Engaging in separatist feminism

[Femnipotent]

A few years ago I became a Vegan because of my opposition to unsustainable and gluttonous food production practices. My choice truly seemed to anger a lot of people, my family, some of my friends, even random strangers who would learn that I was Vegan. I was accused of every possible thing under the sun, and the most bizarre accusations were hurled my way. It became very clear that it is alright to have opinions about the way that we eat and the way that our food is produced, but that it is somehow not okay to act on those opinions.

I bring this up because what I am about to say will probably make me even more hated and attacked than being a Vegan, but I have been lurking here for a while before I got the courage to start up a nation, and although NSG is not a 'safe space' really, neither is it as vicious and vile as other online communities.

I have started this thread to discuss separatist feminism. Even within this radical portion of feminism there are different kinds, so more specifically, I wanted to discuss practical aspects of becoming a separatist.

I want to say that I am not completely sold on separatist feminism. However for at least a year now I have been considering ways to shift my own perception and allow myself the space necessary to really figure out how I want to manifest and live my feminism. In order to do this, I want to (as much as is possible) remove or avoid male influence and males in particular for the next six months in order to see if this clarifies things for me.

I have no doubt this thread will soon fill with vitriol and ridicule. For those of you who do not participate in such pointless behaviour, I would very much like to discuss the logistics of such an experiment. I do not have the money to live in a female-only community somewhere, nor can I move out of the city, or quit my job and schooling. I have some ideas of how I can limit exposure and contact, but of course it will not be completely possible to cut men out of my life 100% for an entire six months.



tl;dr: I wish to live as a separatist feminist for a period of six months in order to clarify my feminism as much as possible removed from male influence, and am looking for practical suggestions on how this can be accomplished.

[Forster Keys]

What's so wrong with us guys?

[Ashmoria]

HOW will you do feminist seperatism?

exactly what do you intend to do?

[Jakaragua]

Wait, this sounds more like isolation than separatism. I'd rather have a feminism that's concerned making changes to existing society in order to establish a more equal ground rather than isolating yourself from it.

[Erinkita]

IIRC, separatist feminism is the notion that women, and only women, can contribute to the cause of gender equality, because any attempt men make to solve the inequalities that exist will be inherently flawed because men are doing it. And to correct this, women should isolate themselves from men and live in female-only communities. Is this an accurate description?

[Meldaria]

Wait, this sounds more like isolation than separatism. I'd rather have a feminism that's concerned making changes to existing society in order to establish a more equal ground rather than isolating yourself from it.

^This

[Tubbsalot]

Yawn. Shitty troll is shitty - even if you weren't so bad at it, you wouldn't elicit much of a reaction anyway.

FYI, to succeed as a troll, you need to be vaguely believable.

[Meldaria]

Yawn. Shitty troll is shitty - even if you weren't so bad at it, you wouldn't elicit much of a reaction anyway.

FYI, to succeed as a troll, you need to be vaguely believable.

She's not trolling you sod.

[Femnipotent]

HOW will you do feminist seperatism?

exactly what do you intend to do?

Thanks for asking, I did not want to make the first post a huge, rambling novel that absolutely no one would read.

I want to be as physically removed from men and male influence as possible. However, I live in a large city and do not have the means to actually truly physically isolate myself, so I have to find other means.

There is a very large Orthodox Jewish community here and while they live among non-Jews, they manage to 'avoid' them very well. Orthodox Jewish men are not allowed, for example, to speak to or even look at non-Jewish women. So when you walk by them on the street, they merely ignore your presence. I have no doubt that after a lifetime of practice, they literally do not even take note of your presence anymore. This is one skill I wish to cultivate to help me when I am outside my home and unable to physically avoid men.

My job is fine, because I work only with women and female clients, so that is a good space for me.

To further avoid male influence, I have already given my television to a friend and I do not consume print media anyway so that should be easy.

I am looking now for more suggestions as to how I can accomplish this.

[Forster Keys]

HOW will you do feminist seperatism?

exactly what do you intend to do?

Thanks for asking, I did not want to make the first post a huge, rambling novel that absolutely no one would read.

I want to be as physically removed from men and male influence as possible. However, I live in a large city and do not have the means to actually truly physically isolate myself, so I have to find other means.

There is a very large Orthodox Jewish community here and while they live among non-Jews, they manage to 'avoid' them very well. Orthodox Jewish men are not allowed, for example, to speak to or even look at non-Jewish women. So when you walk by them on the street, they merely ignore your presence. I have no doubt that after a lifetime of practice, they literally do not even take note of your presence anymore. This is one skill I wish to cultivate to help me when I am outside my home and unable to physically avoid men.

My job is fine, because I work only with women and female clients, so that is a good space for me.

To further avoid male influence, I have already given my television to a friend and I do not consume print media anyway so that should be easy.

I am looking now for more suggestions as to how I can accomplish this.

But why?

[Realisim]

HOW will you do feminist seperatism?

exactly what do you intend to do?

Thanks for asking, I did not want to make the first post a huge, rambling novel that absolutely no one would read.

I want to be as physically removed from men and male influence as possible. However, I live in a large city and do not have the means to actually truly physically isolate myself, so I have to find other means.

There is a very large Orthodox Jewish community here and while they live among non-Jews, they manage to 'avoid' them very well. Orthodox Jewish men are not allowed, for example, to speak to or even look at non-Jewish women. So when you walk by them on the street, they merely ignore your presence. I have no doubt that after a lifetime of practice, they literally do not even take note of your presence anymore. This is one skill I wish to cultivate to help me when I am outside my home and unable to physically avoid men.

My job is fine, because I work only with women and female clients, so that is a good space for me.

To further avoid male influence, I have already given my television to a friend and I do not consume print media anyway so that should be easy.

I am looking now for more suggestions as to how I can accomplish this.

Just how does this benefit anyone....

[Meldaria]

HOW will you do feminist seperatism?

exactly what do you intend to do?

Thanks for asking, I did not want to make the first post a huge, rambling novel that absolutely no one would read.

I want to be as physically removed from men and male influence as possible. However, I live in a large city and do not have the means to actually truly physically isolate myself, so I have to find other means.

There is a very large Orthodox Jewish community here and while they live among non-Jews, they manage to 'avoid' them very well. Orthodox Jewish men are not allowed, for example, to speak to or even look at non-Jewish women. So when you walk by them on the street, they merely ignore your presence. I have no doubt that after a lifetime of practice, they literally do not even take note of your presence anymore. This is one skill I wish to cultivate to help me when I am outside my home and unable to physically avoid men.

My job is fine, because I work only with women and female clients, so that is a good space for me.

To further avoid male influence, I have already given my television to a friend and I do not consume print media anyway so that should be easy.

I am looking now for more suggestions as to how I can accomplish this.

I think what people are mostly getting at is why do you wish to accomplish this?

[Femnipotent]

Wait, this sounds more like isolation than separatism. I'd rather have a feminism that's concerned making changes to existing society in order to establish a more equal ground rather than isolating yourself from it.

Isolation, separation, either fits but the term 'separatism' is associated with an ideological branch of feminism that I wish to explore. In essence, it holds that men cannot contribute to feminism positively because they are too caught up in the power structures of maleness. My motivation for embarking on this exploration is to see if my life and my own personal feminism are altered by the removal of as much direct male influence as possible. In short, I want space and time away from men and male socio-political structures so that I can explore what it means to me to be a feminist.

I am very disillusioned with the idea of 'change from the inside' particularly when dealing with such a profoundly powerful and broad issue as sexism.

[Femnipotent]

IIRC, separatist feminism is the notion that women, and only women, can contribute to the cause of gender equality, because any attempt men make to solve the inequalities that exist will be inherently flawed because men are doing it. And to correct this, women should isolate themselves from men and live in female-only communities. Is this an accurate description?

That is the particular kind of separatist feminism I wish to engage in as much as possible, yes. It is not the only kind of separatist feminism however.

[Galloism]

I do not understand the reasons behind this.

Do what you want and all, but I'm genuinely curious as to the rationale.

[Tubbsalot]

She's not trolling you sod.

"I feel we should ban marriage entirely. No matter how enlightened you believe yourself to be, both heterosexual and homosexual marriage is a symbol of male oppression."
"[Gender-swap day] sounds like a pathetic farce really. All it does is further shore up patriarchal notions of gender roles by mocking that which is 'feminine' and glorifying that which is 'male'."
"I want to (as much as is possible) remove or avoid male influence and males in particular"

In the unlikely event that this isn't a troll, my post doubles as a , so I'm not hugely worried.

[Erinkita]

IIRC, separatist feminism is the notion that women, and only women, can contribute to the cause of gender equality, because any attempt men make to solve the inequalities that exist will be inherently flawed because men are doing it. And to correct this, women should isolate themselves from men and live in female-only communities. Is this an accurate description?

That is the particular kind of separatist feminism I wish to engage in as much as possible, yes. It is not the only kind of separatist feminism however.

I was hoping I was mistaken.

Well, it's one of the silliest ideas I've ever heard. Sorry. I have no insight on how to accomplish this, nor would I feel like sharing it if I did. If it's what you want, go ahead, but I can't conscionably provide support to something I find both ridiculous and distasteful.

[Femnipotent]

But why?

For many reasons.

I want to know who am I as a person and as a woman, when I am not constantly bombarded by male pressure to conform to a certain role. So much of what we do as people is based on other people's expectations, and I think much of our teen and adult lives are spent exploring how much of what we do is a free choice, and how much was just implanted. I do not believe I can engage in this exploration in my current surroundings.

I want to know things like, do I actually want to shave or not shave my legs? Do I love my body more or less if there are no men to tell me how to feel about myself, or to present myself to? What do I want to accomplish with my feminism? Will I like being a separatist and will I then do what is necessary to deepen this commitment? Will I hate it, and if so what will I come out of it knowing?

To me this is a more serious and important lifestyle change than Veganism has been, and while it is daunting, I am up for the challenge because I think it is important to try.

[Dumb Ideologies]

You will have a very difficult time engaging in separatist feminism. The rest of the feminist movement has tended to grow up and follow a path towards theoretical sophistication. Simplistic division of the world into two sex tribes in which each has a distinct and universal separate culture and way of thinking is an extreme essentializing move to which sensible modern feminists would facepalm in response. Obsolescence. You might as well shut yourself up in a cave and only permit yourself to use items crafted from stone.

[Femnipotent]

Just how does this benefit anyone....

How do you benefit anyone?

I think this will benefit me. It will help me become a feminist who is clearer in her beliefs and goals so that I can more effectively promote feminism. That is my goal.

[Ashmoria]

HOW will you do feminist seperatism?

exactly what do you intend to do?

Thanks for asking, I did not want to make the first post a huge, rambling novel that absolutely no one would read.

I want to be as physically removed from men and male influence as possible. However, I live in a large city and do not have the means to actually truly physically isolate myself, so I have to find other means.

There is a very large Orthodox Jewish community here and while they live among non-Jews, they manage to 'avoid' them very well. Orthodox Jewish men are not allowed, for example, to speak to or even look at non-Jewish women. So when you walk by them on the street, they merely ignore your presence. I have no doubt that after a lifetime of practice, they literally do not even take note of your presence anymore. This is one skill I wish to cultivate to help me when I am outside my home and unable to physically avoid men.

My job is fine, because I work only with women and female clients, so that is a good space for me.

To further avoid male influence, I have already given my television to a friend and I do not consume print media anyway so that should be easy.

I am looking now for more suggestions as to how I can accomplish this.

...

i dont think its enough to ignore men. you have to live with women. people arent meant to live in isolation.

[Realisim]

To each their own....
My life would be almost meaningless without my wife.

[Femnipotent]

I was hoping I was mistaken.

Well, it's one of the silliest ideas I've ever heard. Sorry. I have no insight on how to accomplish this, nor would I feel like sharing it if I did. If it's what you want, go ahead, but I can't conscionably provide support to something I find both ridiculous and distasteful.

There are many communities of people who separate themselves from others. I mentioned Orthodox Jews as an example, but there are also Hutterites, Mennonites, and various politically-aligned folks who get together in communes away from forces they wish to live apart from.

So my question is simple and straight-forward. Do you think all of these people are engaging in silliness, or is your scorn reserved only for a feminist who wishes to do something similar? If it's the former, then we simply share no common ground to continue a discussion on, and if it's the latter, well then a deep prejudice has been revealed.

[Galloism]

But why?

For many reasons.

I want to know who am I as a person and as a woman, when I am not constantly bombarded by male pressure to conform to a certain role. So much of what we do as people is based on other people's expectations, and I think much of our teen and adult lives are spent exploring how much of what we do is a free choice, and how much was just implanted. I do not believe I can engage in this exploration in my current surroundings.

I want to know things like, do I actually want to shave or not shave my legs? Do I love my body more or less if there are no men to tell me how to feel about myself, or to present myself to? What do I want to accomplish with my feminism? Will I like being a separatist and will I then do what is necessary to deepen this commitment? Will I hate it, and if so what will I come out of it knowing?

To me this is a more serious and important lifestyle change than Veganism has been, and while it is daunting, I am up for the challenge because I think it is important to try.

What about antifeminist women?

They're more common than you think. In my experience, (for what that's worth) they're more common than antifeminist men.

[Forster Keys]

But why?

For many reasons.

I want to know who am I as a person and as a woman, when I am not constantly bombarded by male pressure to conform to a certain role. So much of what we do as people is based on other people's expectations, and I think much of our teen and adult lives are spent exploring how much of what we do is a free choice, and how much was just implanted. I do not believe I can engage in this exploration in my current surroundings.

I want to know things like, do I actually want to shave or not shave my legs? Do I love my body more or less if there are no men to tell me how to feel about myself, or to present myself to? What do I want to accomplish with my feminism? Will I like being a separatist and will I then do what is necessary to deepen this commitment? Will I hate it, and if so what will I come out of it knowing?

To me this is a more serious and important lifestyle change than Veganism has been, and while it is daunting, I am up for the challenge because I think it is important to try.

You do whatever you feel is best, but personally I really don't think its solely males who do this sort of behaviour. In my experience women pressure people each other to conform to certain social norms as much as men do. Fundamentally, being part of a society has pros and cons, some of those cons are the sacrifice of parts of your individuality and freedom, you've got to weight up the balance and make a choice. If I were you I'd simply become a hermit or at least try and remove the judgemental and/or prejuidiced from your life rather than isolating yourself from all males.