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Is the American Dream dead?

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Keronians
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Founded: Oct 15, 2010
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Postby Keronians » Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:21 pm

North Calaveras wrote:
Sarkhaan wrote:If the American Dream has not existed for all citizens of this country, then it has never existed since it states that anyone can come here and move up the ladder. That still isn't true. Talk to someone who is transgender.


It actually has existed for ALL in some way or another people get up the ladder. Yeah you got some serious bumps here and their but everyone has the opportunity in some way. Yes, even if your transgender.


Not really.

And anyway, back when it was advertised to the world, in the 1850s, slavery was still around. Could a black even own property?

In the early 20th century, Asians, prostitutes, beggars, etc., couldn't migrate to the US. Is that the "American Dream"?
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North Calaveras
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Postby North Calaveras » Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:22 pm

Keronians wrote:
North Calaveras wrote:
It actually has existed for ALL in some way or another people get up the ladder. Yeah you got some serious bumps here and their but everyone has the opportunity in some way. Yes, even if your transgender.


Not really.

And anyway, back when it was advertised to the world, in the 1850s, slavery was still around. Could a black even own property?

In the early 20th century, Asians, prostitutes, beggars, etc., couldn't migrate to the US. Is that the "American Dream"?


Okay? as i said there have been bumps but America always moves forward, slowly sometimes, but progress is usually made.
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Puissancevise
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Founded: Sep 12, 2011
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Postby Puissancevise » Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:23 pm

The american dream is not dead, it's just harder to achieve because of all the rich capitalists and their unregulated corporations that can mass produce chips for 20 cents a bag and sell them for 4 dollars half full.
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Keronians
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Postby Keronians » Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:25 pm

North Calaveras wrote:
Keronians wrote:
Not really.

And anyway, back when it was advertised to the world, in the 1850s, slavery was still around. Could a black even own property?

In the early 20th century, Asians, prostitutes, beggars, etc., couldn't migrate to the US. Is that the "American Dream"?


Okay? as i said there have been bumps but America always moves forward, slowly sometimes, but progress is usually made.


And?

Just that you admitted means that the whole "work hard and you will make it in America" spout after the revolutions in Germany, was bullshit.

You couldn't make it big if you were a woman. You couldn't if you were black. You couldn't if you were Asian. You couldn't if you were in rags.
Proud Indian. Spanish citizen. European federalist.
Political compass
Awarded the Bronze Medal for General Debating at the 11th Annual Posters' Awards. Awarded Best New Poster at the 11th Annual Posters' Awards.
It is almost universally felt that when we call a country democratic we are praising it; consequently, the defenders of every kind of regime claim that it is a democracy, and fear that they might have to stop using the word if it were tied down to any one meaning.
George Orwell
· Private property
· Free foreign trade
· Exchange of goods and services
· Free formation of prices

· Market regulation
· Social security
· Universal healthcare
· Unemployment insurance

This is a capitalist model.

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North Calaveras
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Founded: Mar 22, 2007
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Postby North Calaveras » Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:26 pm

Keronians wrote:
North Calaveras wrote:
Okay? as i said there have been bumps but America always moves forward, slowly sometimes, but progress is usually made.


And?

Just that you admitted means that the whole "work hard and you will make it in America" spout after the revolutions in Germany, was bullshit.

You couldn't make it big if you were a woman. You couldn't if you were black. You couldn't if you were Asian. You couldn't if you were in rags.


what? wasn't that a dicussion between if you would rather live in nazi germany or soviet union? what does that have to do with this topic?
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Naurobia
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Founded: May 26, 2011
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Postby Naurobia » Thu Oct 13, 2011 5:10 pm

It never was feasible in the first place unless you are a wealthy greedy capitalist that exploits the working class.
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JJ Place
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Founded: Jul 30, 2008
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Postby JJ Place » Thu Oct 13, 2011 5:30 pm

Sarkhaan wrote:
JJ Place wrote:Opportunities don't exist. People create their own opportunities.

Bullshit. Bullshit on the magnitude of people thinking that "Two roads diverged in a wood and I took the one less traveled" is actually what Robert Frost said in that poem.

People create their own opportunities? So I created my kindergarten, elementary schools, middle school, high school, and one of the largest private universities in the world? Because they've provided me with most of my opportunities. I created my parents? Because they too have provided me with countless opportunities.

Get off the "I walked 10 miles in the snow to AND from school" bus. It isn't charming until you are senile enough to actually believe it.


Pessimism is a common employment. As long as you reject the idea that you'll succeed, you'll never succeed. If you believe success is out of reach, you'll never even pose a threat to succeed.
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The Black Forrest
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Postby The Black Forrest » Thu Oct 13, 2011 6:25 pm

JJ Place wrote:
Sarkhaan wrote:Bullshit. Bullshit on the magnitude of people thinking that "Two roads diverged in a wood and I took the one less traveled" is actually what Robert Frost said in that poem.

People create their own opportunities? So I created my kindergarten, elementary schools, middle school, high school, and one of the largest private universities in the world? Because they've provided me with most of my opportunities. I created my parents? Because they too have provided me with countless opportunities.

Get off the "I walked 10 miles in the snow to AND from school" bus. It isn't charming until you are senile enough to actually believe it.


Pessimism is a common employment. As long as you reject the idea that you'll succeed, you'll never succeed. If you believe success is out of reach, you'll never even pose a threat to succeed.


So what exactly do you do?
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JJ Place
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Founded: Jul 30, 2008
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Postby JJ Place » Thu Oct 13, 2011 6:53 pm

The Black Forrest wrote:
JJ Place wrote:
Pessimism is a common employment. As long as you reject the idea that you'll succeed, you'll never succeed. If you believe success is out of reach, you'll never even pose a threat to succeed.


So what exactly do you do?

Your actions are your results. You do as you need to in order to succeed, and that's harder done than said. The only thing that's guaranteed to extinguish your success is you believing you can have no success. The American Dream is reality, unless you believe yourself impossible to succeed.
The price of cheese is eternal Vignotte.
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Anthoniland
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Founded: Oct 17, 2011
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Postby Anthoniland » Sat Oct 22, 2011 10:21 pm

I don't think it was ever really feasible.

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Dragonia Re Xzua
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Founded: Jun 25, 2011
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Postby Dragonia Re Xzua » Mon Dec 05, 2011 11:15 am

I think it is.
Humans are monsters, we will never change, we will always want to claw out the throats of those with a difference in opinion, we will never be in an age of peace because of our lust for war, poverty will continue to exist as long as monetary needs exist. We rape, enslave, and conquer with no regards to others. We live by the sword, and we will, justifiably, die by the sword.

Hope is for unrealistic idealists. Pessimism is your friend.

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