God died in Auschwitz

[Orcoa]

You know what I have noticed in threads like these? It seems like either there is one, two or more christian posters who try get into the debate...but get surrounded by atheists, others .etc. I have a answer for this...Don't post in this kind of Thread, Seriously don't do it..if you are a christian and you try to post in this kind of thread..you will get no one and it waste everyone's time. I have learned this long ago and it has helped me since

[Mavorpen]

Ehm, do you meant you can tell Christians what we must follow and not? I did not say we should not follow the Old Testament too, but rather focus more on the New Testament than the Old (that counts for you atheists too, when arguing against it, if you absoluteley have to). After all, the New Testament was in many ways a renovation of the Old Testament, yet, it should not fully replace it either, as you said. But if you follow the words of Jesus, God's son, you will truly be a Christian, even if you have never read nor heared about the Old Testament at all.

Jesus tells you he came to enforce the Old Testament. I think that implies that you should FOCUS on it just as much as the New Testament. Just because you like one better doesn't mean you should follow it more. God set the laws in the OT, Jesus said you must follow them. Christians are still responsible for the OT.

Jesus is much better than the OT? Wrong. Matthew 11:20, Revelations 19:13-15, Matthew 15:4-7, Matthew 19:29, etc. The list goes on, Jesus is bipolar. He goes from happy and loving to being a complete asshole. Seriously, who tells you, "You must love me more than you love your own family."

[Trotskylvania]

And that's good, but we shouldn't base our morality on a universal divine law or a deity, some Atheists also think there is some universal law and it is an epic there is no good or bad in the universe, if you believe there is an you are atheist then you are not atheist.

Nonsense. There are perfectly coherent attempts to find universal moral principles that are entirely secular and have no need for anything supernatural, like Kantian deontology for one.

[Chinese Regions]

I cannot say I understand God's plan, no, and I belive no one really can. Frankly, I believe the most important of Christianity is to follow the teaching in it (the New Testament), not focus too much on stories from the Old Testament that do not really say too much (to us). Christianity is about following the teaching of Jesus, not about a flood that happened thousands of years ago. I still find it amousing, that arguments from Atheists only refers to the Old Testament, not the
New Testament, the Testmament most important to Christians.

Why exactly is he fucking around with is, according to you?
What are we to him, a video game?

That seems likely, and he has fucked up so bad he stopped playing.

[Vestr-Norig]

Ehm, do you meant you can tell Christians what we must follow and not? I did not say we should not follow the Old Testament too, but rather focus more on the New Testament than the Old (that counts for you atheists too, when arguing against it, if you absoluteley have to). After all, the New Testament was in many ways a renovation of the Old Testament, yet, it should not fully replace it either, as you said. But if you follow the words of Jesus, God's son, you will truly be a Christian, even if you have never read nor heared about the Old Testament at all.

Jesus tells you he came to enforce the Old Testament. I think that implies that you should FOCUS on it just as much as the New Testament. Just because you like one better doesn't mean you should follow it more. God set the laws in the OT, Jesus said you must follow them. Christians are still responsible for the OT.

Jesus is much better than the OT? Wrong. Matthew 11:20, Revelations 19:13-15, Matthew 15:4-7, Matthew 19:29, etc. The list goes on, Jesus is bipolar. He goes from happy and loving to being a complete asshole. Seriously, who tells you, "You must love me more than you love your own family."

Sorry, I cannot and will no more participate in a discussion where God (and his Son) is rapidly being called "asshole", "fucked up", etc. End of discussion!

[Chinese Regions]

And that's good, but we shouldn't base our morality on a universal divine law or a deity, some Atheists also think there is some universal law and it is an epic there is no good or bad in the universe, if you believe there is an you are atheist then you are not atheist.

Nonsense. There are perfectly coherent attempts to find universal moral principles that are entirely secular and have no need for anything supernatural, like Kantian deontology for one.

It doesn't have to be supernatural it can just simply be a law, if it is just that however it requires an explanation or source, that source can only be supernatural.

[Distruzio]

True. But that bares no effect on whether an individual recognizes or accepts it as such.

Fair enough, so then how does faith become certainty? When you say the Bible is divinely inspired, are you certain or merely faithful?

I am certain b/c my faith is enough to secure certainty... sometimes. On those occasions when faith is not enough, the Church proscribes honoring Tradition and humility before the guiding council of more faithful individuals. If THAT is not enough, then I am sinning and endeavor to repent.

It happens even to the most faithful.

[Tlaceceyaya]

let me rephrase, non human animals. I do realize we are animals however I meant non-human animals

They can't sin, or maybe they do sin but they are not worthy of being converted or whatever (Remember animals don't go to heaven)
This isn't just a Christian concept, the word "animal" has negative connotations, being savage or wild. Because human morality only applies to humans.
And that's good, but we shouldn't base our morality on a universal divine law or a deity, some Atheists also think there is some universal law and it is an epic there is no good or bad in the universe, if you believe there is an you are atheist then you are not atheist.

There is relative good or bad, based on the creatures you are discussing. For some, it was more evolutionarily beneficial to be nice. For others, being bad was better.
We should base our morality on what our time-lagged genes make us base them on. Our morals are more suitable for small groups, not an entire connected species. However, these morals are in our genes and we tend to obey them. There are variations, but most radical variations cannot thrive.

[Dragosovlkiav]

i watched a movie on pbs called god on trial, and it is a good example of the trials the jews went through, ill se if i can find a clip or two from it.

[Chinese Regions]

Jesus tells you he came to enforce the Old Testament. I think that implies that you should FOCUS on it just as much as the New Testament. Just because you like one better doesn't mean you should follow it more. God set the laws in the OT, Jesus said you must follow them. Christians are still responsible for the OT.

Jesus is much better than the OT? Wrong. Matthew 11:20, Revelations 19:13-15, Matthew 15:4-7, Matthew 19:29, etc. The list goes on, Jesus is bipolar. He goes from happy and loving to being a complete asshole. Seriously, who tells you, "You must love me more than you love your own family."

Sorry, I cannot and will no more participate in a discussion where God (and his Son) is rapidly being called "asshole", "fucked up", etc. End of discussion!

But what can man do to god, according to you nothing. Oh wait another paradox, we killed Jesus on the cross, humans can harm god!
You are giving up on your fight but still cling to bronze age beliefs mixed with the stories of a Jewish man put together and revised hundreds of years after his death.

[Mavorpen]

Sorry, I cannot and will no more participate in a discussion where God (and his Son) is rapidly being called "asshole", "fucked up", etc. End of discussion!

Translation: I have no argument, so I'm running.

[Chinese Regions]

They can't sin, or maybe they do sin but they are not worthy of being converted or whatever (Remember animals don't go to heaven)
This isn't just a Christian concept, the word "animal" has negative connotations, being savage or wild. Because human morality only applies to humans.
And that's good, but we shouldn't base our morality on a universal divine law or a deity, some Atheists also think there is some universal law and it is an epic there is no good or bad in the universe, if you believe there is an you are atheist then you are not atheist.

There is relative good or bad, based on the creatures you are discussing. For some, it was more evolutionarily beneficial to be nice. For others, being bad was better.
We should base our morality on what our time-lagged genes make us base them on. Our morals are more suitable for small groups, not an entire connected species. However, these morals are in our genes and we tend to obey them. There are variations, but most radical variations cannot thrive.

Morality is about good of the species and sometimes the individual, anyway it is basically about growth and preventing extinction, it is about survival.
Morality is simply molecules wanting to replicate themselves over and over and stop anything that gets in its way.

[Dragosovlkiav]

here is god on trial.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5caAug5n8Zk

[Orcoa]

Sorry, I cannot and will no more participate in a discussion where God (and his Son) is rapidly being called "asshole", "fucked up", etc. End of discussion!

But what can man do to god, according to you nothing. Oh wait another paradox, we killed Jesus on the cross, humans can harm god!
You are giving up on your fight but still cling to bronze age beliefs mixed with the stories of a Jewish man put together and revised hundreds of years after his death.

Why is it a fight with you? He just saying what he believes and you have to tear it down because what? It makes you feeling good? Are you trying to make people change to...your ideas or beliefs? Hmmm that sounds very very familiar...

[Tlaceceyaya]

There is relative good or bad, based on the creatures you are discussing. For some, it was more evolutionarily beneficial to be nice. For others, being bad was better.
We should base our morality on what our time-lagged genes make us base them on. Our morals are more suitable for small groups, not an entire connected species. However, these morals are in our genes and we tend to obey them. There are variations, but most radical variations cannot thrive.

Morality is about good of the species and sometimes the individual, anyway it is basically about growth and preventing extinction, it is about survival.
Morality is simply molecules wanting to replicate themselves over and over and stop anything that gets in its way.

Morality is not about the good of the species, it is about the good of the genes. Not all members of a species contain the same genes. See this.

[Mavorpen]

But what can man do to god, according to you nothing. Oh wait another paradox, we killed Jesus on the cross, humans can harm god!
You are giving up on your fight but still cling to bronze age beliefs mixed with the stories of a Jewish man put together and revised hundreds of years after his death.

Why is it a fight with you? He just saying what he believes and you have to tear it down because what? It makes you feeling good? Are you trying to make people change to...your ideas or beliefs? Hmmm that sounds very very familiar...

Uh, you don't understand the situation do you? We aren't calling him an asshole, we aren't calling him stupid, or anything of the sort. I called God an asshole, because he indeed is one. I backed it up. The dude ran away because he has no argument.

[The Alma Mater]

But what can man do to god, according to you nothing. Oh wait another paradox, we killed Jesus on the cross, humans can harm god!
You are giving up on your fight but still cling to bronze age beliefs mixed with the stories of a Jewish man put together and revised hundreds of years after his death.

Why is it a fight with you? He just saying what he believes and you have to tear it down because what? It makes you feeling good? Are you trying to make people change to...your ideas or beliefs? Hmmm that sounds very very familiar...

Showing people that they are hypocrites and applying double standards is not the same as trying to convert them to your own ideas

Though that indeed often is the intention I admit.

[Chinese Regions]

Morality is about good of the species and sometimes the individual, anyway it is basically about growth and preventing extinction, it is about survival.
Morality is simply molecules wanting to replicate themselves over and over and stop anything that gets in its way.

Morality is not about the good of the species, it is about the good of the genes. Not all members of a species contain the same genes. See this.

Okay thank you

[Orcoa]

Why is it a fight with you? He just saying what he believes and you have to tear it down because what? It makes you feeling good? Are you trying to make people change to...your ideas or beliefs? Hmmm that sounds very very familiar...

Uh, you don't understand the situation do you? We aren't calling him an asshole, we aren't calling him stupid, or anything of the sort. I called God an asshole, because he indeed is one. I backed it up. The dude ran away because he has no argument.

Yeah well you won, good for you...like it fucking changes anything

[Mavorpen]

Uh, you don't understand the situation do you? We aren't calling him an asshole, we aren't calling him stupid, or anything of the sort. I called God an asshole, because he indeed is one. I backed it up. The dude ran away because he has no argument.

Yeah well you won, good for you...like it fucking changes anything

If you're going to complain about people getting their ass kicked in a debate, then why are you here...?

[Orcoa]

Before people pounces on me, I'm not against Atheism in anyway and if you are a atheist more power too you. What I have a problem with is people who what I call "Evangelical Atheists" as I have a problem with Evangelical Christians and whatever.

[Orcoa]

Yeah well you won, good for you...like it fucking changes anything

If you're going to complain about people getting their ass kicked in a debate, then why are you here...?

I don't know...(Signs) I been thinking of leaving Nationstates for awhile

[Mavorpen]

Before people pounces on me, I'm not against Atheism in anyway and if you are a atheist more power too you. What I have a problem with is people who what I call "Evangelical Atheists" as I have a problem with Evangelical Christians and whatever.

This is a forum for debate.

[Chinese Regions]

Before people pounces on me, I'm not against Atheism in anyway and if you are a atheist more power too you. What I have a problem with is people who what I call "Evangelical Atheists" as I have a problem with Evangelical Christians and whatever.

Define Evangelical Atheist?
Because to me that sounds like Anti-Theism, which I am not, I don't hate theists.

[Mavorpen]

If you're going to complain about people getting their ass kicked in a debate, then why are you here...?

I don't know...(Signs) I been thinking of leaving Nationstates for awhile

Then do it. I really don't think anyone cares if you do...