Abortion(do guys have a say?)

[Hellenic Protectorates]

Oh, you're a cutter.

Nevermind then.

Not really, I have however attempted to end my life on several occasions
For some reason I fail harder at dying then I do at life.

I honestly don't know how I should reply to this. Berating you for attempting will merely get me yelled at, so...

I suggest using a razor-wire noose. I hear those are quite effective.

[Yoite]

And so suicide doesn't exist???

It does. As does mental illness.

And there is considerable overlap.

I can see from whence one might draw that opinion.

[Wiztopia]

And so suicide doesn't exist???

It does. As does mental illness.

And there is considerable overlap.

Women who get abortions have mental illnesses.

[Sovereign Oppression]

Is that all you got? Pointing out an edit?

I thought I had something to worry about.

I didn't notice the edit. Your edit occurred whilst I was posting, and as such, I was unaware that it even existed.

Regardless, not "keeping your legs shut" does not equate to slut. That was a major assumption on your part.

[GeneralHaNor]

Not really, I have however attempted to end my life on several occasions
For some reason I fail harder at dying then I do at life.

I honestly don't know how I should reply to this. Berating you for attempting will merely get me yelled at, so...

I suggest using a razor-wire noose. I hear those are quite effective.

Nah, I keep the .45 in the nightstand, just in case.

[Jedi8246]

Yes, actually she can escape dealing with a pregnancy.

It's called keeping her legs shut. Or using a condom. Or taking the night-before pill. Or even the morning-after pill.

There are FAR too many preventative measures to legitimize abortion.

Sometimes legs are forced open. Often times, condoms break. Many times, night before and morning after pills aren't completely effective.

Preventative measures aren't always 100% effective after all.

Of course. And the fact that you recognize that means you are still assuming some risk in sex, even with preventative measures. All adults know this. Thus they need to accept responsibility if they get pregnant.

If we are talking rape, that's a game changer. I think automatically, the man gets no say if he raped, meaning this is not the thread for discussion.

[Hellenic Protectorates]

It does. As does mental illness.

And there is considerable overlap.

I can see from whence one might draw that opinion logical conclusion based on evidence.

Fixed.

http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/con ... /167/7/731

[Ceannairceach]

I didn't notice the edit. Your edit occurred whilst I was posting, and as such, I was unaware that it even existed.

Regardless, not "keeping your legs shut" does not equate to slut. That was a major assumption on your part.

It certainly implied that women are the only ones responsible for pregnancy, and that they are morally irresponsible.

[Hellenic Protectorates]

Regardless, not "keeping your legs shut" does not equate to slut. That was a major assumption on your part.

It certainly implied that women are the only ones responsible for pregnancy, and that they are morally irresponsible.

No, actually it wasn't. You're repeatedly arguing against things no one is saying.

[Yoite]

I can see from whence one might draw that opinion logical conclusion based on evidence.

Fixed.

http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/con ... /167/7/731

Well played, I'm silenced once again.

[Ceannairceach]

Sometimes legs are forced open. Often times, condoms break. Many times, night before and morning after pills aren't completely effective.

Preventative measures aren't always 100% effective after all.

Of course. And the fact that you recognize that means you are still assuming some risk in sex, even with preventative measures. All adults know this. Thus they need to accept responsibility if they get pregnant.

And, as has been discussed, getting an abortion is being responsible by recognizing that one is not suited for being a mother.

[Hellenic Protectorates]

It does. As does mental illness.

And there is considerable overlap.

Women who get abortions have mental illnesses.

...*reads post over five times attempting to find a joke and/or jibe and/or legitimate point*

*fails*

*writes wiztopia off as a troll and continues the argument with people who are actually trying*

[Sovereign Oppression]

Regardless, not "keeping your legs shut" does not equate to slut. That was a major assumption on your part.

It certainly implied that women are the only ones responsible for pregnancy, and that they are morally irresponsible.

No.

It implies that sex is not a decision solely by the man (unless it's rape), and that one way to prevent pregnancy is to not consent to sex.

[Hellenic Protectorates]

Of course. And the fact that you recognize that means you are still assuming some risk in sex, even with preventative measures. All adults know this. Thus they need to accept responsibility if they get pregnant.

And, as has been discussed, getting an abortion is being responsible by recognizing that one is not suited for being a mother.

I would argue that it is IRresponsible because of the fact that one became a mother in the first place, knowing she was not suited to be so.

[New England and The Maritimes]

Not really, I have however attempted to end my life on several occasions
For some reason I fail harder at dying then I do at life.

I honestly don't know how I should reply to this. Berating you for attempting will merely get me yelled at, so...

I suggest using a razor-wire noose. I hear those are quite effective.

I feel ashamed to be a member of the same species as you. I can't think of much more vile than the shit you've been spewing these last few pages. You must be a summer nazi troll who's late to the party.

[Ceannairceach]

It certainly implied that women are the only ones responsible for pregnancy, and that they are morally irresponsible.

No, actually it wasn't. You're repeatedly arguing against things no one is saying.

Mhmm. I'd suggest not using that phrase, is all; It has negative connotations, and is almost always used as an insult against women seen as morally loose or irresponsible.

[Ashmoria]

Sometimes legs are forced open. Often times, condoms break. Many times, night before and morning after pills aren't completely effective.

Preventative measures aren't always 100% effective after all.

Of course. And the fact that you recognize that means you are still assuming some risk in sex, even with preventative measures. All adults know this. Thus they need to accept responsibility if they get pregnant.

If we are talking rape, that's a game changer. I think automatically, the man gets no say if he raped, meaning this is not the thread for discussion.

no they have no need to accept YOUR moral code. they can use their own and if it includes abortion then its their moral choice in dealing with an unwanted or tragic pregnancy.

[Jedi8246]

She certainly can. She can choose not to have sex. Or to get her tubes tied. Or ask the males she sleeps with to get vasectomies. All 100% methods to not have to deal with pregnancy.

i didnt say that it is inevitable that a woman become pregnant.

a woman who IS pregnant has no way of not being responsible for it.

a man can evade responsibility, a woman cant.

having an abortion IS taking responsibility. that YOU dont approve is meaningless. its still taking responsibility.

Your definition of responsibility is not law either.

A man can also get served papers for trying to avoid responsibility. She can sue the a-hole for child support. In this day and age, she often wins. And just because a man can avoid responsibility, doesn't mean he doesn't have it. Same with a women. Just because she can avoid responsibility with abortion, doesn't mean she should.

In any case, the first post of yours I replied to seemed to indicate prevention, not destruction.

[Hellenic Protectorates]

It certainly implied that women are the only ones responsible for pregnancy, and that they are morally irresponsible.

No.

It implies that sex is not a decision solely by the man (unless it's rape), and that one way to prevent pregnancy is to not consent to sex.

Agreed. I am vehemently opposed to rape to the point of very-near-to-hatred. Rapists deserve every negative thing that happens to them.

[Katganistan]

I think the best option would he have to provide a lump sum of money no matter what the costs, thus to either the medical costs of the abortion or birth. However, after that as long as he makes no substantial contact with the child he is off the hook.

That's somewhat a great idea. Although that sounds like a lot of red tape.

Except the ongoing child support payments are to, you know, SUPPORT your child and make sure it has food, clothes, and shelter.

[Jedi8246]

It certainly implied that women are the only ones responsible for pregnancy, and that they are morally irresponsible.

No, actually it wasn't. You're repeatedly arguing against things no one is saying.

Amen to that.

[Wiztopia]

Women who get abortions have mental illnesses.

...*reads post over five times attempting to find a joke and/or jibe and/or legitimate point*

*fails*

*writes wiztopia off as a troll and continues the argument with people who are actually trying*

Well if they can't keep their legs shut because they are whores then they must have some kind of mental illness.

Of course. And the fact that you recognize that means you are still assuming some risk in sex, even with preventative measures. All adults know this. Thus they need to accept responsibility if they get pregnant.

And, as has been discussed, getting an abortion is being responsible by recognizing that one is not suited for being a mother.

But Jeezus said abortion is wrong!!!

[Ceannairceach]

And, as has been discussed, getting an abortion is being responsible by recognizing that one is not suited for being a mother.

I would argue that it is IRresponsible because of the fact that one became a mother in the first place, knowing she was not suited to be so.

Consent to sex =/= consent to pregnancy, with contraception and birth control as nearly universally attainable.

[Ashmoria]

Of course. And the fact that you recognize that means you are still assuming some risk in sex, even with preventative measures. All adults know this. Thus they need to accept responsibility if they get pregnant.

And, as has been discussed, getting an abortion is being responsible by recognizing that one is not suited for being a mother.

or

since most women having an abortion are already mothers it is recognizing that another pregnancy and another child is not a good idea at that time.

[Jedi8246]

No.

It implies that sex is not a decision solely by the man (unless it's rape), and that one way to prevent pregnancy is to not consent to sex.

Agreed. I am vehemently opposed to rape to the point of very-near-to-hatred. Rapists deserve every negative thing that happens to them.

Another amen. Rape nearly equates to serial killing in my eyes.