Is Socialism Un-American?

[Kostemetsia]

If we were meant to be Socialist then we would have been Socialist from the beginning. We have not been, so we were not meant to be. Socialism is a trap that doesn't work. It ruins economies, why would you want it, why should I want it .... nuff said!

Comes to mind: 'If God meant man to fly, he would have given him wings'.

Good and useful to DICTATORS maybe.

... I don't believe it. Did you just make the argument - through a converse fallacy of accident no less - that thanks to, I assume, the USSR under Stalinism, all socialist ideas are inherently the preserve of dictators?

I didn't know that all of the following European states were dictatorships: Austria, Cyprus, Estonia, Finland, Greece, Italy, Malta, Portugal, Spain, and the United Kingdom. All of the above states are led by firmly left-wing or socialist parties (see links), and all of them look perfectly democratic to me.

[Unchecked Expansion]

If we were meant to be Socialist then we would have been Socialist from the beginning. We have not been, so we were not meant to be. Socialism is a trap that doesn't work. It ruins economies, why would you want it, why should I want it .... nuff said!

Comes to mind: 'If God meant man to fly, he would have given him wings'.

Good and useful to DICTATORS maybe.

... I don't believe it. Did you just make the argument - through a converse fallacy of accident no less - that thanks to, I assume, the USSR under Stalinism, all socialist ideas are inherently the preserve of dictators?

I didn't know that all of the following European states were dictatorships: Austria, Cyprus, Estonia, Finland, Greece, Italy, Malta, Portugal, Spain, and the United Kingdom. All of the above states are led by firmly left-wing or socialist parties (see links), and all of them look perfectly democratic to me.

He so verrry nearly Godwin'd it

[Bavin]

If we were meant to be Socialist then we would have been Socialist from the beginning. We have not been, so we were not meant to be. Socialism is a trap that doesn't work. It ruins economies, why would you want it, why should I want it .... nuff said!

Comes to mind: 'If God meant man to fly, he would have given him wings'.

Good and useful to DICTATORS maybe.

... I don't believe it. Did you just make the argument - through a converse fallacy of accident no less - that thanks to, I assume, the USSR under Stalinism, all socialist ideas are inherently the preserve of dictators?

I didn't know that all of the following European states were dictatorships: Austria, Cyprus, Estonia, Finland, Greece, Italy, Malta, Portugal, Spain, and the United Kingdom. All of the above states are led by firmly left-wing or socialist parties (see links), and all of them look perfectly democratic to me.

He so verrry nearly Godwin'd it

I saw we call him on it anyway.

[Patriqvinia]

ah, found it. Article IV, Section 4...

[Milks Empire]

ah, found it. Article IV, Section 4...

Fail.
Socialism is an economic structure. Article IV Section 4 does not apply, as it discusses the political structure.

[Surote]

Socialism is the best road forward for America. It's not the only road. There are a lot of other possibilities, but socialism shows the most promise of helping the US adapt to the ever-changing World.

Do I think it's likely that America will become any more than remotely socialist (that is, regulate commerce and maintain minimum wage, etc.)? No, not really. There are too many members of the lower class with Economic-Stockholm syndrome, who, in tandem with their rich, corporatist allies, will probably be able to kill any substantial shifting towards a more egalitarian society. It really makes me sad.

We can stay moderately capitalist we don't have to be socialist.

[CIB EMPIRE]

everyone being equaly as rich or poor no matter how hard or little they work.... it doesnt work!

[Gruesome Evil]

Socialis is just fine, but it should not be total. a completly scialist country would have it so that a garbage man would make the same amout as a a CEO in a major country. so we are not completly socialist but we are a little socialist and a little capitalist. no country is completly socialist or completly capitilist, it just does'nt exist

[Pevisopolis]

everyone being equaly as rich or poor no matter how hard or little they work.... it doesnt work!

Hard Work =/= Rich

Being poor is not a choice. The people who work on the Walton family's undeservedly enormous lawn are probably shit poor, yet work harder than daddy Sam's family could ever dream to.

[Buffett and Colbert]

everyone being equaly as rich or poor no matter how hard or little they work.... it doesnt work!

Except for the fact being a hard worker does not mean you are rich. And people who argue against Socialism, always say that lazy, undeserving poor people would steal hard workers' money. This makes absolutely no sense. You do not have a choice to be poor, and those who are poor are more likely to work ten times harder than any CEO that makes millions.

[Buffett and Colbert]

Socialis is just fine, but it should not be total. a completly scialist country would have it so that a garbage man would make the same amout as a a CEO in a major country. so we are not completly socialist but we are a little socialist and a little capitalist. no country is completly socialist or completly capitilist, it just does'nt exist

It would help if you learned how to spell "Socialist" correctly.

[Taeshan]

everyone being equaly as rich or poor no matter how hard or little they work.... it doesnt work!

Except for the fact being a hard worker does not mean you are rich. And people who argue against Socialism, always say that lazy, undeserving poor people would steal hard workers' money. This makes absolutely no sense. You do not have a choice to be poor, and those who are poor are more likely to work ten times harder than any CEO that makes millions.

Whats really bad is the people who work the hardest are the poorest. The people who dont do anything are the rich ones, and dont really work anymore.

[Pevisopolis]

everyone being equaly as rich or poor no matter how hard or little they work.... it doesnt work!

Except for the fact being a hard worker does not mean you are rich. And people who argue against Socialism, always say that lazy, undeserving poor people would steal hard workers' money. This makes absolutely no sense. You do not have a choice to be poor, and those who are poor are more likely to work ten times harder than any CEO that makes millions.

Exactly the point I made.

[Buffett and Colbert]

everyone being equaly as rich or poor no matter how hard or little they work.... it doesnt work!

Except for the fact being a hard worker does not mean you are rich. And people who argue against Socialism, always say that lazy, undeserving poor people would steal hard workers' money. This makes absolutely no sense. You do not have a choice to be poor, and those who are poor are more likely to work ten times harder than any CEO that makes millions.

Exactly the point I made.

Oh...

[Pevisopolis]

everyone being equaly as rich or poor no matter how hard or little they work.... it doesnt work!

Except for the fact being a hard worker does not mean you are rich. And people who argue against Socialism, always say that lazy, undeserving poor people would steal hard workers' money. This makes absolutely no sense. You do not have a choice to be poor, and those who are poor are more likely to work ten times harder than any CEO that makes millions.

Exactly the point I made.

Oh...

Meh, just shows we're in relative solidarity.

[RRichland]

I am tired of hearing that if we do this we will become socialists, if we do that we will become communists and if we do the other we will have a fascist state. Americans never adopt anything in total. Our genius is that we pick and choose the best parts of the concepts we run across and adapt them into a system that is uniquely our own. When we start believing that we have nothing to learn from others and that our systems cannot be improved we will lose the single most important concept that has gained worldwide admiration throughout our history.

[Jimanistan]

No more UnAmerican than Freedom Fries or breast implants.

[Taeshan]

No more UnAmerican than Freedom Fries or breast implants.

[CIB EMPIRE]

Its funny how all you guys want the government to own everything and controle you.

[SaintB]

Its funny how all you guys want the government to own everything and controle you.

That's not Socialism, that's Totalitarianism. Seriously, at least learn what your opposing!

[Buffett and Colbert]

Its funny how all you guys want the government to own everything and controle you.

It's also funny how you take such a condescending tone with us and yet cannot spell control.

[Unchecked Expansion]

Its funny how all you guys want the government to own everything and controle you.

Strangely, the actual idea of socialism is WE own everything. Marxs idea of socialism was that of collective ownership - the workers owning the means of production. Thats Socialism.

[Post-Unity Terra]

If we were meant to be Socialist then we would have been Socialist from the beginning. We have not been, so we were not meant to be. Socialism is a trap that doesn't work. It ruins economies, why would you want it, why should I want it .... nuff said!

Comes to mind: 'If God meant man to fly, he would have given him wings'.

Good and useful to DICTATORS maybe.

... I don't believe it. Did you just make the argument - through a converse fallacy of accident no less - that thanks to, I assume, the USSR under Stalinism, all socialist ideas are inherently the preserve of dictators?

I didn't know that all of the following European states were dictatorships: Austria, Cyprus, Estonia, Finland, Greece, Italy, Malta, Portugal, Spain, and the United Kingdom. All of the above states are led by firmly left-wing or socialist parties (see links), and all of them look perfectly democratic to me.

The Labour Party isn't socialist or left-wing any more, ever since that whole New Labour thing they've been sliding to the right. At this point they're the COnservative Party with a different badge and they occasionally sing The Red Flag.

[Pevisopolis]

Its funny how all you guys want the government to own everything and controle you.

Look at my flag.

Socialism =/= Totalitarianism. Sadly, many of its more famous incarnations have been authoritarian, though.

[Jimanistan]

Its funny how all you guys want the government to own everything and controle you.

Freedom is at the crux of socialist doctine, and most 'socialist' states that have thus far existed (I would say all, though there may be one or two I am not aware of) were or are nothing more than illigitimate, tin-pot dictatorships.

That aside, Lincoln seemed to believe that we had a government "of the People", and so if that is what you meant by "the government", then yes, I suppose you are correct. One of the few beliefs that are universal to all socialist doctrines is the belief that the Common People, rather than the Corporate Elite, should own and run the means of production.