Anonymous to Occupy Wall Street and Create Megathread

[Shofercia]

They did the whole "you can't have camping equipment here, council and state regulations" thing with Occupy Sydney. Let them freeze for their cause. It's not supposed to be easy.

How dare does a government allow the protesters to protest under reasonable conditions?! What is this, democracy or something?!

I live in the States, and I don't see a lot of Tea Partiers here. We're more worried about Jerry Brown doing crazy stuff with our water, than Tea Partiers.

And clearly the Tea Partiers are hiding from you. Or perhaps they don't wear signs around their necks or something. I guess you could have a look at the congress election results for your local district.[/b]

What a wonderful idea! Let's take a look at the Congressional Results, not just for my district, but for my entire state. As I said before - Wikipedia can copy-paste: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:2010_ ... ctions.svg

As you can see, the Republicans gained a whopping zero seats in California due to the Tea Party involvement. Perhaps Gubernatorial Elections are more to your liking? Bad news there for the Tea Party, whose candidate, Meg Whitman, despite outspending her opponent, scored the second lowest among Republican candidates for governor since 1978. Who was the "gem" that did worse than Tea Party Whitman? Lundgren - the psycho who wanted to keep assault weapons on the street.

A "phenomenal" performance by the Tea Party in California. To quote a local comedian on Tea Party attempts in mah state: "Do we need to parody this? The Tea Party is a parody of the Republican party!"

A new tax plan from several Republican senators completely reverses the principle of income equality and when you think it can't get even worse a joint Democrat and Republican plan to create a corporate tax holiday.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/images/Too ... Dollar.jpg
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/images/Too ... ercent.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0b-iI1eegg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=unFqp5uU ... ure=relmfu

And this ladies and gentlemen - is why we should support the Occupy Movement!

several incoming reports i've heard on twitter.

- Police officer attempted to remove press pass from NBC reporter, when he could not he told the reporter to remove it himself
- Rubbish is being dumped into the personal belongings of protesters
- Various accounts of brutality
- The Subway and various other transportation networks have been shut down
- CBS news helicopters forced to leave by NYPD
- Guardian reporter threatened with arrest and being forced to phone fellow reporter in Hong Kong to tell him whats going on though the live stream even though he's only a few blocks away
- Wide spread reports of other press officials having their passes taken away and being threatened with arrest.

Really? What has happened to America.

Oh boy, they're bringing up firehoses. This is going to turn into a media orgy.

Sounds eerily familiar.





BFD = Birmingham Fire Department

Hooray, the police is finally cleaning up the park so real Americans can actually enjoy it instead of these protestors who are just preventing ordinary people from using the park! I'm proud that the police didn't just stand idle but cleaned up the park. I'm eagerly waiting for lots of hippie tears about ''how the fascist police pigs drove us away'', and of course, a Fox News report about all this.

It's about damn time Bernie Madoff and Scammers Anonymous got a right to stroll in the park unjustly occupied by people demanding education! /sarcasm

People wanting the government to steal wealth and resources from rich people simply because they are rich isn't ''anti-democratic''?
Hint: Democracy =/= mob rule

You really have no clue about what is going on do you? The People want the rich to pay their fair share of taxes and not get special treatment because they are rich; that is but a small, small part of the the whole issue and I'm too tired to try an lay it out for you.

Btw, I'm Republican

Thank you! I'm tired of these allegations that the OWS is just liberal. It's Universal.

[Neu Leonstein]

How dare does a government allow the protesters to protest under reasonable conditions?! What is this, democracy or something?!

It's not a protest, it's a settlement. Its purpose is not relevant to whether not it could cause a public health hazard. It's also in a privately-owned park in which camping is not normally allowed. It's purely due to the good-hearted nature of the Zucotti park owners that they haven't called in the cops ages ago.

Anyway, since there has not been any attempt to disallow the protest's continuation, this really has nothing to do with democracy. The protesters will be free to continue to spend every day there. They're simply not allowed to camp and run these various types of equipment in this park.

Thank you! I'm tired of these allegations that the OWS is just liberal. It's Universal.

Yep. 7 percentage points more universal than the Tea Party.

[Shofercia]

How dare does a government allow the protesters to protest under reasonable conditions?! What is this, democracy or something?!

It's not a protest, it's a settlement. Its purpose is not relevant to whether not it could cause a public health hazard. It's also in a privately-owned park in which camping is not normally allowed. It's purely due to the good-hearted nature of the Zucotti park owners that they haven't called in the cops ages ago.

*sighs* another banker commenting on the OWS. As if we need more people getting the facts wrong:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/protest ... ed-in-nyc/

Posted on October 14, 2011 at 6:59am

NEW YORK (The Blaze/AP) — The cleanup of a plaza in lower Manhattan where protesters have been camped out for a month was postponed early Friday, sending cheers up from a crowd that had feared the effort was merely a pretext to evict them.

“Late last night, we received notice from the owners of Zuccotti Park – Brookfield Properties – that they are postponing their scheduled cleaning of the park, and for the time being withdrawing their request from earlier in the week for police assistance during their cleaning operation,” the deputy mayor’s statement said.

They tried it over a month ago. Didn't work. Zucotti Park is owned by Brookfield Properties, with $20 billion dollars in total assets. It's not their first attempt, as you imply.

[Andaluciae]

All right, happy tree friends, we are to the crux of it. The little campout was cute, but efficacy was relatively low, it was ideologically and intellectually uninteresting, and necessarily short lived. It was good at garnering attention, yeah, but so is Jersey Shore. What will determine the future of the movement comes from today onward.

Can the various occupy-something's get their act together, combine into something national, coherent, durable and with an effective, implementable programme.

[Shofercia]

All right, happy tree friends, we are to the crux of it. The little campout was cute, but efficacy was relatively low, it was ideologically and intellectually uninteresting, and necessarily short lived. It was good at garnering attention, yeah, but so is Jersey Shore. What will determine the future of the movement comes from today onward.

Can the various occupy-something's get their act together, combine into something national, coherent, durable and with an effective, implementable programme.

Ya know, it'd be easier, if NYPD wasn't using riot tactics to disperse a peaceful demonstration.

3:36 a.m. Kitchen tent reported teargassed. Police moving in with zip cuffs.
3:33 a.m. Bulldozers moving in
3:16 a.m. Occupiers linking arms around riot police
3:15 a.m. NYPD destroying personal items. Occupiers prevented from leaving with their possessions.
3:13 a.m. NYPD deploying sound cannon
3:08 a.m. heard on livestream: "they're bringing in the hoses."
3:05 a.m. NYPD cutting down trees in Liberty Square
2:55 a.m. NYC council-member Ydanis Rodríguez arrested and bleeding from head.
2:44 a.m. Defiant occupiers barricaded Liberty Square kitchen
2:44 a.m. NYPD destroys OWS Library. 5,000 donated books in dumpster.
2:42 a.m. Brooklyn Bridge confirmed closed
2:38 a.m. 400-500 marching north to Foley Square
2:32 a.m. All subways but R shut down
2:29 a.m. Press helicopters evicted from airspace. NYTimes reporter arrested.
2:22 a.m. Frontpage coverage from New York Times
2:15 a.m. Occupiers who have been dispersed are regrouping at Foley Square
2:10 a.m. Press barred from entering Liberty Square
2:07 a.m. Pepper spray deployed -- reports of at least one reporter sprayed
2:03 a.m. Massive Police Presence at Canal and Broadway
1:43 a.m. Helicopters overhead.
1:38 a.m. Unconfirmed reports of snipers on rooftops.
1:34 a.m. CBS News Helicopter Livestream
1:27 a.m. Unconfirmed reports that police are planning to sweep everyone.
1:20 a.m. Subway stops are closed.
1:20 a.m. Brooklyn bridge is closed.
1:20 a.m. Occupiers chanting "This is what a police state looks like."
1:20 a.m. Police are in riot gear.
1:20 a.m. Police are bringing in bulldozers.

http://occupywallst.org/article/nypd-ra ... ty-square/

It's much easier to talk when someone wearing riot gear isn't chasing you. Besides - OWS already told the Government to re-enact Glass-Steagal, something most Americans support. If the Government can't even manage that, what's the point of telling you guys more coherent ideas?

[Andaluciae]

All right, happy tree friends, we are to the crux of it. The little campout was cute, but efficacy was relatively low, it was ideologically and intellectually uninteresting, and necessarily short lived. It was good at garnering attention, yeah, but so is Jersey Shore. What will determine the future of the movement comes from today onward.

Can the various occupy-something's get their act together, combine into something national, coherent, durable and with an effective, implementable programme.

Ya know, it'd be easier, if NYPD wasn't using riot tactics to disperse a peaceful demonstration.

3:36 a.m. Kitchen tent reported teargassed. Police moving in with zip cuffs.
3:33 a.m. Bulldozers moving in
3:16 a.m. Occupiers linking arms around riot police
3:15 a.m. NYPD destroying personal items. Occupiers prevented from leaving with their possessions.
3:13 a.m. NYPD deploying sound cannon
3:08 a.m. heard on livestream: "they're bringing in the hoses."
3:05 a.m. NYPD cutting down trees in Liberty Square
2:55 a.m. NYC council-member Ydanis Rodríguez arrested and bleeding from head.
2:44 a.m. Defiant occupiers barricaded Liberty Square kitchen
2:44 a.m. NYPD destroys OWS Library. 5,000 donated books in dumpster.
2:42 a.m. Brooklyn Bridge confirmed closed
2:38 a.m. 400-500 marching north to Foley Square
2:32 a.m. All subways but R shut down
2:29 a.m. Press helicopters evicted from airspace. NYTimes reporter arrested.
2:22 a.m. Frontpage coverage from New York Times
2:15 a.m. Occupiers who have been dispersed are regrouping at Foley Square
2:10 a.m. Press barred from entering Liberty Square
2:07 a.m. Pepper spray deployed -- reports of at least one reporter sprayed
2:03 a.m. Massive Police Presence at Canal and Broadway
1:43 a.m. Helicopters overhead.
1:38 a.m. Unconfirmed reports of snipers on rooftops.
1:34 a.m. CBS News Helicopter Livestream
1:27 a.m. Unconfirmed reports that police are planning to sweep everyone.
1:20 a.m. Subway stops are closed.
1:20 a.m. Brooklyn bridge is closed.
1:20 a.m. Occupiers chanting "This is what a police state looks like."
1:20 a.m. Police are in riot gear.
1:20 a.m. Police are bringing in bulldozers.

http://occupywallst.org/article/nypd-ra ... ty-square/

It's much easier to talk when someone wearing riot gear isn't chasing you. Besides - OWS already told the Government to re-enact Glass-Steagal, something most Americans support. If the Government can't even manage that, what's the point of telling you guys more coherent ideas?

The fact is that camping out in Downtown Manhattan is not only frowned upon, but it is also against code. Regardless, it succeeded in grabbing attention. Now, the occupy movement has left the initial phase, and not on its own terms, which is not setting a good pattern.

Further, repeal of Glass-Steagal isn't a programme, and it's not the result of a concentrated programme development process, and lacking that, the occupy movement has no clear way forward. They can take this as an opportunity to progress.

[Shofercia]

Ya know, it'd be easier, if NYPD wasn't using riot tactics to disperse a peaceful demonstration.



http://occupywallst.org/article/nypd-ra ... ty-square/

It's much easier to talk when someone wearing riot gear isn't chasing you. Besides - OWS already told the Government to re-enact Glass-Steagal, something most Americans support. If the Government can't even manage that, what's the point of telling you guys more coherent ideas?

The fact is that camping out in Downtown Manhattan is not only frowned upon, but it is also against code. Regardless, it succeeded in grabbing attention. Now, the occupy movement has left the initial phase, and not on its own terms, which is not setting a good pattern.

Further, repeal of Glass-Steagal isn't a programme, and it's not the result of a concentrated programme development process, and lacking that, the occupy movement has no clear way forward. They can take this as an opportunity to progress.

I said reenact Glass-Steagal, not repeal it. There are other ideas that OWS offered to the government, and so far, the government has yet to act on any of them.

Jobs for ALL - A Massive Public Works and Public Service Program

�We demand a massive public works and public service program with direct government employment at prevailing (union) wages paid for by taxing the rich and corporations, by immediately ending all of America's wars, and by ending all aid to authoritarian regimes to create 25 million new jobs to:

Expand education: cut class sizes and provide free university for all;
Expand healthcare and provide free healthcare for all (single payer system);
Build housing, guarantee decent housing for all;
Expand mass transit, provided for free;
Rebuild the infrastructure bridges, flood control, roads;
Research and implement clean energy alternatives; and
Clean up the environment.

http://articles.businessinsider.com/201 ... s-new-jobs

Is the Government so inept as to be unable to enact a part of this legislation? Like making American Schools as successful as European Schools?

[Andaluciae]

More to the point, this sort of juvenile foolishness is a mortal threat to the movement.

http://www.reddit.com/r/OccupyCleveland ... descended/

It's a case study in how to destroy the occupy movement. By turning towards inward disputes, and neglecting the sorts of activities that can create a durable movement.

Say what you will about the old people playing dress up, they at least crossed the organizational divide. Occupy has to do that, and camping out isn't going to achieve that.

[Andaluciae]

The fact is that camping out in Downtown Manhattan is not only frowned upon, but it is also against code. Regardless, it succeeded in grabbing attention. Now, the occupy movement has left the initial phase, and not on its own terms, which is not setting a good pattern.

Further, repeal of Glass-Steagal isn't a programme, and it's not the result of a concentrated programme development process, and lacking that, the occupy movement has no clear way forward. They can take this as an opportunity to progress.

I said reenact Glass-Steagal, not repeal it. There are other ideas that OWS offered to the government, and so far, the government has yet to act on any of them.

,

I'm on a smartphone, it autocorrected replace to reenact to repeal. I'm so sorry I didn't check for typos.

Further, the policy formulation process in a democracy is slow, and gathering the requisite support and activism takes time. That is the phase the movement needs to enter now. The exact same point goes for the below.

Is the Government so inept as to be unable to enact a part of this legislation? Like making American Schools as successful as European Schools?

[Zaras]

More to the point, this sort of juvenile foolishness is a mortal threat to the movement.

http://www.reddit.com/r/OccupyCleveland ... descended/

It's a case study in how to destroy the occupy movement. By turning towards inward disputes, and neglecting the sorts of activities that can create a durable movement.

Say what you will about the old people playing dress up, they at least crossed the organizational divide. Occupy has to do that, and camping out isn't going to achieve that.

Somebody needs to be forced to read A Force More Powerful, stat.

[Hippostania]

1:20 a.m. Occupiers chanting "This is what a police state looks like."

If this what a police state looks like, I'd be very glad and proud to live in a one. Supporting things the OWS wants (public healthcare and welfare, excessive taxation and other punishments for the rich) is unamerican and against the very basics of the US Constitution.

People wanting the government to steal wealth and resources from rich people simply because they are rich isn't ''anti-democratic''?
Hint: Democracy =/= mob rule

You really have no idea of what democracy is if you think a progressive tax system is "anti-democratic" if that is the case then the United Kingdom and most of Europe is an authoritarian dictatorship, people have the right to protest for economic change peacefully any movement against this is against the principles of freedom and democracy.

You are partially correct. Progressive taxation is immoral, and for this reason you could consider European countries as dictatorships. For example, Finland is a welfare state where there is progressive taxation and the taxes are generally very high. No wonder that we have the highest suicide rates in the world!

I'm listening to the police scanner atm.

Link plox.

[Zaras]

1:20 a.m. Occupiers chanting "This is what a police state looks like."

If this what a police state looks like, I'd be very glad and proud to live in a one. Supporting things the OWS wants (public healthcare and welfare, excessive taxation and other punishments for the rich) is unamerican and against the very basics of the US Constitution.

I'm sorry, I missed the Constitutional amendment that says "The United States of America shall be a state only for the Rich, who have most certainly Got Theirs, and all those other Poor cockroaches who Don't, well, we don't Care about them."

[Hippostania]

If this what a police state looks like, I'd be very glad and proud to live in a one. Supporting things the OWS wants (public healthcare and welfare, excessive taxation and other punishments for the rich) is unamerican and against the very basics of the US Constitution.

I'm sorry, I missed the Constitutional amendment that says "The United States of America shall be a state only for the Rich, who have most certainly Got Theirs, and all those other Poor cockroaches who Don't, well, we don't Care about them."

United States was founded on ''pursuit for happiness''. It's your own job to pursue your happiness, not the government's. That's why America should never have a public welfare of healthcare system; it is NOT the government's business.

Oh, and before someone tells me that not all OWS protestors are leftists - wrong. Almost all of them are. How do I know? Because I was in Zucotti Park last month and talked to the people there. Almost all of them were some kind of teenage anarchists or socialists who want to change America into something America is not supposed to be. Seriously. I don't like these people at all. The guy on the right especially just kept calling bankers ''criminals'' with no clear reason.

[Zaras]

I'm sorry, I missed the Constitutional amendment that says "The United States of America shall be a state only for the Rich, who have most certainly Got Theirs, and all those other Poor cockroaches who Don't, well, we don't Care about them."

United States was founded on ''pursuit for happiness''. It's your own job to pursue your happiness, not the government's. That's why America should never have a public welfare of healthcare system; it is NOT the government's business.

I disagree there, so I'll leave it at that. I think it's obvious we both have quite entrenched opinions, no point starting an argument...

[Cosmopoles]

It's much easier to talk when someone wearing riot gear isn't chasing you. Besides - OWS already told the Government to re-enact Glass-Steagal, something most Americans support. If the Government can't even manage that, what's the point of telling you guys more coherent ideas?

They could try coming up with an idea that isn't as pointless as reintroducing a law that didn't prevent banking crises when it existed, doesn't prevent banks becoming too big to fail and wouldn't have stopped banks from making or investing in high risk mortgages.

[Hippostania]

United States was founded on ''pursuit for happiness''. It's your own job to pursue your happiness, not the government's. That's why America should never have a public welfare of healthcare system; it is NOT the government's business.

I disagree there, so I'll leave it at that. I think it's obvious we both have quite entrenched opinions, no point starting an argument...

Look. If these protestors love the European welfare states so much, why can't they move there? Why do they must try to change America, an unique nation where one may still pursue happiness and liberty without government intervention into a generic welfare state where the taxes are high and people are limited by useless regulations? America is not a welfare state, and it will never be. Protests like this are unamerican.

[Zaras]

I disagree there, so I'll leave it at that. I think it's obvious we both have quite entrenched opinions, no point starting an argument...

Look. If these protestors love the European welfare states so much, why can't they move there?

Because if everybody with different ideas just decided to flee their countries and settle elsewhere, countries would stagnate?

And yeah, I know it's hard for me to answer this question without sounding hypocritical.

[Hippostania]

Look. If these protestors love the European welfare states so much, why can't they move there?

Because if everybody with different ideas just decided to flee their countries and settle elsewhere, countries would stagnate?

And yeah, I know it's hard for me to answer this question without sounding hypocritical.

The thing is, there are already tons of boring, socialist welfare states in Europe but there is only one America. There is only one nation in the world where one may be free, where one may fail and succeed based on their own merits and where one may enjoy the fruits of one's labor without government's interference.
I always hear liberals talking about ''how we should respect other cultures''. Well then, how about you guys start respecting American culture and stop trying to change it? Sometimes these people remind me of conquistadors, they're trying to replace the American culture and replace it something else because they think it's ''better''

[Zaras]

Because if everybody with different ideas just decided to flee their countries and settle elsewhere, countries would stagnate?

And yeah, I know it's hard for me to answer this question without sounding hypocritical.

The thing is, there are already tons of boring, socialist welfare states in Europe but there is only one America. There is only one nation in the world where one may be free, where one may fail and succeed based on their own merits and where one may enjoy the fruits of one's labor without government's interference.
I always hear liberals talking about ''how we should respect other cultures''. Well then, how about you guys start respecting American culture and stop trying to change it? Sometimes these people remind me of conquistadors, they're trying to replace the American culture and replace it something else because they think it's ''better''

Not everybody shares the assumption that American culture is 100% perfect. And in the past there were parts of it that did need changing. So that might be a sort of precedent...

[Hippostania]

The thing is, there are already tons of boring, socialist welfare states in Europe but there is only one America. There is only one nation in the world where one may be free, where one may fail and succeed based on their own merits and where one may enjoy the fruits of one's labor without government's interference.
I always hear liberals talking about ''how we should respect other cultures''. Well then, how about you guys start respecting American culture and stop trying to change it? Sometimes these people remind me of conquistadors, they're trying to replace the American culture and replace it something else because they think it's ''better''

Not everybody shares the assumption that American culture is 100% perfect. And in the past there were parts of it that did need changing. So that might be a sort of precedent...

American culture isn't 100% perfect, but that's no reason to abandon it for a generic welfare state that would only hurt everyone in the long run.

[Zaras]

American culture isn't 100% perfect, but that's no reason to abandon it for a generic welfare state that would only hurt everyone in the long run.

I don't believe welfare states hurt everybody in the long run.

Also, I should stop 'cos I'm starting to feel guilty about us two starting to dominate this page of the thread...

[Hippostania]

American culture isn't 100% perfect, but that's no reason to abandon it for a generic welfare state that would only hurt everyone in the long run.

I don't believe welfare states hurt everybody in the long run.

Also, I should stop 'cos I'm starting to feel guilty about us two starting to dominate this page of the thread...

Yes it does. You seem to think that it is justified for the government to steal people's wealth and redistribute it. Government has no right to do that. And that's what America was founded on, freedom from government opression.

[Zaras]

I don't believe welfare states hurt everybody in the long run.

Also, I should stop 'cos I'm starting to feel guilty about us two starting to dominate this page of the thread...

Yes it does. You seem to think that it is justified for the government to steal people's wealth and redistribute it. Government has no right to do that. And that's what America was founded on, freedom from government opression.

Honestly, I know equality of outcome is harder to guarantee, so I usually just focus on equality of opportunity.

[Voerdeland]

I disagree there, so I'll leave it at that. I think it's obvious we both have quite entrenched opinions, no point starting an argument...

Look. If these protestors love the European welfare states so much, why can't they move there? Why do they must try to change America, an unique nation where one may still pursue happiness and liberty without government intervention into a generic welfare state where the taxes are high and people are limited by useless regulations? America is not a welfare state, and it will never be. Protests like this are unamerican.

North Korea is the last totalitarian country in the world! They shouldn't change their system!!!!
/Not an argument

Exactly. You are against the constitutional right of people to protest peacefully because you don't like the goals of the protesters. That is anti-democratic and against freedom of speech.

People wanting the government to steal wealth and resources from rich people simply because they are rich isn't ''anti-democratic''?
Hint: Democracy =/= mob rule

You value property rights more than personal freedom, and you still pretend to love liberty Government should serve the interests and protect the rights of the people, not of some small minority. Otherwise it's aristocracy, not democracy.

[Shadowlandistan]

Fuck Bloomberg. Thankfully the NY Courts have just let the protesters back in Zuccotti Park. Bloomberg should resign/be kicked out of office ASAP, one of the WORST NYC mayors in the history of NYC.