Greek PM leaves future of the country to the people?

[Wallaby]

We have scheduled general elections in 3 weeks, in which the reigns of power will change hands. No but's about it. Even the ruling party's candidate admits it.

all did that, taking unpopular measures and sacrificing reelection in order to start recovery earlier.
but not in Greece, the PM is too hungry for power to think of his country's future

[Farnhamia]

We have scheduled general elections in 3 weeks, in which the reigns of power will change hands. No but's about it. Even the ruling party's candidate admits it.

all did that, taking unpopular measures and sacrificing reelection in order to start recovery earlier.
but not in Greece, the PM is too hungry for power to think of his country's future

Can you explain the rationale behind grabbing power in a country with a devastated economy and people rioting in the streets, who hate your guts? Wouldn't a would-be dictator want to make his country as fat and happy as possible? The more prosperous, the more money to be skimmed. The more peaceful, the fewer threats to your power.

[Greed and Death]

all did that, taking unpopular measures and sacrificing reelection in order to start recovery earlier.
but not in Greece, the PM is too hungry for power to think of his country's future

Can you explain the rationale behind grabbing power in a country with a devastated economy and people rioting in the streets, who hate your guts? Wouldn't a would-be dictator want to make his country as fat and happy as possible? The more prosperous, the more money to be skimmed. The more peaceful, the fewer threats to your power.

Two sides to every protest he could just as easily side with the reactionaries to take an power.

[Maurepas]

I'm all for letting the Greeks decide the future for themselves. That's democracy, I just wish our own government had that kind of integrity.

[Maurepas]

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/greek-prime-minister-scraps-plan-put-european-debt-deal-referendum-officials-article-1.971637

ATHENS, Greece — Ignoring increasing calls to step down, Greece's prime minister says he is seeking emergency talks with the opposition and warns that an early election would force Greece into leaving the euro currency.

Prime Minister George Papandreou made the comments in an emergency Cabinet meeting Thursday. His office released his speech to the ministers.

Papandreou sparked a crisis when he announced Monday he would put a European debt deal to a referendum in Greece. Two officials close to him say the referendum idea has now been scrapped, after the opposition indicated they backed the new bailout deal to cut Greece's debts.

So, Greece is no longer going through with its plans for a referendum on the subject of the Bailout. I, personally, find this to be of the utmost cowardice from the Greek Prime Minister to back down at this point. I had actually come to like him because of the move, had even expressed in the post above this one that I wished our government had the integrity to allow a vote on its worthless bailouts.

Today a sovereign people were denied the right to choose the future of their country. In response markets around the world reacted with massive jumps in profitability. If there is a more perfect image out there that represents the fact that the financial industry is the enemy of Democracy, that the people on Wall St. and elsewhere have a vested interest in keeping power from the people, I don't know what it is.

[Tubbsalot]

Well he did force the hand of the opposition so now they look like a bunch of twats (which they assuredly are), so that's something.

[Caninope]

all did that, taking unpopular measures and sacrificing reelection in order to start recovery earlier.
but not in Greece, the PM is too hungry for power to think of his country's future

Can you explain the rationale behind grabbing power in a country with a devastated economy and people rioting in the streets, who hate your guts? Wouldn't a would-be dictator want to make his country as fat and happy as possible? The more prosperous, the more money to be skimmed. The more peaceful, the fewer threats to your power.

Which is exactly why dictators usually have a higher standard of living for their people than their immediate successors. Or at least the good ones, anyways.

[Tahar Joblis]

Can you explain the rationale behind grabbing power in a country with a devastated economy and people rioting in the streets, who hate your guts? Wouldn't a would-be dictator want to make his country as fat and happy as possible? The more prosperous, the more money to be skimmed. The more peaceful, the fewer threats to your power.

Which is exactly why dictators usually have a higher standard of living for their people than their immediate successors. Or at least the good ones, anyways.

So that's why Stalin, a highly effective dictator who held onto power for thirty years made sure that everybody got enough food? (Follow the link. That statement is sarcastic enough to cut diamond.)

[Wallaby]

all did that, taking unpopular measures and sacrificing reelection in order to start recovery earlier.
but not in Greece, the PM is too hungry for power to think of his country's future

Can you explain the rationale behind grabbing power in a country with a devastated economy and people rioting in the streets, who hate your guts? Wouldn't a would-be dictator want to make his country as fat and happy as possible? The more prosperous, the more money to be skimmed. The more peaceful, the fewer threats to your power.

no, I can't give you any rational explanation, Papandreous is completely off the very concept of rationality.

a person that continuously keeps sinking his own country and, despite that, asks for a Motion of Confidence from the Parliament( in two occasions), while people from his own Party turn their backs on him is simply too weird to try to reason.

[New Conglomerate]

Which is exactly why dictators usually have a higher standard of living for their people than their immediate successors. Or at least the good ones, anyways.

So that's why Stalin, a highly effective dictator who held onto power for thirty years made sure that everybody got enough food? (Follow the link. That statement is sarcastic enough to cut diamond.)

Stalin, like Hitler, is not a typical example.

[Thurask]

It looks like Papandreou won the confidence vote...

[Neu Leonstein]

And where is Argentina now? They're doing fine these days. What's different about Greece? In the long term, isn't it better to take a sharp pain now (hitting the giant "Rocks fall, everybody dies" button) than be permanently indebted and required to engage in severe economically depressive austerity measures for the next decade or two?

Argentina's debt problem was less severe than Greece's. And it is basically helped by high commodity prices - Greece wouldn't be.

And to boot, Argentina has raided its pension funds to pay for election promises and has inflation through the roof and throws economists in jail for inflation estimates that don't match the official ones that everyone knows are fudged. I actually think Greece would be prone to a lot of the same kind of craziness.

[Tahar Joblis]

So that's why Stalin, a highly effective dictator who held onto power for thirty years made sure that everybody got enough food? (Follow the link. That statement is sarcastic enough to cut diamond.)

Stalin, like Hitler, is not a typical example.

Stalin. Hitler. Mao. Pol Pot.

...heck, even Mussolini's trains didn't actually run on time. And while the United States recovered from the Great Depression in a timely fashion, surpassing its old GDP in chained dollars before entry into WWII, the Italian economy underperformed under Mussolini, and after the crash hit Italy, didn't recover its old GDP level until after WWII was over. (Wow!)

Dictators are generally less, not more, accountable to the population than elected leaders are. Sure, I'll buy that there are some relatively benevolent dictators, and that some dictators are willing to invest in bread and circuses - but even then, it's usually only bread and circuses for a certain segment of the population, the one he's worrying about mobilizing against him. (In the original "bread and circuses" case, Rome's literal bread and circuses, that was the citizens living in Rome itself for the most part, rather than subjects living in outlying territories.)

[Rio Cana]

And where is Argentina now? They're doing fine these days. What's different about Greece? In the long term, isn't it better to take a sharp pain now (hitting the giant "Rocks fall, everybody dies" button) than be permanently indebted and required to engage in severe economically depressive austerity measures for the next decade or two?

Argentina's debt problem was less severe than Greece's. And it is basically helped by high commodity prices - Greece wouldn't be.

And to boot, Argentina has raided its pension funds to pay for election promises and has inflation through the roof and throws economists in jail for inflation estimates that don't match the official ones that everyone knows are fudged. I actually think Greece would be prone to a lot of the same kind of craziness.

They say there is oil and plenty of Gas in the Sea South of the Greek island of Crete. So following Argentinas example might prove beneficial.

[Neu Leonstein]

They say there is oil and plenty of Gas in the Sea South of the Greek island of Crete. So following Argentinas example might prove beneficial.

Source?

[AiliailiA]

They say there is oil and plenty of Gas in the Sea South of the Greek island of Crete. So following Argentinas example might prove beneficial.

Source?

I think it's a joke.

"Argentinas example" means invading the Falkland Islands. As far as I can tell the oil and gas "South of Crete" is not in Greek waters ... joke might have worked better with "the Greek island of Cyprus" instead.

[Rationallia]

Burn them all!

[Megapolitania]

And where is Argentina now? They're doing fine these days. What's different about Greece? In the long term, isn't it better to take a sharp pain now (hitting the giant "Rocks fall, everybody dies" button) than be permanently indebted and required to engage in severe economically depressive austerity measures for the next decade or two?

Argentina's debt problem was less severe than Greece's. And it is basically helped by high commodity prices - Greece wouldn't be.

And to boot, Argentina has raided its pension funds to pay for election promises and has inflation through the roof and throws economists in jail for inflation estimates that don't match the official ones that everyone knows are fudged. I actually think Greece would be prone to a lot of the same kind of craziness.

Argentina also has the benefit of being able to print its own currency. Plus Greece actually is a developed country, or pretends to be...I wouldn't be shocked by a military coup. Argentines rioted, but they've been used to stagnancy and economic mismanagement since the Great Depression. A sudden downfall when you're that high up is a big shock to the social system.

[AiliailiA]

It looks like Papandreou won the confidence vote...

Good.

Although the Greek public has strongly resisted the austerity measures, a recent opinion poll in a newspaper showed 70% wanted to remain within the eurozone.

That's a bucket of shit for any leader to be in. A coalition government (unavoidable after the election which a no-confidence vote would have precipitated) would not handle it any better.

A referendum is the best way. It probably won't go the way I'd want (I'm pro-EU) but when a country is so divided they need to settle this by majority vote on just that one issue.