Your view on The EU

[Alyakia]

Let's ask Basque Country and Algeria their views on this matter.

Correct me if I'm wrong but a brief investigating tells me that Algeria became independent in the 50s (and the populace predictably celebrated by murdering each other) and the Basque have mostly autonomy in Spain and face discrimination in France such as 'having to learn French' and other atrocities.

Am I missing something here?

And how did Algeria become independent? (hurrrr typical africans amirite)

Are you saying that France doesn't have horrible language policies?

[Shaoyuan]

Correct me if I'm wrong but a brief investigating tells me that Algeria became independent in the 50s (and the populace predictably celebrated by murdering each other) and the Basque have mostly autonomy in Spain and face discrimination in France such as 'having to learn French' and other atrocities.

Am I missing something here?

And how did Algeria become independent? (hurrrr typical africans amirite)

Are you saying that France doesn't have horrible language policies?

By waging war so it says here, sad but the whole world was totally fucked during the Cold War era.

And I don't know much about French language policies but I don't see how forcing the Basque to learn French is such a great scandal for Europe.

[Alyakia]

And how did Algeria become independent? (hurrrr typical africans amirite)

Are you saying that France doesn't have horrible language policies?

By waging war so it says here, sad but the whole world was totally fucked during the Cold War era.

And I don't know much about French language policies but I don't see how forcing the Basque to learn French is such a great scandal for Europe.

A few hundred thousands deaths, maybe a million or so if you trust Algeria. A few massacres here, some torture there. Occasionally trying to turn France into a military junta. No biggie really. Just the Cold War. I'm not sure what the big players in the Cold War actuall did during that war, but...

It's just a continuation of how shittily they treated German speakers in the land they gained "back then". They are not good with minorities in general. Never have been. And they aren't taking huge strides forward at any rate.

[Trixiestan]

And I don't know much about French language policies but I don't see how forcing the Basque to learn French is such a great scandal for Europe.

Because the French tried to completely Francophy (isthatevenaword) them. Imagine being a minority in a country which forces its own language and culture onto you while banning yours.

[Shaoyuan]

By waging war so it says here, sad but the whole world was totally fucked during the Cold War era.

And I don't know much about French language policies but I don't see how forcing the Basque to learn French is such a great scandal for Europe.

A few hundred thousands deaths, maybe a million or so if you trust Algeria. A few massacres here, some torture there. Occasionally trying to turn France into a military junta. No biggie really. Just the Cold War. I'm not sure what the big players in the Cold War actuall did during that war, but...

It's just a continuation of how shittily they treated German speakers in the land they gained "back then". They are not good with minorities in general.

What the great players did? Try knock over dozens of sovereign nations, start a few dozen civil wars, but I guess that's no big deal because France, in the amazingly enlightened post war period waged one bloody war and then surrendered Algeria afterwards. A pox on all Europe!

I agree France isn't much good with minorities but what to do? I still don't see how Europe was done even close to half the shit the US has done in the last 50 years.

[Alyakia]

A few hundred thousands deaths, maybe a million or so if you trust Algeria. A few massacres here, some torture there. Occasionally trying to turn France into a military junta. No biggie really. Just the Cold War. I'm not sure what the big players in the Cold War actuall did during that war, but...

It's just a continuation of how shittily they treated German speakers in the land they gained "back then". They are not good with minorities in general.

What the great players did? Try knock over dozens of sovereign nations, start a few dozen civil wars, but I guess that's no big deal because France, in the amazingly enlightened post war period waged one bloody war and then surrendered Algeria afterwards. A pox on all Europe!

I agree France isn't much good with minorities but what to do? I still don't see how Europe was done even close to half the shit the US has done in the last 50 years.

I meant during the Algerian War. I'm well aware of the shit the U.S. and the Soviets did in general.

Hey, I'm all for a united Europe, but downplaying French atrocities doesn't play that well for you. Just sayin'.

[Trixiestan]

Correct me if I'm wrong but a brief investigating tells me that Algeria became independent in the 50s (and the populace predictably celebrated by murdering each other) and the Basque have mostly autonomy in Spain and face discrimination in France such as 'having to learn French' and other atrocities.

Am I missing something here?

Nope, and I tell you this as a Spaniard.

Also, unofficial polls carried out in the Basque country show that the majority of the population favours Madrid.

An unofficial referendum in Catalonia stated that a lot of people wouldn't mind being independent in Catalonia.

What if Catalonia wanted to become an independent nation?

[Shaoyuan]

What the great players did? Try knock over dozens of sovereign nations, start a few dozen civil wars, but I guess that's no big deal because France, in the amazingly enlightened post war period waged one bloody war and then surrendered Algeria afterwards. A pox on all Europe!

I agree France isn't much good with minorities but what to do? I still don't see how Europe was done even close to half the shit the US has done in the last 50 years.

I meant during the Algerian War. I'm well aware of the shit the U.S. and the Soviets did in general.

Hey, I'm all for a united Europe, but downplaying French atrocities doesn't play that well for you. Just sayin'.

I guess you're right, but I see no evidence that modern Europe as a whole has done anything to deserve being tarred as authoritarian and bloodthirsty. The new stories I hear coming out of France, Italy etc in regards to immigration are disappointing, I admit, but like I said I don't think they define the whole character of the region.

[Keronians]

Nope, and I tell you this as a Spaniard.

Also, unofficial polls carried out in the Basque country show that the majority of the population favours Madrid.

An unofficial referendum in Catalonia stated that a lot of people wouldn't mind being independent in Catalonia.

What if Catalonia wanted to become an independent nation?

Yes, I've seen that.

They didn't hold it in the entire country.

What if it wanted to be it?

Then it can want all it likes. It's not going to get independence.

[Trixiestan]

An unofficial referendum in Catalonia stated that a lot of people wouldn't mind being independent in Catalonia.

What if Catalonia wanted to become an independent nation?

Yes, I've seen that.

They didn't hold it in the entire country.

What if it wanted to be it?

Then it can want all it likes. It's not going to get independence.

But, theoretically let's say the majority of people in Catalonia wanted to be independent; what then?

Yes, seccession is illegal in Spain, but would Spain really try and stop it? Even if ment alienating the majority of the people in the region?

[Radictistan]

It was a good thing at first but now it has greatly overstepped its bounds. It should have remained an economic union and not tried to become a political insitution.

[Keronians]

Yes, I've seen that.

They didn't hold it in the entire country.

What if it wanted to be it?

Then it can want all it likes. It's not going to get independence.

But, theoretically let's say the majority of people in Catalonia wanted to be independent; what then?

Yes, seccession is illegal in Spain, but would Spain really try and stop it? Even if ment alienating the majority of the people in the region?

Yes.

Catalonia is already pretty autonomous. Spain is more decentralised than even the US.

It is sort of like how Greenland was before 2009.

If they tried to secede? Yes, we would send in the military.

[Shaoyuan]

Nope, and I tell you this as a Spaniard.

Also, unofficial polls carried out in the Basque country show that the majority of the population favours Madrid.

An unofficial referendum in Catalonia stated that a lot of people wouldn't mind being independent in Catalonia.

What if Catalonia wanted to become an independent nation?

A poll run by separatists directed at separatists showed that the target group desired independence? What a surprise.

[Keronians]

It was a good thing at first but now it has greatly overstepped its bounds. It should have remained an economic union and not tried to become a political insitution.

Why?

The aim of establishing a union was always a federation. To do so, a political union is also necessary.

[Trixiestan]

But, theoretically let's say the majority of people in Catalonia wanted to be independent; what then?

Yes, seccession is illegal in Spain, but would Spain really try and stop it? Even if ment alienating the majority of the people in the region?

Yes.

Catalonia is already pretty autonomous. Spain is more decentralised than even the US.

It is sort of like how Greenland was before 2009.

If they tried to secede? Yes, we would send in the military.

That'd just make the situation worse though. :/

[Keronians]

Yes.

Catalonia is already pretty autonomous. Spain is more decentralised than even the US.

It is sort of like how Greenland was before 2009.

If they tried to secede? Yes, we would send in the military.

That'd just make the situation worse though. :/

It didn't in the US.

Traitors attempting to challenge the legitimate government of Spain, and its rightful monarch will be crushed. The loyal citizens of Catalonia will be protected and shall remain a part of Spain.

Of course, there are many factors to consider before rolling in the tanks (the Art of War's waging warfare chapter rings a bell), but if it was deemed possible, then we would not hesitate to crush the rebellion.

[Greed and Death]

Let's ask Basque Country and Algeria their views on this matter.

Correct me if I'm wrong but a brief investigating tells me that Algeria became independent in the 50s (and the populace predictably celebrated by murdering each other) and the Basque have mostly autonomy in Spain and face discrimination in France such as 'having to learn French' and other atrocities.

Am I missing something here?

Having to learn French?!?! that is too cruel for even the French.

[Jello Biafra]

It's not perfect, but it's a small step in the right direction.

[Alyakia]

That'd just make the situation worse though. :/

It didn't in the US.

Traitors attempting to challenge the legitimate government of Spain, and its rightful monarch will be crushed. The loyal citizens of Catalonia will be protected and shall remain a part of Spain.

Of course, there are many factors to consider before rolling in the tanks (the Art of War's waging warfare chapter rings a bell), but if it was deemed possible, then we would not hesitate to crush the rebellion.

It didn't in the U.S.? I hope you aren't reffering to the American Civil War, because that very easily qualifies as "worse". (Not that something that happened in 1861 is a good example. To take a more recent example, and a closer one, I imagine many would probably consider the several military deployments in Ireland and the results to also be examples of things getting "worse".)

[Jafas United]

I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out to be the Fourth Reich or the Soviet Union v.2

No, but seriously. The EU was originally meant to be a trading bloc between western European nations. Now it is a superstate with common borders, a parliament, common licence plates and so on. Now it is anything but a trading bloc.

Thank God the Russians are smart enough to see through all this and not sign up it.

[Sorratsin]

It's not perfect, but it's a small step in the right direction.

Pretty much this.

Although as a coin collector, I am somewhat pissed that so many coins got obliterated so quickly.

[Alyakia]

I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out to be the Fourth Reich or the Soviet Union v.2

No, but seriously. The EU was originally meant to be a trading bloc between western European nations. Now it is a superstate with common borders, a parliament, common licence plates and so on. Now it is anything but a trading bloc.

Thank God the Russians are smart enough to see through all this and not sign up it.

Yes, this "union" of democratic nations is probably gonna end up the Fourth Reich. Why? BRUSEELS.

Licence plates? Is that the scariest thing?

I don't know. I think there might be other reasons Russia hasn't joined. Just a hunch.

[Jafas United]

I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out to be the Fourth Reich or the Soviet Union v.2

No, but seriously. The EU was originally meant to be a trading bloc between western European nations. Now it is a superstate with common borders, a parliament, common licence plates and so on. Now it is anything but a trading bloc.

Thank God the Russians are smart enough to see through all this and not sign up it.

Yes, this "union" of democratic nations is probably gonna end up the Fourth Reich. Why? BRUSEELS.

Licence plates? Is that the scariest thing?

I don't know. I think there might be other reasons Russia hasn't joined. Just a hunch.

I know it won't end up as the Fourth Reich or the Soviet Union v.2. I'm just using a figure of speech. Geez, don't take everything so literally and seriously.

Anyways, licence plates aren't the scariest thing but the fact that a trading bloc has morphed itself into a quasi-nation is scary.

[-St George]

Why?

What, exactly, is so wrong with a federal Europe?

Why don't you want to be an economic and military superpower? Why don't you want to be larger geographically? Why don't you want to have a stronger government?

Because 800 years of British rule, then to go straight into god know how many years of European Rule?? People want a sovereign Ireland!

You have a sovereign Ireland. The Republic. The North didn't want that, and still doesn't.

[-St George]

As for the referendum; secession is illegal in Spain.

Why does Spain hate freedom?