US Marines and mistreatment of Taliban dead

[Cromarty]

Nice ITG routine.

Seriously? Really? Wow... just wow. Stop impersonating a US Marine. You aren't one. The only argument you present is "ITG"? I'm done here, anything leftover from an intelligent conversation has been destroyed by your inability to present a valid argument.

It's really fucking funny to see you accuse someone else of impersonating a marine.

[Keronians]

Nice ITG routine.

Seriously? Really? Wow... just wow. Stop impersonating a US Marine. You aren't one. The only argument you present is "ITG"? I'm done here, anything leftover from an intelligent conversation has been destroyed by your inability to present a valid argument.

You're right. He isn't.

He's an ex-Marine.

[Mike the Progressive]

I take issue with the thread title. Why is an entire continent being judged by the actions of several idiot Marines?

Because America is stupid, Sib. And we have too many aircraft carriers; an English clothes company, owned by its employees, is proof that communism can work; and Labour is the greatest party ever and anything wrong with the UK is David Cameron's fault.

[Serrland]

A excellent reply there and quite amusing, but none the less, it is a sure fire way to discourage all the young hotheads in his village from going out to take potshots and soldiers for a few dollars.

No not really. All it's going to do is provide the Taliban a village load of new recruits.

Congrats!

It worked for us in Vietnam! There were no negative ramifications for attacking civilians there at all!

[Machtergreifung]

Think about it for a second.

With the current situation, the Talbian recruits think that even if they are killed/captured, they are still subject to laws and regulations. And as a result they take some small comfort in that. Removing them would make them pause for a moment longer before going off to plant some IEDs.



Quite right, the only way to beat them is to play thier own game, and do it better. NATO needs to look at the Selous Scouts, as they remain one of the best examples of beating a insurgency.

I doubt it. They know they'll likely die or be tortured.

They don't care.

On the other hand, the US looks like shit in front of the world.

Realised my post is a bit ambiguous.

I mean, if they treat Taliban the way the Taliban treat Americans, the US would look like shit in front of the world.

The US looks like shit anyway, so they may as well beat the Taliban properly than do it badly.

A excellent reply there and quite amusing, but none the less, it is a sure fire way to discourage all the young hotheads in his village from going out to take potshots and soldiers for a few dollars.

No not really. All it's going to do is provide the Taliban a village load of new recruits.

Congrats!

Yes, because after seeing their neighbours body delivered in peices, they will all be dying to go the same way...

Quite right, the only way to beat them is to play thier own game, and do it better. NATO needs to look at the Selous Scouts, as they remain one of the best examples of beating a insurgency.

I'm not sure I understand - we vilify them for conducting themselves in such a manner, yet we ourselves should adopt the same methods? I can't see how it could be morally acceptable to stoop to that level.

It isn't, and thats why it works. It is nessissary to show them that NATO will stop at nothing to defeat them.

[Cromarty]

Think about it for a second.

With the current situation, the Talbian recruits think that even if they are killed/captured, they are still subject to laws and regulations. And as a result they take some small comfort in that. Removing them would make them pause for a moment longer before going off to plant some IEDs.



Quite right, the only way to beat them is to play thier own game, and do it better. NATO needs to look at the Selous Scouts, as they remain one of the best examples of beating a insurgency.

This ^

Mercy should only be given to those who would give it back.

Except you're ignoring one thing: reality.

Look at Northern Ireland. Look at the Basque Country. Look at almost every insurgency ever. The more brutal you get, and in case you would violating the Geneva Convention and committing war crimes, the more willing recruits your enemy will have.

[Serrland]

It isn't, and thats why it works. It is nessissary to show them that NATO will stop at nothing to defeat them.

You do not believe that a civilized nation, one that prides itself as being The Shining City on the Hill, Light of Nations, etc etc has an obligation to behave morally and ethically?

[Malgrave]

I take issue with the thread title. Why is an entire continent being judged by the actions of several idiot Marines?

Because America is stupid, Sib. And we have too many aircraft carriers; an English clothes company, owned by its employees, is proof that communism can work; and Labour is the greatest party ever and anything wrong with the UK is David Cameron's fault.

It appears the chemicals in the water supply have supplied us with another comrade.

[Machtergreifung]

This ^

Mercy should only be given to those who would give it back.

Except you're ignoring one thing: reality.

Look at Northern Ireland. Look at the Basque Country. Look at almost every insurgency ever. The more brutal you get, and in case you would violating the Geneva Convention and committing war crimes, the more willing recruits your enemy will have.

All cases of rules and regulations above board, and a little brutality underground.

In order to beat the Taliban, we need proven methods. Undercover operatives, pretending to be Taliban. Poisoned clothes, malfunctioning weapons, the works.

[Malgrave]

A excellent reply there and quite amusing, but none the less, it is a sure fire way to discourage all the young hotheads in his village from going out to take potshots and soldiers for a few dollars.

No not really. All it's going to do is provide the Taliban a village load of new recruits.

Congrats!

Well unemployment is high.....

[Keronians]

I doubt it. They know they'll likely die or be tortured.

They don't care.

On the other hand, the US looks like shit in front of the world.

Realised my post is a bit ambiguous.

I mean, if they treat Taliban the way the Taliban treat Americans, the US would look like shit in front of the world.

The US looks like shit anyway, so they may as well beat the Taliban properly than do it badly.

No not really. All it's going to do is provide the Taliban a village load of new recruits.

Congrats!

Yes, because after seeing their neighbours body delivered in peices, they will all be dying to go the same way...

I'm not sure I understand - we vilify them for conducting themselves in such a manner, yet we ourselves should adopt the same methods? I can't see how it could be morally acceptable to stoop to that level.

It isn't, and thats why it works. It is nessissary to show them that NATO will stop at nothing to defeat them.

Taliban: "Americans are evil! They want to kill all of us!! They'll piss on your dead bodies, and rape your wives!"

Afghan: "... Nah..."

Americans: "Woohoo! Let's go kill some brown retards! Oh, and torturing them after would be great... How about we go ahead and piss on their dead bodies as well? Ooh, and then break their limbs and dump them somewhere."

Afghan: "What the fuck, man? Fuck this government shit, I'm signing up for the Taliban!"

Really great.

Just trying to kill as many Taliban as possible, and being cruel doesn't work. It gives them legitimacy, and persuades young Afghans to take up arms to "defend" their nation.

[Cromarty]

I take issue with the thread title. Why is an entire continent being judged by the actions of several idiot Marines?

Because America is stupid, Sib. And we have too many aircraft carriers; an English clothes company, owned by its employees, is proof that communism can work; and Labour is the greatest party ever and anything wrong with the UK is David Cameron's fault.

Because the conduct of American military personnel doesn't reflect on America... at all. Nope, not a jot.

Aside from really crap baitery, got anything to actually contribute to the topic, or are you going to continue to shitpost?

[Boomfook]

Are you guys arguing about tactical-corpse-pissing?

No, I was arguing about the fact that on top of being disrespectful, what they did was really stupid for a number of reasons, including the fact that they left themselves open to the dead guys' bodies sneaking up on them.

That's surely a typo, so I won't make a zombie joke Watching you guys arguing about the tactics of corpse-pissing is odd enough without one.

[Machtergreifung]

It isn't, and thats why it works. It is nessissary to show them that NATO will stop at nothing to defeat them.

You do not believe that a civilized nation, one that prides itself as being The Shining City on the Hill, Light of Nations, etc etc has an obligation to behave morally and ethically?

When confronted by people who would, if given the chance, do far worse, no.

[Mike the Progressive]

Because America is stupid, Sib. And we have too many aircraft carriers; an English clothes company, owned by its employees, is proof that communism can work; and Labour is the greatest party ever and anything wrong with the UK is David Cameron's fault.

It appears the chemicals in the water supply have supplied us with another comrade.

Huzzah! I blame fluoridation. It's as a great man once said: "A foreign substance is introduced into our precious bodily fluids without the knowledge of the individual, and certainly without any choice. That's the way your hard-core Commie works. I first became aware of it, Mandrake, during the physical act of love... Yes, a profound sense of fatigue, a feeling of emptiness followed. Luckily I — I was able to interpret these feelings correctly. Loss of essence. I can assure you it has not recurred, Mandrake. Women, er, women sense my power, and they seek the life essence. I do not avoid women, Mandrake...but I do deny them my essence."

[Keronians]

I take issue with the thread title. Why is an entire continent being judged by the actions of several idiot Marines?

Because America is stupid, Sib. And we have too many aircraft carriers; an English clothes company, owned by its employees, is proof that communism can work; and Labour is the greatest party ever and anything wrong with the UK is David Cameron's fault.

It's not completely fair, but America as a country WILL be judged by the behaviour of its troops in foreign nations.

If they're cruel, disrespectful, etc., then the people of that country will think that America is a horrible nation.

[Galla-]

Seriously? Really? Wow... just wow. Stop impersonating a US Marine. You aren't one. The only argument you present is "ITG"? I'm done here, anything leftover from an intelligent conversation has been destroyed by your inability to present a valid argument.

You're right. He isn't.

He's an ex-Marine.

Once a Marine, always a Marine.

He's a veteran Marine.

[Serrland]

You do not believe that a civilized nation, one that prides itself as being The Shining City on the Hill, Light of Nations, etc etc has an obligation to behave morally and ethically?

When confronted by people who would, if given the chance, do far worse, no.

Why not? How can we call ourselves a civilized nation when we embrace the same barbarism we strongly condemn?

[Machtergreifung]

The US looks like shit anyway, so they may as well beat the Taliban properly than do it badly.



Yes, because after seeing their neighbours body delivered in peices, they will all be dying to go the same way...



It isn't, and thats why it works. It is nessissary to show them that NATO will stop at nothing to defeat them.

Taliban: "Americans are evil! They want to kill all of us!! They'll piss on your dead bodies, and rape your wives!"

Afghan: "... Nah..."

Americans: "Woohoo! Let's go kill some brown retards! Oh, and torturing them after would be great... How about we go ahead and piss on their dead bodies as well? Ooh, and then break their limbs and dump them somewhere."

Afghan: "What the fuck, man? Fuck this government shit, I'm signing up for the Taliban!"

Really great.

Just trying to kill as many Taliban as possible, and being cruel doesn't work. It gives them legitimacy, and persuades young Afghans to take up arms to "defend" their nation.

American: Hey, see that village where all the men attacked us three weeks ago?

American 2: Yeah?

American: Let's go build them a new school.

Taliban: Thanks for the school, we will see you down our rifle sights tomorrow!


What then would you suggest?

[Cromarty]

Except you're ignoring one thing: reality.

Look at Northern Ireland. Look at the Basque Country. Look at almost every insurgency ever. The more brutal you get, and in case you would violating the Geneva Convention and committing war crimes, the more willing recruits your enemy will have.

All cases of rules and regulations above board, and a little brutality underground.

In order to beat the Taliban, we need proven methods. Undercover operatives, pretending to be Taliban. Poisoned clothes, malfunctioning weapons, the works.

Yay genocide.

[Keronians]

You do not believe that a civilized nation, one that prides itself as being The Shining City on the Hill, Light of Nations, etc etc has an obligation to behave morally and ethically?

When confronted by people who would, if given the chance, do far worse, no.

According to you, America already looks like shit.

Any guesses as to why? Couldn't have something to do with violating the Geneva Conventions, going on random dick-waving sprees in Iraq, and going against the UN, could it?

You know, the UN, that body that America (alongside the other great powers after WW2) founded?

[Machtergreifung]

When confronted by people who would, if given the chance, do far worse, no.

Why not? How can we call ourselves a civilized nation when we embrace the same barbarism we strongly condemn?

I will use the analogy of the bushfire. Sometimes the best way to fight a fire, is with fire itself.

[Machtergreifung]

When confronted by people who would, if given the chance, do far worse, no.

According to you, America already looks like shit.

Any guesses as to why? Couldn't have something to do with violating the Geneva Conventions, going on random dick-waving sprees in Iraq, and going against the UN, could it?

You know, the UN, that body that America (alongside the other great powers after WW2) founded?

Hmm, do I see the UN doing a whole lot with regards to making sure the Taliban follow the Geneva Conventions?...

[Malgrave]

Taliban: "Americans are evil! They want to kill all of us!! They'll piss on your dead bodies, and rape your wives!"

Afghan: "... Nah..."

Americans: "Woohoo! Let's go kill some brown retards! Oh, and torturing them after would be great... How about we go ahead and piss on their dead bodies as well? Ooh, and then break their limbs and dump them somewhere."

Afghan: "What the fuck, man? Fuck this government shit, I'm signing up for the Taliban!"

Really great.

Just trying to kill as many Taliban as possible, and being cruel doesn't work. It gives them legitimacy, and persuades young Afghans to take up arms to "defend" their nation.

American: Hey, see that village where all the men attacked us three weeks ago?

American 2: Yeah?

American: Let's go build them a new school.

Taliban: Thanks for the school, we will see you down our rifle sights tomorrow!


What then would you suggest?

It's more like

Afghan Elder: Thanks for constructing a new school now our children can gain an education. I'll use my influence to help stop people from joining the Taliban.

Then said children will have a positive reminder of the Americans and have an education making them less likely to join forces with the Taliban and more likely to inform American soldiers about IEDs and planned attacks.

[Boomfook]

You do not believe that a civilized nation, one that prides itself as being The Shining City on the Hill, Light of Nations, etc etc has an obligation to behave morally and ethically?

When confronted by people who would, if given the chance, do far worse, no.

But then you'd become known as the invading hordes who go around blowing up civilians, raping prisoners and urinating on corpses and nobody would show you any mercy either...



Oh wait...