Attraction is Objectification

[Straughn]

It's hard to "get" that something is morally wrong when it is, in fact, not morally wrong. It's like saying driving is wrong because you treat everybody with a car as if they are driving drunk.

What if they drive like they're in Grand Theft Auto?

[Seperates]

Then go into a hermitage in the woods to live out the rest of your days.

Then how can I do physics without access to research?

Drop a ball. See. Physics.

[Odins Scandinavia]

You are starting to understand.

So you have no sense of right and wrong and just do whatever you want with no regard for principle or for other people. Then, once you've done it, you twist around some pseudo moral logic to rationalize it.

Is that what I'm getting?

yes, you have perfectly described yourself.

[Odins Scandinavia]

its run its course. it is time that it goes to the area where all threads go when they die.

Usenet?

4chan!

[Four-sided Triangles]

I like your way of thinking, but when reading this I can't help but think that he's just mad because he can't get any....

ou never read the part where I said I turned down someone's offer.

[Odins Scandinavia]

Because it is not morally wrong. It's hard to "get" that something is morally wrong when it is, in fact, not morally wrong. It's like saying driving is wrong because you treat everybody with a car as if they are driving drunk.

I like your way of thinking, but when reading this I can't help but think that he's just mad because he can't get any....

why does nobody acknowledge me when i say these things?

I like your way of thinking, but when reading this I can't help but think that he's just mad because he can't get any....

ou never read the part where I said I turned down someone's offer.

a thoroughly shoddy assertion that is impossible to prove, essentially being your word against ours. really, i think you lie.

[The Black Forrest]

And the non-sequitor award goes to......

Non-Sequitor? It seems to follow quite well well to me. Although he did not bother to write the assumptions and show the method by which his assumptions followed to a conclusion it's pretty simple to see them.

He was asked "Who gives a shit about morality?" and replied with "Anyone who's not okay with theft, rape, murder, genocide, etc"

He's making the implication that everyone who is not okay with theft, rape, murder, and genocide is not okay with them for moral reasons.

You could argue that there exists at least one person who is not okay with, theft for example, but has some convoluted way of thinking about it in a non moral way.

But his reply is mostly true. Obvious even as a reply to the question posed.

Depends on who you read it I guess.

I took "who gives a shit about morality" when it comes to sex.

[Four-sided Triangles]

yes, you have perfectly described yourself.

False. Otherwise, I would attempt to "get laid," as our culture so eloquently puts it.

[Great Nepal]

:D Biology doesn't care about moral systems.

That's my point.

P1. Objectification is wrong.
P2. Sex and relationships always involve some objectification.
C. Sex and relationships are immoral.

P1. Granted.
P2. Source?
C. Since, there is no evidence for P2; C. is invalid.

Nice try though... joking

[Seperates]

The beauty of morality is that it is malleable to the situation at hand.

Morality that you can simply modify whenever it's convenient is effectively useless. It amounts to nothing more than a way to rationalize any action you take.

Oh no... you are becoming religious... There is no Absolute Morality. None. You are responsible for your actions in the society that you live in. Morality is subjective, but for me it is the violation of another's choices. Rape is that, Murder is that, theft is that... but consensual sex is not. Love is not.

[Odins Scandinavia]

yes, you have perfectly described yourself.

False. Otherwise, I would attempt to "get laid," as our culture so eloquently puts it.

you do whatever you damn well please regardless as to the opinions of pretty much everyone else, (post these blogs on NSG) and then use twisted morality to justify this.

[Natapoc]

I like your way of thinking, but when reading this I can't help but think that he's just mad because he can't get any....

why does nobody acknowledge me when i say these things?

ou never read the part where I said I turned down someone's offer.

a thoroughly shoddy assertion that is impossible to prove, essentially being your word against ours. really, i think you lie.

There is no reason to assume he is lying. It's not particularly difficult to find people who want to have sex. But even if he is it would be irrelevant.

His argument is either valid or invalid and the truth value of his argument has no relation to his personal experiences.

One exception to this would be the argument that you must objectify someone to have sex with them. If he'd had sex with a person who he was in a honest relationship with then he would be able to use his personal personal experiences as evidence to the truth of the statement only as it relates to his own experience.

[Straughn]

Wait ... for genetic integrity, slugs still fling mucous at each other in a twisted banana tango just to maintain genetic integrity.
That's gotta be immoral.

I am sigging that

You got it.
Just remember this next time you kick, or more perversely, blow out a dandelion to watch the gossameresque seeds fly .... you successfully masturbated a plant to climax and a good chance at reproduction. People typically objectify the dandelion to that predictable encounter.

Well, no need to mix the two visions, but hey, if it works for you.

[Great Nepal]

And the non-sequitor award goes to......

If you object to murder, you must have some moral system. It might be poorly thought out and primitive, but it's still there. The second you find anything wrong or objectionable, that automatically induces a morality.

If someone wants to get murdered, that is fine.
If someone wants to get rapped, that is fine.

I doubt anyone does, so it is violation of their free will as such is wrong.

[Seperates]

I am sigging that

You got it.
Just remember this next time you kick, or more perversely, blow out a dandelion to watch the gossameresque seeds fly .... you successfully masturbated a plant to climax and a good chance at reproduction. People typically objectify the dandelion to that predictable encounter.

Well, no need to mix the two visions, but hey, if it works for you.

[Slaytesics]

http://scienceblogs.com/notrocketscience/2010/01/how_sexual_objectification_silences_women_-_the_male_glance.php

At last, proof of my ideas. No man should ever be attracted to a female body because it has the effect of objectification. Note, however, that females staring at male bodies does not produce the same effect.

I'm vindicated. All sexual attraction is objectification. You can't get out of it.

CONGRATULATIONS, NO ONE CARES.

[AiliailiA]

Wait ... for genetic integrity, slugs still fling mucous at each other in a twisted banana tango just to maintain genetic integrity.
That's gotta be immoral.

win?

yeah. win.

Straughn wrote the best post about sex which I've ever seen on General. It wasn't long (about 50 words) but it was quite simply too good to quote. You had to be there.

I think Laughlin might have been there.

[Seperates]

If you object to murder, you must have some moral system. It might be poorly thought out and primitive, but it's still there. The second you find anything wrong or objectionable, that automatically induces a morality.

If someone wants to get murdered, that is fine.
If someone wants to get rapped, that is fine.

I doubt anyone does, so it is violation of their free will as such is wrong.

Well, as much as a free will as physics and chemistry allow us to have...

[Four-sided Triangles]

If someone wants to get murdered, that is fine.
If someone wants to get rapped, that is fine.

I doubt anyone does, so it is violation of their free will as such is wrong.

You can't want to be raped or murdered. Those crimes exclude consent by definition.

[Straughn]

Wait ... for genetic integrity, slugs still fling mucous at each other in a twisted banana tango just to maintain genetic integrity.
That's gotta be immoral.

win?

yeah. win.

Thank you!

[Odins Scandinavia]

I am sigging that

You got it.
Just remember this next time you kick, or more perversely, blow out a dandelion to watch the gossameresque seeds fly .... you successfully masturbated a plant to climax and a good chance at reproduction. People typically objectify the dandelion to that predictable encounter.

Well, no need to mix the two visions, but hey, if it works for you.

you sir, you are a god of comedy.

[Odins Scandinavia]

If someone wants to get murdered, that is fine.
If someone wants to get rapped, that is fine.

I doubt anyone does, so it is violation of their free will as such is wrong.

You can't want to be raped or murdered. Those crimes exclude consent by definition.

actually, there are some fetish people who want to be raped. i know, i know, its.. its weird.

[Great Nepal]

If someone wants to get murdered, that is fine.
If someone wants to get rapped, that is fine.

I doubt anyone does, so it is violation of their free will as such is wrong.

You can't want to be raped or murdered. Those crimes exclude consent by definition.

Therefore they are wrong unlike sex and relationship.

[Squirrelsburg]

This is hardly a new argument.

As Kant said, love "taken by itself is a degradation of human nature; for as soon as a person becomes an object of appetite for another, all motives of moral relationship cease to function, because as an object of appetite for another a person becomes a thing and can be treated and used by everyone."

I agree with the OP , I just don't see why it matters.

[Seperates]

If someone wants to get murdered, that is fine.
If someone wants to get rapped, that is fine.

I doubt anyone does, so it is violation of their free will as such is wrong.

You can't want to be raped or murdered. Those crimes exclude consent by definition.

And if Jill is twice as old as Billy, who is 4 years older than 12 year old Tory, for how many more 30-day months will their threesomes be considered statutory rape?