Was the Galactic Empire a good place to live?

[United Dependencies]

You're thinking of the Republic.

I'm talking about corruption in the sense of having to bribe officials to get things done, not corruption in the sense that special intrests controlled the legislature. Xenophobia still stands though.

Also the empire allowed slavery.

[Aethrys]

Do you remember seeing aliens in imperial uniform?

Who knows? They were wearing suits. And the clones were human.

The officers didn't wear helmets, and none of them were non-humans. The best you could argue is that they might've had low ranking aliens, but that's still like when the US had all black regiments with white officers.

[New East Ireland]

It was no bigger than a womp rat! And what were they suppose to do, slap some ply wood on it?

That would have made the resale value drop like a rock.

Exactly. How would the Emperor be able to afford his retreat on Naboo if the Hutts only paid 1/4 of the price?

[AETEN II]

Those rebels can't hurt us, I'm in a bloody space station with an obvious weakness, not damn way they can harm us....

Yeah, he'd make a great leader, but hey, if you want a cocky dude who's sure something could not go wrong at all despite strong evidence that it could and is willing to risk millions of lives on it, go ahead.

It was no bigger than a womp rat! And what were they suppose to do, slap some ply wood on it?

Put shields on the damn thing. Seriously, how in HELL is an enemy squadron with various rather powerful ships able to fly right onto your space station? Ever heard of shields, they're cool, they keep those damn flies from blowing shit up. That or have computers man the turrets, not humans.

[Olthar]

Also the empire allowed slavery.

In which movie?

[Northern Bigfootia]

Discounting anything the EU says is just handwaving away evidence to the contrary. The movies don't show us the Empire's xenophobia and oppression, but then they don't show us nearly anything related to how it actually works. What they do show us involves summary military execution and a willingness to murder billions of people in order to prevent any rebellion. Not to mention the fact that there must be reasons why there's such a large organized opposition to it...

[United Dependencies]

Also the empire allowed slavery.

In which movie?

...

uh 4,5,6 and the expanded universe.

[Olthar]

Discounting anything the EU says is just handwaving away evidence to the contrary. The movies don't show us the Empire's xenophobia and oppression, but then they don't show us nearly anything related to how it actually works. What they do show us involves summary military execution and a willingness to murder billions of people in order to prevent any rebellion. Not to mention the fact that there must be reasons why there's such a large organized opposition to it...

The EU is just glorified fan-fiction. The movies are the only real canon. Hell, even Lucas, himself, said that the movies come before everything else.

[Aethrys]

It was no bigger than a womp rat! And what were they suppose to do, slap some ply wood on it?

Put shields on the damn thing. Seriously, how in HELL is an enemy squadron with various rather powerful ships able to fly right onto your space station? Ever heard of shields, they're cool, they keep those damn flies from blowing shit up. That or have computers man the turrets, not humans.

Shields might get in the way of the big goddamn planet destroying laser cannon, and multiple sources portray humans as better fighters/pilots/shots than droids in the series.

[Olthar]

In which movie?

...

uh 4,5,6 and the expanded universe.

Really? I don't recall seeing any slavery in the movies.

And, as the OP has said twice now, the EU is being disregarded.

[JJ Place]

It depends upon whether or not you value freedom.

If not, the stability of the Empire would certainly have been good for the economy, and I suppose the heavy-handed security measures probably kept crime down- I mean, except for the crime that was directly aimed at destroying the Empire.

Palpatine was never intent on not abusing his power; he gladly killed anyone standing in the way of his power, both obtaining and maintaining his gains. The emperor gladly would kill anyone, only to seek more of his own power; not a good aspect of anyone of anyone without the name Palpatine. Not security, neither good for the economy, or the crime rate; unless your name is Palpatine, of course.

[New East Ireland]

Put shields on the damn thing. Seriously, how in HELL is an enemy squadron with various rather powerful ships able to fly right onto your space station? Ever heard of shields, they're cool, they keep those damn flies from blowing shit up. That or have computers man the turrets, not humans.

Yeah, it was kind of flawed.

[United Dependencies]

...

uh 4,5,6 and the expanded universe.

Really? I don't recall seeing any slavery in the movies.

And, as the OP has said twice now, the EU is being disregarded.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Imperial ... 57.607.232

edit:that's silly, you can't get a decent understanding of any of the galactic governments from just the movies.

[New East Ireland]

Put shields on the damn thing. Seriously, how in HELL is an enemy squadron with various rather powerful ships able to fly right onto your space station? Ever heard of shields, they're cool, they keep those damn flies from blowing shit up. That or have computers man the turrets, not humans.

Shields might get in the way of the big goddamn planet destroying laser cannon, and multiple sources portray humans as better fighters/pilots/shots than droids in the series.

"You may fire when ready."

"WHAT!?"

"Quiet, Princess. We know the Rebel base is on Yavin, and we know that Alderaan is the home of your resistance army."

"Uh, Grand Moff sir?"

"Yes, what is it?"

"The shield might-"

"I said fire!"

"Yes sir!"

"Now, as I was saying Princess, you-"

Boom.

[Olthar]

Really? I don't recall seeing any slavery in the movies.

And, as the OP has said twice now, the EU is being disregarded.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Imperial ... 57.607.232

edit:that's silly, you can't get a decent understanding of any of the galactic governments from just the movies.

Hmm...sources, eh? I don't see any of the movies listed, so I guess this isn't from the movies, is it?

[Northern Bigfootia]

The EU is just glorified fan-fiction. The movies are the only real canon. Hell, even Lucas, himself, said that the movies come before everything else.

They may well come before anything else, but does that make it totally discounted? The EU doesn't contradict the movies.

In either case, my point was that just because the movies don't show these things, it doesn't mean they aren't there. The movies have a fairly narrow scope, it doesn't follow around random oppressed citizens to show you how bad the Empire is, but that doesn't automatically mean the Empire isn't oppressive, just that its mostly off screen. The Empire's actions and the existence of the Rebellion in the movies clearly indicate that the Empire is, in fact, evil.

[Putria]

Just because there is an organized resistance doesn't mean the governing body is horribly evil.

[Olthar]

The EU is just glorified fan-fiction. The movies are the only real canon. Hell, even Lucas, himself, said that the movies come before everything else.

They may well come before anything else, but does that make it totally discounted? The EU doesn't contradict the movies.

In either case, my point was that just because the movies don't show these things, it doesn't mean they aren't there. The movies have a fairly narrow scope, it doesn't follow around random oppressed citizens to show you how bad the Empire is, but that doesn't automatically mean the Empire isn't oppressive, just that its mostly off screen. The Empire's actions and the existence of the Rebellion in the movies clearly indicate that the Empire is, in fact, evil.

For the purposes of this debate, yes, we are discounting the EU, as was stated by the OP.

With that in mind, you're just making assumptions. How do you know the people are oppressed? You don't. The movies don't give any indication of oppression.
And just because there is an active rebellion, that means that the Empire is evil? How? Is there some law that rebels are always good and righteous?

[United Dependencies]

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Imperial ... 57.607.232

edit:that's silly, you can't get a decent understanding of any of the galactic governments from just the movies.

Hmm...sources, eh? I don't see any of the movies listed, so I guess this isn't from the movies, is it?

Ok fine if you don't want to use the EU, then there was no provable slavery.

The empire shot up innocent people (jawas, luke's aunt and uncle, alderaan)

edit: the emperor dissovled the legislative body in favor of military governors who explicitly would rule with fear(fear of our new battle station).

[New East Ireland]

Hmm...sources, eh? I don't see any of the movies listed, so I guess this isn't from the movies, is it?

Ok fine if you don't want to use the EU, then there was no provable slavery.

The empire shot up innocent people (jawas, luke's aunt and uncle, alderaan)

Technically, the Jawas and Luke's aunt and uncle were harboring fugitive droids. As for Alderaan, it was a leading member world of the Rebel Alliance.

[Olthar]

Hmm...sources, eh? I don't see any of the movies listed, so I guess this isn't from the movies, is it?

Ok fine if you don't want to use the EU, then there was no provable slavery.

The empire shot up innocent people (jawas, luke's aunt and uncle, alderaan)

Maybe you should also read the link in the OP before deciding to debate. That's covered in there.

edit: the emperor dissovled the legislative body in favor of military governors who explicitly would rule with fear(fear of our new battle station).

And? Is ruling with fear evil? Is keeping the population in check to prevent crime, rebels, and other disruptive elements such a terrible thing?

[Aethrys]

And just because there is an active rebellion, that means that the Empire is evil? How?

As for it's leaders being members of the rebellion, destroying a planet hardly seems like the appropriate response of a reasonable government, since there's a fair chance a majority are law abiding citizens.

[United Dependencies]

Ok fine if you don't want to use the EU, then there was no provable slavery.

The empire shot up innocent people (jawas, luke's aunt and uncle, alderaan)

Maybe you should also read the link in the OP before deciding to debate. That's covered in there.

edit: the emperor dissovled the legislative body in favor of military governors who explicitly would rule with fear(fear of our new battle station).

And? Is ruling with fear evil? Is keeping the population in check to prevent crime, rebels, and other disruptive elements such a terrible thing?

Dissolving the legislative body is an act to impose rules upon galactic systems while giving them no forms of redress or means to represent themselves to their leaders. Basically each system had its own little dictator who reported only to military higher ups.

[Maurepas]

Probably depended on exactly which planet you were on and your position in life. Alderaan pre-Empire was probably the best place to live.

During the Empire, I'd imagine you'd want to live on Corellia, all the wealth and security, with a government willing to look the other way on the oppression parts.

[Northern Bigfootia]

Yes, it's true that the existence of the Alliance doesn't automatically mean the Empire is oppressive, but there's usually a reason for large amounts of people to put their lives at stake to take down a regime. We also see the Empire murder billions of people by destroying Alderaan as a demonstration, which hardly speak well for them being nice to everyone (Yeah, it might have been part of the rebellion, but that's hardly justification to kill everyone there, is it?).

I suppose you probably can't directly assume the Empire is oppressive from the movie (Except for those people in planets who might be rebelling), but you also can't assume the Empire was a particularly good place to live in from them either.