SOPA

[Ifreann]

Uthopia, we can't stop you from visiting pirate sites, but you cannot promote illegal activity on our site. *** Knock it off *** or face bans and/or deletion.

With all due respect, the site is from Sweden and there it is not illegal.

This website, however, is not from Sweden.

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With all due respect, the site is from Sweden and there it is not illegal.

That's irrelevant. According to the site rules, and probably according to the laws of the country the NS servers are located in, supporting pirate activity isn't allowed.

They're hosted in the USA.

It's also pretty dickish to support piracy...

That is irrelevant. Being a dick, in and of itself, is not against the rules here.

[North Wiedna]

With all due respect, the site is from Sweden and there it is not illegal.

That's irrelevant. According to the site rules, and probably according to the laws of the country the NS servers are located in, supporting pirate activity isn't allowed.

It's also pretty dickish to support piracy; when people work to produce a product, they deserve a reward. Piracy might be inevitable but that doesn't mean it's awesome.

I don't have the money to support them, though, and since I don't have the money to buy that stuff, hey, I need something to cheer me up...

[Tubbsalot]

That is irrelevant. Being a dick, in and of itself, is not against the rules here.

I wasn't claiming it was.

I don't have the money to support them, though, and since I don't have the money to buy that stuff, hey, I need something to cheer me up...

Yeah, there are certainly times where piracy is pretty much harmless.That said, most pirates can afford to buy the product outright. Some of them wholeheartedly subscribe to the philosophy of "fuck them, I'll take what I want" like Uthopia.

[Norstal]

I am still confused, why is the law meant to t argot illegal "file transfer" but ends up being entirely about censorship?

Because it doesn't stop illegal file transfer. All it does is shut down the servers that holds anything that was copyrighted and is not owned by them. And by hold, again, it doesn't have to be in the server; it can be displayed by the server such as the example of me posting a picture of canned spam.

Refer to my earlier analogy. There are lots and LOTS of videos of people singing and making the covers of copyrighted songs. Those videos must be removed (do you really see a reason why?). Lyrics, movie lines, etc., anything that is associated with copyright materials gets purged.

Let me think up another analogy. You have in your house, a movie you legitimately bought with a musical score in it that they stole from somewhere. The musical score runs only for 20 seconds. By having that movie in your home, you must get rid of it or your house will potentially get flattened.

[FreeLaannds]

No, I am not. We did not even have computers when I was younger

There are ways that you can download films for free. it is more better than paying 500 euros for it.

I would rather pay my rubles (I am Russian), than steal it.

After finding http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_Online_Piracy_Act, and reading other news articles, I understand the opposition more. I think it is important to pay for copy write material, but it censoring everyone for innocent crimes is not a good thing.

[Saiwania]

Not too long ago, I saw this pro-SOPA advertisement on a news channel: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6KfptyKY5I

I fear that opposing SOPA/PIPA through the internet may not be enough. The anti-SOPA side may need to invest in airing at least 2 commercials to counteract this. It's important to reach the baby boomers on this because they generally don't understand the importance of a freer internet as much as younger people.

[Uthopia]

With all due respect, the site is from Sweden and there it is not illegal.

That's irrelevant. According to the site rules, and probably according to the laws of the country the NS servers are located in, supporting pirate activity isn't allowed.

It's also pretty dickish to support piracy; when people work to produce a product, they deserve a reward. Piracy might be inevitable but that doesn't mean it's awesome.

Yes, well you might have right. But here where I live it is imposible to find a job without corruption I always try on the easy way.

[Uthopia]

There are ways that you can download films for free. it is more better than paying 500 euros for it.

I would rather pay my rubles (I am Russian), than steal it.

After finding http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_Online_Piracy_Act, and reading other news articles, I understand the opposition more. I think it is important to pay for copy write material, but it censoring everyone for innocent crimes is not a good thing.

Why is it stolen if somebody have already posted it on a website?

[FreeLaannds]

I would rather pay my rubles (I am Russian), than steal it.

After finding http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_Online_Piracy_Act, and reading other news articles, I understand the opposition more. I think it is important to pay for copy write material, but it censoring everyone for innocent crimes is not a good thing.

Why is it stolen if somebody have already posted it on a website?

Because you are taking something you have not paid for. Everyone is deserving of rewards, and unless they have given the right to reallocate (перераспределять?) there product, then they should be paid for it. Other wise, it is stealing.

[Bythyrona]

Why is it stolen if somebody have already posted it on a website?

Because you are taking something you have not paid for. Everyone is deserving of rewards, and unless they have given the right to reallocate (перераспределять?) there product, then they should be paid for it. Other wise, it is stealing.

...ex post facto law? Grandfather clauses?

[FreeLaannds]

Because you are taking something you have not paid for. Everyone is deserving of rewards, and unless they have given the right to reallocate (перераспределять?) there product, then they should be paid for it. Other wise, it is stealing.

...ex post facto law? Grandfather clauses?

Sorry? I don't know what either of this are.

[Uthopia]

Why is it stolen if somebody have already posted it on a website?

Because you are taking something you have not paid for. Everyone is deserving of rewards, and unless they have given the right to reallocate (перераспределять?) there product, then they should be paid for it. Other wise, it is stealing.

If somebody pays a product. This product he left somewhere in order that somebody else can use and some other person use it. You want to say that the product is stolen?
(мы можем и, если вы хотите, чтобы украинский)

[Farnhamia]

Because you are taking something you have not paid for. Everyone is deserving of rewards, and unless they have given the right to reallocate (перераспределять?) there product, then they should be paid for it. Other wise, it is stealing.

If somebody pays a product. This product he left somewhere in order that somebody else can use and some other person use it. You want to say that the product is stolen?
(мы можем и, если вы хотите, чтобы украинский)

Not the same thing. If the product is out on the internet and is for sale, if you take a copy without paying, what is that?

[Unchecked Expansion]

Because you are taking something you have not paid for.

You aren't taking. You are copying.
Copyright infringement and theft are different crimes, and any meaningful debate has to acknowledge that.

[FreeLaannds]

Because you are taking something you have not paid for. Everyone is deserving of rewards, and unless they have given the right to reallocate (перераспределять?) there product, then they should be paid for it. Other wise, it is stealing.

If somebody pays a product. This product he left somewhere in order that somebody else can use and some other person use it. You want to say that the product is stolen?
(мы можем и, если вы хотите, чтобы украинский)

Да, это украдено.
Each person should pay for the items like Music and Film. Things like food are shared.

[Uthopia]

If somebody pays a product. This product he left somewhere in order that somebody else can use and some other person use it. You want to say that the product is stolen?
(мы можем и, если вы хотите, чтобы украинский)

Not the same thing. If the product is out on the internet and is for sale, if you take a copy without paying, what is that?

Yes, but I am using from a site which is legal and using torrents is not stealing cause somebody else posted in order that somebody can use the file.

[Bythyrona]

...ex post facto law? Grandfather clauses?

Sorry? I don't know what either of this are.

The American Constitution prohibits prosecuting someone for acts not previously criminalized. Even if online piracy is viewed as directly equivalent to physical theft in your eyes, SOPA would set a dangerous and unconstitutional precedent for violating the ex post facto clause.

[Farnhamia]

Not the same thing. If the product is out on the internet and is for sale, if you take a copy without paying, what is that?

Yes, but I am using from a site which is legal and using torrents is not stealing cause somebody else posted in order that somebody can use the file.

I'm not talking about someone putting something out there for people to use for free. I'm talking about putting something out there that you are supposed to pay to use, and you use it and don't pay.

[Uthopia]

If somebody pays a product. This product he left somewhere in order that somebody else can use and some other person use it. You want to say that the product is stolen?
(мы можем и, если вы хотите, чтобы украинский)

Да, это украдено.
Each person should pay for the items like Music and Film. Things like food are shared.

Ne seri.

If you uploading a movie on the net, which is the purpose of that act?

[Bythyrona]

If somebody pays a product. This product he left somewhere in order that somebody else can use and some other person use it. You want to say that the product is stolen?
(мы можем и, если вы хотите, чтобы украинский)

Да, это украдено.
Each person should pay for the items like Music and Film. Things like food are shared.

...not really. The farmer puts in effort to grow his crop. If I understand you correctly, you're saying that food shouldn't be a commodity but created content should?

[Farnhamia]

Sorry? I don't know what either of this are.

The American Constitution prohibits prosecuting someone for acts not previously criminalized. Even if online piracy is viewed as directly equivalent to physical theft in your eyes, SOPA would set a dangerous and unconstitutional precedent for violating the ex post facto clause.

Really? Show where either act contains that kind of language. They're bad bills but I would be surprised if the authors were that stupid.

[Uthopia]

Yes, but I am using from a site which is legal and using torrents is not stealing cause somebody else posted in order that somebody can use the file.

I'm not talking about someone putting something out there for people to use for free. I'm talking about putting something out there that you are supposed to pay to use, and you use it and don't pay.

Well, this is what I am talking about. torrent are used for that purpose, the swedush website is a place where people put some thing in order that other people use it for free. And technically torrent are not stealing metarials, rather sharing with others.

[FreeLaannds]

Да, это украдено.
Each person should pay for the items like Music and Film. Things like food are shared.

...not really. The farmer puts in effort to grow his crop. If I understand you correctly, you're saying that food shouldn't be a commodity but created content should?

Food is a necessity, one that should be distributing between everyone, something everyone should have and share. Music, films, this kind of things are more necessary, but for fun and entertainment. People should pay for that, to support others work. I am not saying farmers should not be paid, simply that food should be shared.

[Jolthig]

Man, luckily this bill is dead. I was extremly pissed when i heard the SOPA bill until it died. Is the other bill still up?

[Bythyrona]

The American Constitution prohibits prosecuting someone for acts not previously criminalized. Even if online piracy is viewed as directly equivalent to physical theft in your eyes, SOPA would set a dangerous and unconstitutional precedent for violating the ex post facto clause.

Really? Show where either act contains that kind of language. They're bad bills but I would be surprised if the authors were that stupid.

Sec. 204. "Economic espionage"?

We've at least tried to stay away from near-ex post facto action, other than the Lindbergh Law; the statute of limitations is a good thing.