How would you calm down the town halll protesters

[Bottle]

Indeed, I was having this conversation with the girlfriend last night. Republicans will always be republicans and democrats will always be democrats. Elections are won and lost in this country by the whims of the moderates who share some beliefs with both parties.

And at the end of the day, this tactic shows that the republicans don't have ideas, don't have their own views. It reeks of desperation, and the inability to actually have a plan for america's future.

And i believe people will figure this out.

I keep repeating this, because it keeps being true:

The town hall protesters are a political failure because they propose precisely nothing.

They scream NO NO NO NO NO NO NO at reform...yet that means they are arguing for us to keep the system we have.

And Americans are pretty much agreed that our current system is broken. People want change.

If the Republicans proposed something, if they had any alternative to offer, they'd probably win. The Democrats are inept to such a degree that I seriously believe they will manage to lose to ANY semi-cogent idea that the Republicans put forward.

The fact that Republicans are not only not putting any ideas forward, but are actually trying to claim that their aggressive lack of any ideas is a POSITIVE, is absolutely mind-blowing to me. It's like they've decided they don't feel like winning any more. Which, hey, fine by me. But still weird to watch.

[Marcuslandia]

Do you know what I find odd? The Republicans proposed a bill that Congressmen would have to adopt the public health care plan that they were practically forcing on everyone else. The Democrats turned it down.

As did about 3/4 of the Republicans as well (43 for; 131 against).

[German Capitalists]

The basic progression of the Public Health Care option would be to blot out Private Health Care by putting them out of business.

[Bottle]

Your absolutely right! It's the Pro-Healthcare People who follow the sacred word of Obama that have the ideas! Democrats good, Republicans bad. Capitalism evil, Free stuff good!

I find it funny that you are incapable of realizing that just because someone doesn't like the Republicans they don't necessarily worship the Democrats. Are you incapable of understanding that there are usually more than 2 possible positions?

Speaking from experience interacting with that poster:

Yes. Yes, he is incapable of understanding that.

The fact that I badmouth Democrats loudly and frequently around here never stops the wingnuts from claiming that I'm an Obama-worshipper.

Hint to the crazies: I didn't vote for him.

[Bottle]

The basic progression of the Public Health Care option would be to blot out Private Health Care by putting them out of business.

Which only makes sense if you assert that Private Health Care won't be able to compete with the Public option.

And, as a capitalist, I say that if the Private companies can't compete, they deserve to be out of business.

[Bottle]

Do you know what I find odd? The Republicans proposed a bill that Congressmen would have to adopt the public health care plan that they were practically forcing on everyone else. The Democrats turned it down.

As did about 2/3 of the Republicans as well (64 for; 114 against).

ZOMG 2/3RDS OF REPUBLICANS ARE OBAMA-WORSHIPPERS!!!

[Sdaeriji]

Do you know what I find odd? The Republicans proposed a bill that Congressmen would have to adopt the public health care plan that they were practically forcing on everyone else. The Democrats turned it down.

Do you know what I find odd? That people manage to spew the same uninformed moronic horseshit about "forcing" anything.

[German Capitalists]

The current system is much better then UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE! People say how the Government is a failure and yet they want to put their health in the hands of the Government?!

[Neo Art]

The basic progression of the Public Health Care option would be to blot out Private Health Care by putting them out of business.

Then why does Britain have a private insurance industry?

The problem is, and what some people (mainly the right) don't realize, is that public health care is not a new thing. It's not some strange invention that's never been tried before. We're not getting our directions from parchment map labeled "beyond here there be monsters".

Many many countries have public health care. And all those boogeymen that the right claims to have happened...haven't. They haven't gone bankrupt, their health care costs haven't skyrocketted (they on average go down actually), they haven't put private insurance out of business.

It's a very strange political system where a political movement can spew flag waiving "America, FUCK YEAH!" jingoism with one side of their mouths, and argue that we're so fucking incompetent that we can't manage what pretty much every other major world power has managed with the other.

[Marcuslandia]

Do you know what I find odd? The Republicans proposed a bill that Congressmen would have to adopt the public health care plan that they were practically forcing on everyone else. The Democrats turned it down.

prove it. What's the name of the bill? What's its source?

Just to be "fair and balanced" (unlike Fox News):
http://www.nowpublic.com/world/hr615-co ... hey-create

[Kynchile]

The fact that Republicans are not only not putting any ideas forward, but are actually trying to claim that their aggressive lack of any ideas is a POSITIVE, is absolutely mind-blowing to me. It's like they've decided they don't feel like winning any more. Which, hey, fine by me. But still weird to watch.

Thats wierd because the conservatives are winning. Do you think they need the Republicans vote? I'll answer for you; they don't. The democrats have the majority in the house and senate. When we see a healthcare bill introduced it will be minus the public option and have some very good ideas from the right side of the aisle. Such as "portable" private insurance, healthcare coops, and more employer based healthcare accounts.

[Sdaeriji]

The basic progression of the Public Health Care option would be to blot out Private Health Care by putting them out of business.

Much like UPS and FedEx have been put out of business by the USPS, correct? Because private enterprise can never find a niche in a service that the government provides where people are willing to pay for a better option, correct? Because private insurers are currently being driven out of business by Medicare, correct?

[Capfrania]

Wow... Just wow... Could someone please explain to me how they are not being peaceful? I haven't seen any fire fights or knife battles. I haven't seen any suicide bombers or massacres. All I've seen is protests where they might raise their voice but other then that, just openly disagree and make use of their right to Freedom of Speech. Are Liberals at the stage of such pettiness that they not only oppose, let's see... War, Torture, Capitalism, Republicans, The 2nd Amendment, The Founding Fathers, Big Business, Responsibility, and Anyone who disagrees with them but now they oppose open protest as well and Freedom of Speech? I faintly remember Democrats openly protesting Bush to the point of absurdity calling him Hitler, a Nazi, a Fascist, Evil, The Lover of Osama Bin Laden, The Devil, an idiot, a retard, the origin of all evil in the world. Oh, protesting Bush is your patriotic duty but protesting anything that Obama demands is un-american and evil. I see now.

I've seen pro-healthcare bill people beating up protesters and attacking a random black man selling merchandise on a corner. But yelling is un-peaceful for the protesters.

Is that the SEIU YouTube? If it is, it's completely impossible to tell what happened there because the camera starts filming moments AFTER the altercation, and does not clearly show anything other than people yelling at each other and pointing others out to the police, who seem to arrest everyone involved.

Yeah, I've seen that, too. Unless there's more video of earlier in that incident, we'll never really know what happened and we'll be subjected to endless bouts of he-said-she-said. Which sucks.

I've read seen some witness testimony as well, but I guess that's still he said she said. That guy wasn't even a protester, though, he was just selling crap on the corner.

[Neo Art]

The basic progression of the Public Health Care option would be to blot out Private Health Care by putting them out of business.

Which only makes sense if you assert that Private Health Care won't be able to compete with the Public option.

And, as a capitalist, I say that if the Private companies can't compete, they deserve to be out of business.

which is a whole other level of "talking out of both sides of your mouth at once". Somehow uttering both "businesses that can't survive should fail" along with "but wont someone please think of the poor insurance companies?" at the same time.

[UnhealthyTruthseeker]

The current system is much better then UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE! People say how the Government is a failure and yet they want to put their health in the hands of the Government?!

No one is proposing universal health care. People are proposing a public option. That you and many others in this country are incapable of telling the difference is, in and of itself, rather revealing.

[Sdaeriji]

The basic progression of the Public Health Care option would be to blot out Private Health Care by putting them out of business.

Then why does Britain have a private insurance industry?

The problem is, and what some people (mainly the right) don't realize, is that public health care is not a new thing. It's not some strange invention that's never been tried before. We're not getting our directions from parchment map labeled "beyond here there be monsters".

Many many countries have public health care. And all those boogeymen that the right claims to have happened...haven't. They haven't gone bankrupt, their health care costs haven't skyrocketted (they on average go down actually), they haven't put private insurance out of business.

It's a very strange political system where a political movement can spew flag waiving "America, FUCK YEAH!" jingoism with one side of their mouths, and argue that we're so fucking incompetent that we can't manage what pretty much every other major world power has managed with the other.

You misspelled "thar".

[German Capitalists]

Do you know what I find odd? The Republicans proposed a bill that Congressmen would have to adopt the public health care plan that they were practically forcing on everyone else. The Democrats turned it down.

Do you know what I find odd? That people manage to spew the same uninformed moronic horseshit about "forcing" anything.

Do you know what I find odd? That humanity has managed to survive for this long when it has idiots like you in various Governments around the world.

[Antilon]

I'd say Listen you didn't set up an appointment and other people want peace so shut your trap and be civilized. That should shut them up

I'd hold the townhall meetings on NSG where the mods can keep an eye out for "impropriety". That way, people can hold a civil discussion regardless of the noise level. Unless they start a massive DoS attack, which could be blocked by holding a LAN party to hold the discussions.

I think I'm beginning to understand why I prefer forums to RL discussions...

[Lunatic Goofballs]

Fair enough. I would think that people would want to find out on their own instead of believing what the goverment is saying.

What did you do, count em?

No, I have been following this since several cities and states, especially California, have gone broke.

Many of the problems that deal with how expensive healthcare is should be solved before anymore talk of a bigger goverment run program continues.

Many of the problems with how expensive healthcare is are caused by private industry.

[Sdaeriji]

Do you know what I find odd? The Republicans proposed a bill that Congressmen would have to adopt the public health care plan that they were practically forcing on everyone else. The Democrats turned it down.

Do you know what I find odd? That people manage to spew the same uninformed moronic horseshit about "forcing" anything.

Do you know what I find odd? That humanity has managed to survive for this long when it has idiots like you in various Governments around the world.

Ah, flaming.

Do me a favor, then. Show me the part of the bill that would force everyone to take the public option. Show me the part of the bill that would outlaw private health insurance.

[Antilon]

Do you know what I find odd? The Republicans proposed a bill that Congressmen would have to adopt the public health care plan that they were practically forcing on everyone else. The Democrats turned it down.

Do you know what I find odd? That people manage to spew the same uninformed moronic horseshit about "forcing" anything.

Do you know what I find odd? That humanity has managed to survive for this long when it has idiots like you in various Governments around the world.

Whoah, toasty. *holds out hands*

[Lunatic Goofballs]

The fact that Republicans are not only not putting any ideas forward, but are actually trying to claim that their aggressive lack of any ideas is a POSITIVE, is absolutely mind-blowing to me. It's like they've decided they don't feel like winning any more. Which, hey, fine by me. But still weird to watch.

Thats wierd because the conservatives are winning. Do you think they need the Republicans vote? I'll answer for you; they don't. The democrats have the majority in the house and senate. When we see a healthcare bill introduced it will be minus the public option and have some very good ideas from the right side of the aisle. Such as "portable" private insurance, healthcare coops, and more employer based healthcare accounts.

Keep believing that. Republicans had 12 years to do healthcare reform their way. They chose to do nothing. Because that's what they stand for: Nothing.

[Bottle]

Ah, flaming.

Do me a favor, then. Show me the part of the bill that would force everyone to take the public option. Show me the part of the bill that would outlaw private health insurance.

It's not in the bill, it's actually an admission of the fact that private companies can't compete with a government health care system.

[UnhealthyTruthseeker]

It's not in the bill, it's actually an admission of the fact that private companies can't compete with a government health care system.

Except Great Britain is proof that even that admission is incorrect.

[Antilon]

It's not in the bill, it's actually an admission of the fact that private companies can't compete with a government health care system.

Except Great Britain is proof that even that admission is incorrect.

But I would that would be a result of having an actual gov'nt health care system to compete with.