

Why do you find it amusing the mention the British public's opinion? You questioned the will of Britain to go to war over the island, and I tried to answer. I mean wut

It will be hard for the Argentinian Air Force to fly troops in when its few transports are already tied up in Haiti, and will be under threat from ship based AA, or even the Typhoons if, by chance the first strike on Mount Pleasant failed. Also, a couple boat load of troops? How will the boats get there if they are sunk by Submarines?

The Royal Navy DOESN'T have a 3800 mile trip because the Royal Fleet Auxiliary has ship replenishment ships that can resupply the Royal Navy AT SEA.

Britain wouldn't find it hard to replace the Typhoons because we haven't actually got all the Typhoons we ordered yet. On top of which about 53 are due to be decommissioned in 2020, so its more than likely the MoD will go, "Oh look, we can add those 4 we lost to the 53 were going to get rid of anyway!"

The Rapier has been improved since 1982 when its flaws were noted, and it is more than capable of shooting down most of the 5 or 6 aircraft the AAF can send to the Falklands.

[Malgrave]

Matthew. I think the Rapier AA on the Falkland Islands has access to a 3d Doppler radar, that shall greatly increase the efficiency of the weapons system especially against a foe that lacks electronics itself.

[Cromarty]

Fucking British shit....you are no longer an Empire, forget that.....You are just using the Malvinas issue to cover up your crisis, just like Thatcher did.....

The Falkland Islanders want to be British.

And it's your crap government that's using the Falklands to cover up their shitness.

[Cromarty]

MALVINAS

This thread is about the Falklands, not some mythical islands in the Atlantic that Argentina says are theirs.

[Cromarty]

The Malvinas are part of OUR territorry.

Why?

[Owenb1]

THEY ARE EVIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Samuraikoku]

THEY ARE EVIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Who? Argentina? The British?

I don't see this as good and evil. I see this as a story that should end already, the Falklands inhabitants want to be British, so their decision must be respected. And since Argentina won't be going to war again (hopefully, because you never know with us unfortunately), all of this bickering is out of place, be it Cristina Kirchner or David Cameron.

[The Realm of God]

Erm wrong board this is OOC on a serious and violitle subject.

[The UK in Exile]

So give Argentina all the uninhabited parts of the Falkland islands.

what would argentina do with it? i'm genuinely curious.

how would the territorial waters be divided?

[Costa Fiero]

Those same aircraft are barely even operational due to a severe lack of funding. If the Argentine Military was to organize for a proper large scale tactical assault on the Falkland Islands it would need to increase military spending and purchase new weapons, a move that would be spotted by the United Kingdom who would put more forces on or near the Falklands as a precautionary measure.

Or the Argetnines can get the transfer of the rest of the fleet of French aircraft which have been upgraded. And the deal has already been signed. The article is in French. It was either that or Spanish. I can give a rough translation if you want. The fact is, the aircraft are routinely flown, so unless you have sources proving otherwise, I'm taking what you say with a grain of salt.

[The UK in Exile]

Those same aircraft are barely even operational due to a severe lack of funding. If the Argentine Military was to organize for a proper large scale tactical assault on the Falkland Islands it would need to increase military spending and purchase new weapons, a move that would be spotted by the United Kingdom who would put more forces on or near the Falklands as a precautionary measure.

Or the Argetnines can get the transfer of the rest of the fleet of French aircraft which have been upgraded. And the deal has already been signed. The article is in French. It was either that or Spanish. I can give a rough translation if you want. The fact is, the aircraft are routinely flown, so unless you have sources proving otherwise, I'm taking what you say with a grain of salt.

http://en.mercopress.com/2010/02/21/fal ... y-s-agenda

this appears to be the same article from 2009 dated a year later.

"Originally purchased to operate from the air carrier ARA 25 de Mayo, the eleven which remain, are now grounded in air fields because of the decommissioning of the carrier"

[Machtergreifung]

Or the Argetnines can get the transfer of the rest of the fleet of French aircraft which have been upgraded. And the deal has already been signed. The article is in French. It was either that or Spanish. I can give a rough translation if you want. The fact is, the aircraft are routinely flown, so unless you have sources proving otherwise, I'm taking what you say with a grain of salt.

http://en.mercopress.com/2010/02/21/fal ... y-s-agenda

this appears to be the same article from 2009 dated a year later.

"Originally purchased to operate from the air carrier ARA 25 de Mayo, the eleven which remain, are now grounded in air fields because of the decommissioning of the carrier"

As they dont have a carrier to base from. Don't mean they cant be used if nessissary.

[Farnhamia]

http://en.mercopress.com/2010/02/21/fal ... y-s-agenda

this appears to be the same article from 2009 dated a year later.

"Originally purchased to operate from the air carrier ARA 25 de Mayo, the eleven which remain, are now grounded in air fields because of the decommissioning of the carrier"

As they dont have a carrier to base from. Don't mean they cant be used if nessissary.

What's the Spanish for "kamikaze"?

[The UK in Exile]

http://en.mercopress.com/2010/02/21/fal ... y-s-agenda

this appears to be the same article from 2009 dated a year later.

"Originally purchased to operate from the air carrier ARA 25 de Mayo, the eleven which remain, are now grounded in air fields because of the decommissioning of the carrier"

As they dont have a carrier to base from. Don't mean they cant be used if nessissary.

no but it does mean their grounded. as in not flying. as in unless you have sources proving otherwise. it could be a bad translation and instead of grounded they mean based. but hey, using your logic we can count the harriers and illustrious for the UK as well.

[Machtergreifung]

As they dont have a carrier to base from. Don't mean they cant be used if nessissary.

What's the Spanish for "kamikaze"?

What the British phrase for a force underequiped to perfrom the task it was intended for?

[The UK in Exile]

What's the Spanish for "kamikaze"?

What the British phrase for a force underequiped to perfrom the task it was intended for?

we call them "the enemy."

[Konggratz]

What's the Spanish for "kamikaze"?

What the British phrase for a force underequiped to perfrom the task it was intended for?

And for mercenary Gurkhas?

[The UK in Exile]

What the British phrase for a force underequiped to perfrom the task it was intended for?

And for mercenary Gurkhas?

we call them,"volunteers."

[The Realm of God]

What the British phrase for a force underequiped to perfrom the task it was intended for?

And for mercenary Gurkhas?

Gurkhas are not mercs they are soldiers in HM armed forces the same as everyone else