Engaging in separatist feminism

[Femnipotent]

...

i dont think its enough to ignore men. you have to live with women. people arent meant to live in isolation.

I completely agree. I have two female roommates. As I mentioned, my job is with only female clients and all my coworkers are female. That means for the bulk of the day each work day, I am surrounded only by women.

I am seeking ways to have more social contact in women-only spaces as well to maximise the feminine influence in my life. I think what I am going to have the most trouble with is "all the time inbetween" just getting groceries for example, or accessing services in places that are not woman-only. It is my hope that I can weed out those spaces by substituting women-only spaces eventually.

What I have not figured out is whether I am going to get off the internet entirely, find a women-only forum, or stay 'in touch' somewhat through NSG. Not sure.

[Dabtoria]

I can't fathom why you'd get so much abuse for being vegan; it's only a change in your diet!

So do you believe that a society with separation between men and women is a good idea? Because you must admit, the two don't function very well apart.

[Farnhamia]

I can't fathom why you'd get so much abuse for being vegan; it's only a change in your diet!

So do you believe that a society with separation between men and women is a good idea? Because you must admit, the two don't function very well apart.

Indeed. Can you imagine what a mess the male half of the world would be without us to clean up after them?

[Forster Keys]

I can't fathom why you'd get so much abuse for being vegan; it's only a change in your diet!

So do you believe that a society with separation between men and women is a good idea? Because you must admit, the two don't function very well apart.

I know plenty of vegans, hardly any of them are abused for it. Maybe an idle jab every now and then, but it's fairly socially acceptable.

[Seibertron]

Misandry(a wrong) is not the answer(A right) to Misogny(A wrong)

[Femnipotent]

Don't you think you're stereotyping an entire gender? Personally, as a male, I wouldn't care whether or not you shaved your legs, but what's to say that some women won't be offended by it?

It is not about stereotypes, but rather cutting out as many stereotypes about women (as I am a woman) as possible from my life.

Of course there are going to be women I interact with who hold onto stereotypes about women that men have impressed upon them. I want the space to explore those things without the aggression and badgering of men.

[Forster Keys]

I can't fathom why you'd get so much abuse for being vegan; it's only a change in your diet!

So do you believe that a society with separation between men and women is a good idea? Because you must admit, the two don't function very well apart.

Indeed. Can you imagine what a mess the male half of the world would be without us to clean up after them?

Someones needs to mention sandwiches around this point...

[Forster Keys]

Don't you think you're stereotyping an entire gender? Personally, as a male, I wouldn't care whether or not you shaved your legs, but what's to say that some women won't be offended by it?

It is not about stereotypes, but rather cutting out as many stereotypes about women (as I am a woman) as possible from my life.

Of course there are going to be women I interact with who hold onto stereotypes about women that men have impressed upon them. I want the space to explore those things without the aggression and badgering of men.

These two statements seems to contradict one another. Sorry if I have misread them.

[Tubbsalot]

If she's trolling, Tubbs, go report her. The first two examples are a bit flamey, but this thread is hardly trolling.

I'm not inclined to report trolling in the first place - hardly the most grievous sin - and it's apparent that most people disagree with my assessment. In that light, I'm the one being disruptive here. Not exactly what I intended.

You will have a very difficult time engaging in separatist feminism. The rest of the feminist movement has tended to grow up and follow a path towards theoretical sophistication. Simplistic division of the world into two sex tribes in which each has a distinct and universal separate culture and way of thinking is an extreme essentializing move to which sensible modern feminists would facepalm in response. Obsolescence. You might as well shut yourself up in a cave and only permit yourself to use items crafted from stone.

Very nice. Very similar in fact to the insults hurled at me for becoming a Vegan, actually. All sorts of taunts about how I should go live in the woods and eat berries and such.

Cool and all, but DI is absolutely correct - the differences you're identifying are culturally-based, not gender-based. Males and females will exhibit the same pressures on you, because they're part of the same culture. It's like lining up a school's students and identifying every second one as a terrorist, while claiming the others are perfectly fine. It's baseless and absurd.

[Erinkita]

I was hoping I was mistaken.

Well, it's one of the silliest ideas I've ever heard. Sorry. I have no insight on how to accomplish this, nor would I feel like sharing it if I did. If it's what you want, go ahead, but I can't conscionably provide support to something I find both ridiculous and distasteful.

There are many communities of people who separate themselves from others. I mentioned Orthodox Jews as an example, but there are also Hutterites, Mennonites, and various politically-aligned folks who get together in communes away from forces they wish to live apart from.

So my question is simple and straight-forward. Do you think all of these people are engaging in silliness, or is your scorn reserved only for a feminist who wishes to do something similar? If it's the former, then we simply share no common ground to continue a discussion on, and if it's the latter, well then a deep prejudice has been revealed.

I had to look up the latter two, and yes, I believe that the isolationist behaviour of all three of these groups is counter-productive to healthy social development and, in the case of children raised in such environments, morally unjustifiable.

[Femnipotent]

If she's trolling, Tubbs, go report her. The first two examples are a bit flamey, but this thread is hardly trolling.

I'm more than a little appalled at the lack of reading comprehension on display here. Femnipotent's posts are quite clear. She wants to remove as much direct influence of and contact with men as she can, to help her clarify her thoughts on feminism, specifically on separatist feminism. It's not meant to benefit anyone but her. I see it as a kind of spiritual and political fasting.

Femnipotent, I don't know what to tell you on the practical side. In a big city, it's going to be tough to banish all male influence from your day-to-day existence. You'll have to do without a lot of books, magazines, television, music, the internet ... I can manage that for six hours, maybe, by being asleep, but six months? But good luck, seriously. If you decide to come back, I'll be interested to hear how it went.

I...thank you. Sometimes I get the feeling that I am speaking another language that people either cannot, or deliberately refuse to understand.

I've gone without much television for a long time as it is. Neither of my roommates are tv watchers and our music is all on CD so we don't get the radio chatter. I'm not sure I can just cut out the internet cold turkey however. I think I may have to cut down my time on it bit by bit as I go.

I look at it as a really good and focused opportunity to explore feminist writings, and female-only spaces to see and I mean REALLY see what kinds of dynamics are at play and what impact this has on my own self-perception and my beliefs about gender.

[Ashmoria]

...

i dont think its enough to ignore men. you have to live with women. people arent meant to live in isolation.

I completely agree. I have two female roommates. As I mentioned, my job is with only female clients and all my coworkers are female. That means for the bulk of the day each work day, I am surrounded only by women.

I am seeking ways to have more social contact in women-only spaces as well to maximise the feminine influence in my life. I think what I am going to have the most trouble with is "all the time inbetween" just getting groceries for example, or accessing services in places that are not woman-only. It is my hope that I can weed out those spaces by substituting women-only spaces eventually.

What I have not figured out is whether I am going to get off the internet entirely, find a women-only forum, or stay 'in touch' somewhat through NSG. Not sure.

when i was in college....30 years ago...radical feminism and feminist seperatism were "popular" concepts. there were groups you could join and places you could go to live that were female only. ....places other than convents....

are there still radical feminist groups out there?

who you associate with while you are on sabbatical from male influence would make a very big difference in how it turns out for you. hanging out with women who worry about how attractive they are to men and talk about their relationships with men isnt going to be particularly beneficial to your quest.

[Jakaragua]

How does radical feminism offer an open way forward in terms of gender equality? It seems to me that pigeonholing yourself into a specific group is sometimes more about wanting just to define yourself, versus reaching the best responses/answers to questions facing feminists.

[Forster Keys]

If she's trolling, Tubbs, go report her. The first two examples are a bit flamey, but this thread is hardly trolling.

I'm not inclined to report trolling in the first place - hardly the most grievous sin - and it's apparent that most people disagree with my assessment. In that light, I'm the one being disruptive here. Not exactly what I intended.

Very nice. Very similar in fact to the insults hurled at me for becoming a Vegan, actually. All sorts of taunts about how I should go live in the woods and eat berries and such.

Cool and all, but DI is absolutely correct - the differences you're identifying are culturally-based, not gender-based. Males and females will exhibit the same pressures on you, because they're part of the same culture. It's like lining up a school's students and identifying every second one as a terrorist, while claiming the others are perfectly fine. It's baseless and absurd.

Exactly. Not every male is masculine, not every female is feminine. Each individual has differing traits to differing degrees.

[Dumb Ideologies]

It is not about stereotypes, but rather cutting out as many stereotypes about women (as I am a woman) as possible from my life.

Of course there are going to be women I interact with who hold onto stereotypes about women that men have impressed upon them. I want the space to explore those things without the aggression and badgering of men.

These two statements seems to contradict one another. Sorry if I have misread them.

Stereotyping women is wrong. But men are a homogeneous, aggressive group who unthinkingly accept and enact the oppression of women.

[Seibertron]

Maybe you should try and fix women's rights in places like Saudi Arabia rather then isolating yourself and doing nothing.

[Realisim]

Don't you think you're stereotyping an entire gender? Personally, as a male, I wouldn't care whether or not you shaved your legs, but what's to say that some women won't be offended by it?

It is not about stereotypes, but rather cutting out as many stereotypes about women (as I am a woman) as possible from my life.

Of course there are going to be women I interact with who hold onto stereotypes about women that men have impressed upon them. I want the space to explore those things without the aggression and badgering of men.

Noting your almost surreal experience with veganisim, could it be that you are being oversensitive or in this case even looking for criticism?

[Femnipotent]

I can't fathom why you'd get so much abuse for being vegan; it's only a change in your diet!

So do you believe that a society with separation between men and women is a good idea? Because you must admit, the two don't function very well apart.

Well it isn't just a change in diet. I also had to become more aware of the non-food products I was purchasing. Also, there are animal products in so many food products that most people are not even aware of, and when you say things like, "was that made with white sugar" when someone offers you a supposedly "Vegan" muffin, they often get very huffy with you because they weren't aware of how it was refined.

As for the claim that men and women don't function well apart, well on what basis do you make that claim? Where do men and women live apart that you have had the opportunity to see such fail? I sure have not encountered anything of the sort before to make a judgment.

[Realisim]

These two statements seems to contradict one another. Sorry if I have misread them.

Stereotyping women is wrong. But men are a homogeneous, aggressive group who unthinkingly accept and enact the oppression of women.

[Ashmoria]

How does radical feminism offer an open way forward in terms of gender equality? It seems to me that pigeonholing yourself into a specific group is sometimes more about wanting just to define yourself, versus reaching the best responses/answers to questions facing feminists.

in theory it would help her SEE the way forward. to see what is real and what is being forced on her by society.

[Forster Keys]

These two statements seems to contradict one another. Sorry if I have misread them.

Stereotyping women is wrong. But men are a homogeneous, aggressive group who unthinkingly accept and enact the oppression of women.

Let me get my club. I need to threaten my woman into making me a sandwich.

[Femnipotent]

Misandry(a wrong) is not the answer(A right) to Misogny(A wrong)

Assuming I hate men because I want to experience life without their constant influence is a wrong.

[Forster Keys]

Stereotyping women is wrong. But men are a homogeneous, aggressive group who unthinkingly accept and enact the oppression of women.

It's sarcasm lad.

[Farnhamia]

How does radical feminism offer an open way forward in terms of gender equality? It seems to me that pigeonholing yourself into a specific group is sometimes more about wanting just to define yourself, versus reaching the best responses/answers to questions facing feminists.

It's an exploration. Sometimes you find what you're looking for and sometimes you don't. Given Femni's looking for clarification, the expedition should be fruitful one way or another.

[Realisim]

It's sarcasm lad.

Got it... we are on he same page then