May 16, 1986 Machine Gun Owner's Protection Act

[L3 Communications]

yeah I know how that is. I leave my guns lying around and unsecured by accident all the time, especially on the ground

Does the US have the same requirements for secure storage for firearms as the UK does? I think we require something along the lines of a steel cabinet with a huge padlock at the least. (Could be wrong though)

Not at all.

The US has no storage requirements at all, unless you're a dealer.

[Gun Manufacturers]

That isn't true. Full auto/select fire weapons are great investments as well, since there are a finite amount of such transferable weapons.




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ee1RjQGBHoc

Apparently, you can shoot off whatever you want to at the range, from machine pistols to mini-guns.

If it's manufactured before the ban, it can be legally owned and fired, as for post bans, you can have one but you can only have it either as a demo meaning you can have ppl pay to try it out, on your gun range, or you can get it as a dealer sample meaning you can fire it and keep it until a law enforcement guy comes in and shows interest in buying it to be used when on duty, but you can't sell it to civvies and if you don't sell it soon, youll have to either sell it to a licensed gun shop owner (class 3 dealers only) or if no dealer shows interest in buying it off you, you have to turn it in to the authorities where the ATF will destroy the weapon.

Pre-ban and post-ban refer to weapons that are affected by an AWB (either the now defunct Federal ban, or the state level ban several states have). My post-ban AR15 has a ban compliant upper, because CT has a state level AWB. Post '86 dealer samples CANNOT be owned by civilians.

[Gun Manufacturers]

Does the US have the same requirements for secure storage for firearms as the UK does? I think we require something along the lines of a steel cabinet with a huge padlock at the least. (Could be wrong though)

Not at all.

The US has no storage requirements at all, unless you're a dealer.

Not at the federal level, but some states (like CT) do have legal requirements to safely store firearms around children.

[Chernoslavia]

If it's manufactured before the ban, it can be legally owned and fired, as for post bans, you can have one but you can only have it either as a demo meaning you can have ppl pay to try it out, on your gun range, or you can get it as a dealer sample meaning you can fire it and keep it until a law enforcement guy comes in and shows interest in buying it to be used when on duty, but you can't sell it to civvies and if you don't sell it soon, youll have to either sell it to a licensed gun shop owner (class 3 dealers only) or if no dealer shows interest in buying it off you, you have to turn it in to the authorities where the ATF will destroy the weapon.

Pre-ban and post-ban refer to weapons that are affected by an AWB (either the now defunct Federal ban, or the state level ban several states have). My post-ban AR15 has a ban compliant upper, because CT has a state level AWB. Post '86 dealer samples CANNOT be owned by civilians.

I didnt say they can be owned by civilians I said that a civilian class 3 dealer can sell them to military or law enforcement ONLY and he/she can fire it on the shooting range until someone buys it off them or he/she must sell it to another authorized class 3 dealer or turn it in to the law to be destroyed.

[Chernoslavia]

you said ''backyard'' and added the word ''people'' in this case ofcourse im going to kill people invading MY property, and if theyre carrying guns Id go for my AK47, but you probrably meant it in general, and I fire my AK47 at the shooting range not the backyard, unless if I were to live in a farm in the countryside. And if theres people walking in the way and get mauled down its the're dumb-self that decided to take a stroll in front of a shooting range.

How do you know if this person legally obtained one, maybe he didnt and just found someone that can smuggle it in. But, I like how you used the word ''Machine gun'' in its true meaning, unlike pollies ( politicians) who think a small full auto pistol is considered an MG when technically its still a HAND-GUN regardless for its action, ill give you that.

1.- People invading your property unarmed. OK, first thing, if said people are not armed and/or not engaging in any kind of criminal activity, take an advise. don't shoot them. Btter that way. I'd go as far as to say that if they aren't doing anything not life threatening to anyone, don't shoot them. But let's say that don't shoot them if they are just "invading your property".What country do you live in? If someone is trying to invade my home as in I tell them to fuck off, they dont leave and instead unholster their weapons, I can legally kill them off with my ak47 in full-auto. And even if its illegal I will still do it, its better breaking the law than dying and the only people ill be putting in danger are the invaders. And note that my backyard has wooden fences so theres no reason for anyone to be in my property. but yes, i wont kill them if they dont seem life threatening but i can legally choose to, if you dont think thats true then try pulling that stunt off an armed person[/color]

2.- Let's say said people, however are engagin in criminal activity, or are armed and also a life threat to you or the other inhabitants of your house. I think you can hold your own with a shotgun, given you are inside your house. Or with a regular pistol or handgun. After all, you are inside a house, you are in fmailiar ground, and actually you would only have to wait until teh police arrive.Frankly, even in really bad criminal hellholes, (I have lived there), a shot or two easily scares off most criminals, even when armed. You see, they aren't usually out just to kill people at their homes, they look for unarmed and easily subdued targets. (Actually, they look for empty houses and unopposed and easy hits, but let's say it is not always that way). So you can defend yourself with a pistol. I think your mistaking me for an amature, when its indoors ofcourse im not going to use a long barreled machine gun, im going to use a weapon suited for close quarters combat like a shotgun or a pistol of any action. I will kill only if I personally think I should got it? only if I have to.

3.- Do you know why individual auto fire was invented? Two reasons. First, to force a large number of "enemies" to look for cover, or to reap them if they remain in open ground. No matter what, you won't face a large number of enemies in open ground at your house. At least not large as in military criteria of large. So you won't need autofire in house defense. Second, it was supposed to offer an individual soldier some supression capability so he could displace through a battlefield. You don't need to get into offense while DEFENDING your house. Im not expecting an army of street hoodlums, but hey, now that you mention it you never know, I know its very unlikely but I have a right to use an ak47 to kill a tresspasser as long as the invader posses a threat, he doesnt have to posses a threat but if he does thats when i put as much lead in him as I want until he stops breathing and that is legal. I dont care if its full auto i can legally do it with a machine gun.

4.- What you need as the proper weapon for defense in urban or suburban areas is something called DIRECT DEFENSIVE SHOT. It's the proper manouver to be used by a civilian in self defense. When I got my gun, I got an extensive course covering it, hsowing us why we would never ever go into offensive mode against a criminal. And full auto individual weapons are indeed for exactly doing that. So, your own tool would be misleading into a situation where you can put your own life and the life of others at risk. Why should a goverment let you own that kind of thing for cheap? By the way, I moved to a country where I am not allowed to own a gun, and I am fucking happy about it, because there are not armed honchos around neither. And...exactly what country is that?

5.- Wanna fire an AK 47 at your local range? Get a pair of gun-ho guys like you, put some money from each pocket, buy an old AK 47 for all of you, keep it inside the range, and go once a week to fire it inside the safe boundaries of said range. Sopend money in ammo if you like, I guess 7.62 is not cheap. I guess it won't be that expensive if you buy it by several people.

Please check your grammer.

Ammo is cheap from where I live, and theres several different kinds of 7.62mm ammo, like the one I use for my AK (7.62x39mm) which is the most common rifle round produced in warsaw-pact states and other countries, even the U.S. makes them, though I prefer Wolf ammunition as the ones from russia are very cheap, and contains the right amount of gunpowder.

[Spreewerke]

Please check your grammer.

Ammo is cheap from where I live, and theres several different kinds of 7.62mm ammo, like the one I use for my AK (7.62x39mm) which is the most common rifle round produced in warsaw-pact states and other countries, even the U.S. makes them, though I prefer Wolf ammunition as the ones from russia are very cheap, and contains the right amount of gunpowder.

*Grammar

...and Golden Tiger ammunition is better than Wolf ammunition. Wolf is steel cased and easily rusts out. Golden Tiger is steel cased with a lacquer coating so it doesn't corrode. It's also loaded to the same 123gr. weight and has a sealed primer. Same general price as any other FMJ AK round, as well, at around $250 per 1,000. The best ammunition I've come across for AKs, however, would be Herter's, but I don't see that around anymore. I also heard Herter's is now just having other companies (like Wolf) make their ammunition but just put it in their boxes.

Either way, Golden Tiger is awesome.

[Chernoslavia]

Please check your grammer.

Ammo is cheap from where I live, and theres several different kinds of 7.62mm ammo, like the one I use for my AK (7.62x39mm) which is the most common rifle round produced in warsaw-pact states and other countries, even the U.S. makes them, though I prefer Wolf ammunition as the ones from russia are very cheap, and contains the right amount of gunpowder.

*Grammar

...and Golden Tiger ammunition is better than Wolf ammunition. Wolf is steel cased and easily rusts out. Golden Tiger is steel cased with a lacquer coating so it doesn't corrode. It's also loaded to the same 123gr. weight and has a sealed primer. Same general price as any other FMJ AK round, as well, at around $250 per 1,000. The best ammunition I've come across for AKs, however, would be Herter's, but I don't see that around anymore. I also heard Herter's is now just having other companies (like Wolf) make their ammunition but just put it in their boxes.

Either way, Golden Tiger is awesome.

Not if you fire frequently, my Ak isnt the only gun to be fed by 7.62x39mm rounds. I also got a soviet SKS, used in vietnam.

[Spreewerke]

*Grammar

...and Golden Tiger ammunition is better than Wolf ammunition. Wolf is steel cased and easily rusts out. Golden Tiger is steel cased with a lacquer coating so it doesn't corrode. It's also loaded to the same 123gr. weight and has a sealed primer. Same general price as any other FMJ AK round, as well, at around $250 per 1,000. The best ammunition I've come across for AKs, however, would be Herter's, but I don't see that around anymore. I also heard Herter's is now just having other companies (like Wolf) make their ammunition but just put it in their boxes.

Either way, Golden Tiger is awesome.

Not if you fire frequently, my Ak isnt the only gun to be fed by 7.62x39mm rounds. I also got a soviet SKS, used in vietnam.

I've put about a thousand rounds through thus far. I will also be getting a Chi-Com SKS within a couple of months if it hasn't sold by then. Soviet ammunition is Soviet ammunition. It isn't match grade; if it's a 7.62x39mm, it will work in any Soviet weapon chambered in 7.62x39mm. The tolerances in Russian designs are loose enough that ammunition quality isn't much of a deciding factor.


EDIT TO ADD: Apparently, Wolf's site says they load to 124gr. and Golden Tiger is claiming 124gr. on their FMJ ammunition as well (7.62x39mm).

[Chernoslavia]

Golden Tiger, I think I heard of it, I might stop by impactguns.com to see if theres any available. and you know what semi-auto im trying to look for?
A Dragunov SVD.

[Spreewerke]

Golden Tiger, I think I heard of it, I might stop by impactguns.com to see if theres any available. and you know what semi-auto im trying to look for?
A Dragunov SVD.

Only 98 Dragunov SVD's ever made it into the country (or something like that: it was either just below 100 or just barely over 100 thanks to the good ol' ban on Russian weapons). A lot of people mislabel the Romanian PSLs as Dragunov's though. They operate with an enlarged AK piston system instead of the altered gas system of the SVD. The PSLs still have a decent range of about 600-800m (I think) with 7.62x54mmR. They seem like really cool rifles if you can find one. They used to be all over the place, but I can't find them anymore except for on GunBroker. I wouldn't mind having one -- Com-Bloc guns are awesome: cheap, reliable, and super cheap to feed. I think AK-74 ammunition can still be had for <$200 per 1,000 rounds (corrosive surplus).

Also, http://www.atlanticfirearms.com sells Golden Tiger by the case.

[Chernoslavia]

yeah the ban on imported assault weapons on 1989, these politicians just wont stop. If I were president thats my first target, to abolish the 1989 ban. but, atleast there's plenty of sem-auto romanian ak47s to go around.

[Spreewerke]

yeah the ban on imported assault weapons on 1989, these politicians just wont stop. If I were president thats my first target, to abolish the 1989 ban. but, atleast there's plenty of sem-auto romanian ak47s to go around.

I have a WASR. There's a MAK-90 for sale locally, but the barrel threading is gone (though, it has about 98% finish -- the guy collected, but never shot). If there wasn't an equally-nice SKS right beside it, I'd get it. I'd like a Chinese SKS with the "pig sticker," however, as there's a decent chance one of my relatives will give me their Vietnam-style Type-56 AK (semi-auto) that also has the "pig sticker." It'd be a matched set, and at $350 for a 95-98% Chinese SKS, I might as well jump on that. It will be a while, however, as work will keep me busy until February. I doubt it will sell -- with an AK right beside it, people will jump on it ($550 for it). Since they haven't, I doubt they're paying much attention to the SKS either.

I'd eventually like to get an Arsenal of some kind. Not sure if I want a side-folding '74 or a regular AK-47 style rifle. Heck, I'd love to have my WASR, that Type-56, an Arsenal fixed-stock, an Arsenal side-folding '74, and an underfolding '47. I mean, since when is one AK-style rifle enough?

[Chernoslavia]

On impact guns they actually got an AK chambered to fire 22 caliber rounds on the class 3 section on machine guns.

[Spreewerke]

On impact guns they actually got an AK chambered to fire 22 caliber rounds on the class 3 section on machine guns.

I have a feeling a 10/22 would be a lot cheaper and easier to maintain (though, I've never had a single part break on any of ours besides the stock magazines losing spring strength). However, full-auto AKs that are cheaper than normal to feed sound kind of interesting.

[The Soviet Technocracy]

Golden Tiger, I think I heard of it, I might stop by impactguns.com to see if theres any available. and you know what semi-auto im trying to look for?
A Dragunov SVD.

Only 98 Dragunov SVD's ever made it into the country (or something like that: it was either just below 100 or just barely over 100 thanks to the good ol' ban on Russian weapons). A lot of people mislabel the Romanian PSLs as Dragunov's though. They operate with an enlarged AK piston system instead of the altered gas system of the SVD. The PSLs still have a decent range of about 600-800m (I think) with 7.62x54mmR. They seem like really cool rifles if you can find one. They used to be all over the place, but I can't find them anymore except for on GunBroker. I wouldn't mind having one -- Com-Bloc guns are awesome: cheap, reliable, and super cheap to feed. I think AK-74 ammunition can still be had for <$200 per 1,000 rounds (corrosive surplus).

Also, http://www.atlanticfirearms.com sells Golden Tiger by the case.

PSLs still pop up from time to time, new.

There was a batch on Aimsurplus a month ago. Came with two ten-round magazines, polymer furniture, and a 6x PSOP scope for $800 iirc.

[Segland]

Why the heck would you need a machine gun?

Every person who owns a machine gun is a pawn in my evil plot to take over the neighborhood. Muahahaha.

[Spreewerke]

Only 98 Dragunov SVD's ever made it into the country (or something like that: it was either just below 100 or just barely over 100 thanks to the good ol' ban on Russian weapons). A lot of people mislabel the Romanian PSLs as Dragunov's though. They operate with an enlarged AK piston system instead of the altered gas system of the SVD. The PSLs still have a decent range of about 600-800m (I think) with 7.62x54mmR. They seem like really cool rifles if you can find one. They used to be all over the place, but I can't find them anymore except for on GunBroker. I wouldn't mind having one -- Com-Bloc guns are awesome: cheap, reliable, and super cheap to feed. I think AK-74 ammunition can still be had for <$200 per 1,000 rounds (corrosive surplus).

Also, http://www.atlanticfirearms.com sells Golden Tiger by the case.

PSLs still pop up from time to time, new.

There was a batch on Aimsurplus a month ago. Came with two ten-round magazines, polymer furniture, and a 6x PSOP scope for $800 iirc.

The originally came with a wooden Dragunov-esque stock that, so I've heard, absorbs recoil really well. The Poly furniture does look pretty cool, though. If you REALLY have a woody for wood, though, I believe Iron Wood Designs makes PSL stocks.

[Cromarty]

If you're paying $20,000 for an AK47, you don't deserve guns nor money.

And did I say I paid that much for something you can easily find at any warzone? And a seeing as you wrote ak47 I assume you mean AKM which is an assault rifle that's almost no difference to a 47 except the dust cover the spring, the rod underneath the barrel and the "gas bleeder" and an original ak47 is NOT stamped out.

No, I said AK47.

And an AKM is different to an AK47, to the extent whereby the AKM is actually a viable weapon to go to war with, something anyone with even an inkling of knowledge wouldn't say about the AK47.

[Spreewerke]

I think the extents of my Class III adventures will be a Draco SBR, but even that is doubtful.

[Cromarty]

yeah the ban on imported assault weapons on 1989, these politicians just wont stop. If I were president thats my first target, to abolish the 1989 ban. but, atleast there's plenty of sem-auto romanian ak47s to go around.

"Ok, Mr President Chernoslavia, you're in power. What now, the economy?"

"No."

"Ok... what about our foreign policy and the wars in Iraq and Afghan?"

"No."

"Hmm, perhaps you want to focus on climate change and the environment?"

"No."

"Well how about social issues, such as abortion and gay marriage?"

"No."

"So what then, Mr President?"

"The 1989 ban on imported assault weapons."

"..."

[Galla-]

PSLs still pop up from time to time, new.

There was a batch on Aimsurplus a month ago. Came with two ten-round magazines, polymer furniture, and a 6x PSOP scope for $800 iirc.

The originally came with a wooden Dragunov-esque stock that, so I've heard, absorbs recoil really well. The Poly furniture does look pretty cool, though. If you REALLY have a woody for wood, though, I believe Iron Wood Designs makes PSL stocks.

Yep. PSLs, AKMs, FALs, AK-74s, PTRs, and AR-15s last time I checked.

I'd buy an AR-15 just for IWD's wooden furniture.

[Spreewerke]

yeah the ban on imported assault weapons on 1989, these politicians just wont stop. If I were president thats my first target, to abolish the 1989 ban. but, atleast there's plenty of sem-auto romanian ak47s to go around.

"Ok, Mr President Chernoslavia, you're in power. What now, the economy?"

"No."

"Ok... what about our foreign policy and the wars in Iraq and Afghan?"

"No."

"Hmm, perhaps you want to focus on climate change and the environment?"

"No."

"Well how about social issues, such as abortion and gay marriage?"

"No."

"So what then, Mr President?"

"The 1989 ban on imported assault weapons."

"..."

Focusing on reinforcing the Constitution seems okay with me.

[Cromarty]

"Ok, Mr President Chernoslavia, you're in power. What now, the economy?"

"No."

"Ok... what about our foreign policy and the wars in Iraq and Afghan?"

"No."

"Hmm, perhaps you want to focus on climate change and the environment?"

"No."

"Well how about social issues, such as abortion and gay marriage?"

"No."

"So what then, Mr President?"

"The 1989 ban on imported assault weapons."

"..."

Focusing on reinforcing the Constitution seems okay with me.

Does the Constitution say "the right to bare any kind of arms" or "the unrestrictable/unregulatable right to bare arms"?

[Galla-]

Focusing on reinforcing the Constitution seems okay with me.

Does the Constitution say "the right to bare any kind of arms" or "the unrestrictable/unregulatable right to bare arms"?

It says the right to bear arms shall not be infringed.

The Hughes Amendment seems like a pretty big infringement to me, anyone else sane, like GOA and most NRA members.

[Chernoslavia]

Lol, I would try a ban on abortion, I mean just killing a baby because the 16 yr old mother made a stupid decision with his boyfriend she just met last week.? I'd say to hell with it. As for gay marriage, Sure! If straights can get married why not gays? Let them join the army too, as long as they get good training they can fight.

Lol

But now that I think of it I should probably abolish commiefornia gun laws. It will save slot of lives and kitties! Think of the Kitties! And then abolish the 1989 ban, but I should take this one step at a time, one ban abolished per year, we don't want the A.T.Faggots to criticize my presidency. But seriously California gun laws are getting innocent people mugged and sometimes killed. It takes pollies one day to pass a new law but it takes them a decade to determine whether the new law is truly reducing crime it's pathetic.