Capitalisim vs. Socialisim

[Guernseyland]

We have too many threads on this topic. I'm gonna tie em on together.

So, what is your perspective?

Personally, I am socialist. POLITICS ISN'T A GAME.

[Thurask]

We have too many threads on this topic. I'm gonna tie em on together.

Counter-productive much?

[Guernseyland]

We have too many threads on this topic. I'm gonna tie em on together.

Counter-productive much?

Ah, shaddap. It's more relevant than the What's you favorite color? thread.

[Keronians]

Please fix the typo. /grammer nazi

It's too late, and I have school tomorrow, but I'll give a brief opinion.

I personally prefer capitalism. Capitalism gives incentive to enterprise, innovation, and technological development. Inherently, it is efficient, as the firm that is not efficient fails at the market. Inherently, the firm which cannot adapt to developments fails at the market. Inherently, the firm which does not produce desired products, fails at the market place.

The only type of socialism I think can compare to the kind of success capitalism enjoys is market socialism.

[Threlizdun]

While I ultimately support eventually transistioning to a libertarian socialist system, and from there continuing for a period of time before adopting anarcho-syndicalist communism merged with elements of participatory economics and a gift economy, I believe capitalism is the proper system to use to get there. Capitalism is proven to work, being highly productive and if regulated it isn't horribly harmful. I would mostly say that I support a social democratic system until we would have progressed enough to the economic left-wing and socially libertarian ends of the spectrum.

[The USOT]

Socialism.

Socialism and socialised corporations are (in my oppinion anyway) more ethically sound, and socialism thanks to regulation and community incentive has a greater chance of being more environmentally freindly, which is important to myself.

[Hassett]

Capitalism, because its right

[Distruzio]

Capitalism. Market democracy is the only way to ensure equality and liberty for everyone. Vote with your dollars.

[Tubbsalot]

Capitalism with some state services and regulation. Best of both worlds. I don't know why anyone would choose anything else.

[Izarius]

Watch how quickly this thread is going to fall apart.

Anyways, socialism. Production should be the driving force behind the economy, not greed.

[Keronians]

Watch how quickly this thread is going to fall apart.

Anyways, socialism. Production should be the driving force behind the economy, not greed.

Production is the driving force in capitalism as well.

How, exactly, do you think that demand and supply works?

[Kowalewski]

Watch how quickly this thread is going to fall apart.

Anyways, socialism. Production should be the driving force behind the economy, not greed.

Production is the driving force in capitalism as well.

How, exactly, do you think that supply and demand works?

fixed

[The Warrior Hearted]

arent there like, what, 7 threads on this topic?

[Wealthy Come-Ons]

Watch how quickly this thread is going to fall apart.

Anyways, socialism. Production should be the driving force behind the economy, not greed.

Speculation is the driving force in capitalism as well.

How, exactly, do you think that demand and supply works?

Re-fixed.

[The Merchant Republics]

The Free Market, whether it be run predominantly by private or cooperative enterprises in a free and just environment is the optimum economic system. In practical terms that means capitalism, laissez-faire or close to it.

[The Warrior Hearted]

capitalism

Though it must be far from Laisse faire (i doubt i spelt that right, but i dont care). Bussiness needs to be tightly regulated so they do not endanger there workers or pay them a salary that they cannot readily survive on. They also must be stopped from harming the enviroment or the people.


Most importantly, they must have there slimy fingers chopped out of the government and have to pay a flat 25% tax once they make more then $150,000 net with no loopholes.

[1000 Cats]

Mutualism.

[The Merchant Republics]

Speculation is the driving force in capitalism as well.

How, exactly, do you think that demand and supply works?

Re-fixed.

1. That's a bad idea, "fixes" can be flame-bait.

2. Economies are run on speculation. There is no difference between a socialist and capitalist economy in that regard. A socialist central planner is no less slave to speculation, and indeed perhaps more.

Let me explain, what do you understand of speculation? I imagine you at least have a basic understanding that it is when economic actors speculate on the future prices of resources/firms/products? However, do you understand that It does not matter who the economic actors are, the speculation must occur.

Let us imagine a socialist economy, a centralized one to keep it simple, our chief bureaucrat is deciding how and where to use the resources of his economy, he has 3000 units of resource (shortened R), he needs to allocate his resources in a way that will best benefit his economy, he could afford either to build a mine or a factory. This scenario is unrefined but the end result is simple, our bureaucrat must choose one expense over the other, he must therefore speculate on their future values to his society. That value however, is not known. The mine could produce 7000R or only 1000R worth of ore, the factory might use the resources you provide it to produce goods worth 20000R or if the end product isn't desired 0 R. And this is extremely simplistic, the sheer amount of values we need to evaluate are mind boggling. Our bureaucrat chooses to build the factory but the factory staffed by incompetent and lazy people doesn't produce much of value, you don't return on investment, your economy shrinks, congratulations, it's a socialist recession.

[Izarius]

Watch how quickly this thread is going to fall apart.

Anyways, socialism. Production should be the driving force behind the economy, not greed.

Production is the driving force in capitalism as well.

How, exactly, do you think that demand and supply works?

It doesn't. Companies seeking profits create demand for useless products that people don't need, through advertisement. They then sell services as products. For example, a lot of the American economy today consists of buying stuff from China for $1 and selling it here for $10. That adds $1 to China's GDP, while adding $9 to America's GDP. That's not actually useful for anyone.

Under a socialist system, we'd focus on actually producing stuff in America, so that the total world production is higher, and people overall are better off.

[LiangLai]

Capitalism, for it is much more efficient, stable, and sustainable than Socialism.

[The Merchant Republics]

Production is the driving force in capitalism as well.

How, exactly, do you think that demand and supply works?

It doesn't. Companies seeking profits create demand for useless products that people don't need, through advertisement. They then sell services as products. For example, a lot of the American economy today consists of buying stuff from China for $1 and selling it here for $10. That adds $1 to China's GDP, while adding $9 to America's GDP. That's not actually useful for anyone.

Under a socialist system, we'd focus on actually producing stuff in America, so that the total world production is higher, and people overall are better off.

Unless your Chinese, in which case no trade with America = Starvation.

How many useless products can you think of off the top of your head? Genuinely worthless? Because I'll tell you that anytime you think that, you show your bias against economics, without the realization that value is subjective, you cannot work as such.

What is it you believe that a socialist economy will do? Operate by pure magic to produce only things that people need? Right now, tell me what car you want, if you could have any? Easy? Tell me what car your neighbour would want? Tell me what car his brother would want? Tell me what car every person in your town needs and would like to have in their garage? How do you propose that a socialist economy could ever learn all these things?

Edit: Actually, I misread, there something entirely else I have to address.

The world economy would not be "better off" if every nation produced it's own goods. I'll make this an easy scenario, would the world be better off if everyone grew their own food? Everyone? Would the world be better off if everyone built their own homes? Furnished them by themselves? Cut down all the wood and mined and smelted the iron needed to make the nails?

Why not? Simple answer, Division of Labour, the division of labour means it's better that China produce our cheap goods, so that America can produce the expensive goods. And do not mistake yourself, America produces goods.

[Alexlantis]

Market Socialism is probably the most efficient economic system there is. Democratic socialism is probably the best. So, just combine the two.

[Tatec]

They both fail completely.

[Alexlantis]

They both fail completely.

Capitalism AND Socialism?

Well, Communism doesn't work, so what are you proposing as the system that does work? Fascism?

[Tatec]

They both fail completely.

Capitalism AND Socialism?

Well, Communism doesn't work, so what are you proposing as the system that does work? Fascism?

A mixture that is present in the country I RP. Major corporations are controlled partly by the state and by the private sector. In my country it is a crime against the State to negatively effect the profit of a major company and thus negatively effect the economy in a whole.